Robert99

KC states that the jump was "worth $150". This presumably would be military jump pay. Does anyone know how the jump pay worked in 1946? How many jumps did he have to make to receive it? Is jump pay based on making a certain number of jumps per month? Or per quarter? And I assume it was paid at a fixed rate each month. Robert99

U ARE THE ONE WHO NEED TO READ. THE COMMUNATION IS REAL VERY VERY REAL. As for Jefferson you are asking me a question I do not know nor have I any reason to know - a prison is a prison is a prison and is a prison. Jo, You need to ask 377 about State and Federal Prisons. And who would sign a commutation in each case. You might learn something. Robert99

377 I am almost shocked that it would be hydraulic with oil. Back in the 1960-1970 era, I got a bit of experience with hydraulic flight control systems in helicopters. Cold weather and the O rings in the hardware don't get along with each other in the first place. Even in more moderate climates the O rings routinely leaked fluid and made a mess. Overhaul of these units was necessary at very frequent intervals. In a parachute, I imagine the canopy and harness would be damaged when one of these units leaked a bit. I doubt if the ripstop material used in canopies in 1971 could handle the oil. Robert99

I used to rebuild master and slave cylinders but unless you can get a mirror finish on the interior bore they wont last nearly as long as the new ones. The imperfections will abrade the O rings. How is this related to parachuting? Believe it or not at lesat one early square sport canopy had a HYDRAULIC reefing system to slow down the inflation of the canopy. It used a hydraulic cylinder as a snubber. The eventual optimal solution was just a piece of fabric with four holes in it that fit over the suspension line groups coming up from each riser, called a slider. Until the slider was invented all sorts of far out designs were tried. Who of the old timers who lurk here can tell me which rig had the hydraulic reefing system? 377 Are you sure that wasn't a pneumatic system?

The inconsistencies you find are NO different than your OWN inconsistency in posting on the subject. NO one ever says the same thing the same way. It depends on the response they are making and to what. ANY idiot know that. Frankly I have been pretty damn consistent. You could NOT even attempt to keep up with me. If I had the time I could go back to your posts here and other places and do the same thing, but my time is more valuable than picking apart you posts. Pick Pick Pick - it is not a crusade against the FBI, but to learn more and you should do a little more of that yourself instead of hanging around picking on my posts. Did I say you were an FBI agent? If I did it was because you have the same attitude - of always being right. Look how many mistakes the FBI has made. The last one made absolute fools out of them regarding KC. Seems like I have shown there were contacts and things the FBI did NOT check about Weber! They glossed over Weber and tried to make him go away, without providing the first explanation regarding his past to the public. If the public had known about the Criminal past in detail in 1996 when I contacted the FBI - there were still individuals alive who should have been contacted - but the FBI did NOT contact them. Tommy and Tony - that was 2. Nor did the FBI contact Bill in Chicago - yet they were provided with all of that information. They made no attempt until the files had been destroyed to check out Jefferson and Duane's connections to Jefferson outside of the prison. It was TOO embarrassing for the Federal Gov to admit that Jefferson had a shady past and was involved in the misuse of many files and prisoners and manpower. See what happens when you make me mad! Jefferson was a HELL HOLE and you know it. The criminal activities conducted from that prison are known. Malone tried to tell the world - but prison had done him in. I didn't find Malone until 3 months after he died....but, the FBI could have found him in 1996. All of the conflicting information I got when I contacted the prison was terrible and then Carr states Weber's criminal record on this thread AFTER the back files had been destroyed on Jefferson. That was very very deliberate. Come and listen and read - I was told Weber was NOT ever a resident...then they reduce it to a public file that shows Weber/Collins - and that did NOT explain WHY the COMMUTATION OF SENTENCE WAS GRANTED TO JOHN COLLINS AND NOT AKA DUANE L. WEBER??????? Better think More than ONE time about that COMMUTATION OF SENTENCE AND WHY! Jo, Are you claiming that Jefferson was a Federal Prison? And who issued this "commutation of sentence" that you refer to above? Robert99

From Jo's reply to Farflung: Jo, I have recently spent time on the Cooper thread (the one that is now locked) that you started here on DZ and it and your posts look about the same as this thread and your posts here. Simply pointing out the inconsistencies and inaccuracies in your posts does not constitute mocking. And not joining your crusade against the FBI and everyone who does not agree with you (which seems to be just about everyone on both Cooper threads) does not make me an FBI agent. Robert99

Jo, Contrary to your statement, a number of witnesses saw Cooper standing for a lengthy period of time. Robert99 WHO and AT WHAT period of time. The ticket agent and the waiting area to the plane do NOT count because NO one KNEW what was going to happen. Supposedly Weber went to the bathroom and the witness who purportly saw him coming out and what he was carrying and the way the was carrying it was Alice. This was only per a writer and I have NOT see any OFFICIAL FBI documents in regard to this. It was not stated if he was standing or sitting when he handed the NOTE to Florence. Quote any official DOCUMENTS you have regarding this. Jo, You are getting more silly with ever passing day! I thought you said you had stopped "smoking". Where can the OFFICIAL document stating that Duane ever mentioned Cooper to you be found? Using your logic, it wouldn't count anyway since you admittedly didn't know what he was talking about. And this was only from one "writer" [you]. Can you quote an OFFICIAL FBI document that the airliner was even hijacked in the first place? Robert99

Jo, Contrary to your statement, a number of witnesses saw Cooper standing for a lengthy period of time. Robert99

Jo, Why don't you post the addresses Duane used on his tax returns for 1969, 1970, 1971, and 1972. Also the names and addresses of the companies that provided his W-2s (or 1099) forms. Just the city and state, as well as the dates of his employment with them, would be very helpful. Leave off the money numbers, SSNs, and other such identifying information. Robert99

Maybe all of us. I live in an "over-55" housing development and my neighbors and I are all probably older than you. It looks like most of us planned ahead as you suggest. For instance, I bought a new car a couple of months ago and it even meets your requirement for a vertically adjusting driver's seat. Admittedly, it does not have leather seats as you require but that doesn't mean anything to me. I have high-speed cable internet service for the computer I am on now, a land line telephone with DSL service for another computer, a cell phone with nation-wide text, internet, and e-mail service, a large HDTV set with a satellite service that includes all the channels available through a standard package plus access to all of their pay-per-view channels. No doubt I pay a bit more for the above than you had in mind. The HDTV satellite service represents about half of the total cost of all the above services. But the end result is that I have three e-mail accounts through different ISPs, three different ways to get on the internet, two phone numbers through different providers, and can stay in touch with anyone by phone or internet throughout the USA. And frankly I don't know why you continue to complain about cars, telephones, or Internet Service Providers. As others on the thread have pointed out, all you have to do is check around a bit. AT&T is not the FBI so don't try to blame either of them for things that only you have control over. As Blevins points out, just grab the phone and ISP provider by a very sensitive portion of their anatomy and squeeze hard. Robert99

Jo, The times on the posts are assigned by the DZ clock and are Pacific Time. Your clock, if correct, should agree with it when adjusted to the Pacific Time zone. I didn't pull anyone's hair in the second or any other grade. Actually, I can understand your frustrations with your Duane Weber claims. Whether you understand it or not or will admit it or not, you do not have any evidence to back up those claims. Consequently, you are trying to sell a "Duane is Cooper" sizzle rather than something with substance. Anyone buying such a sizzle is very gullible. I prefer substance. Robert99

Jo, You continue to amaze me. You apparently feel that I should be able to read your mind. Let's take a look at your posts. Post #39603 was posted by Jo Weber at 1:14 PM with a colon (:) after "To the SEATTLE TIMES:". Jo Weber then edited that post at 3:24 PM, 2 hours and 10 minutes later. Post #39605 was posted by Mrshutter at 1:35 PM and quoted Jo Weber's post #39603 in its entirety which included the colon after the SEATTLE TIMES. Mrshutter did not edit post #39605. Post #39607 was posted by Robert99 at 2:07 PM and quoted Mrshutter's post #39605 in its entirety which included the colon after the SEATTLE TIMES. Robert99 did not edit post #39607. Post #39608 was posted by Jo Weber at 3:17 PM and was edited by Jo Weber at 4:35 PM. In this post Jo Weber makes the claims about Robert99 that are quoted at the top of this post. Just seven minutes after making post #39608, Jo Weber edited her original post #39603 to change the ":" to a "?". The rest of that post is the same as the one quoted later by Mrshutter and Robert99. So your complaining is nothing more than trying to cover up your actual meaning. And, of course, this is not the first time you have done something like this is it? Robert99

Jo, the only way the FBI can stop the media is if they place a gag order, they have not done this on the Cooper case.... TO THE SEATTLE TIMES: You can also ignore any e-mails and/or other information from Jo Weber. She is, by her own statement, delusional and worse, and for 17+ years has been trying to prove that her late husband, Duane Weber, was the Cooper hijacker. If he were Cooper, this would make Jo Weber the hijacker's wife or Mrs. D. B. Cooper, a title she has used in the past and would be overjoyed to discover that it is true. In her 17+ years of researching her late husband, Mrs. Weber has not found anything that connects him to the hijacking. However, she has found that he had a 500+ page FBI file with 27+ known arrests. Robert99

Even if you don't, this is IMHO the best all-around evidence on the jump point. That said, then you can determine approximately where the plane was on the flight path at 8:12-8:13. Then...establish possible landing zones based on two different parameters: 1) Pulls ripcord right off the stairs. In my opinion, this is more likely due to the load Cooper was carrying. 2) Jump from stairs, freefall, then a pull. 3) Third possibility: no pull and a less-than-gentle landing. Using the wind direction and windspeed, you could probably narrow down three different landing zones, and maybe within LESS than a square mile. Who knows? Maybe a lot less. I suppose one big point is when you are doing this, you will have to trust the FBI's flight path and timeline. These would all be educated guesses, of course. And nothing else should be read into them. Post enlarged maps of all three areas on a web page, with the data used to create them. There are no guarantees here. It's just that I think people should know about this stuff. Just in case they decide to look. If you think about it, even at a square mile each, this narrows a total search area to around 1,900 acres max...which is still a lot less than half of SW Washington. If your calculations narrow it down further, so much the better. Blevins, That 8:12 time above is just the TIME and not the JUMP geographical location. If you trust the times and their locations given on the FBI's map track, then please answer the following simple questions: 1. How does the airliner manage to fly six miles between some minute marks and then only three miles between other adjacent minute marks? All the while, the airliner was cruising at a constant speed. 2. Where did the time marks come from and why is one missing? 3. Where did the information for the flight track come from and what is its accuracy? About three years ago, I wrote some short articles, including some on the validity of the FBI's times and the flight track, and the last I heard these articles were still available on Sluggo's web page. Robert99

_________________________________________________ Blevins is uninformed, but he continues to talk like an expert. He doesn't even know the basic facts of the case, and yet he can't shut his big mouth. I think it's time to boycott this idiot. MeyerLouie NOTE TO BLEVINS: Take a good look at the FBI's estimated jump point map that is available on Sluggo's web page. Use the same assumptions that you have stated in earlier posts today, then explain how only a one square mile area is to be searched. And exactly who would determine which one square mile area? And you also speak of other one square mile areas for other assumed jump points. You might give some attention to the winds aloft, the altitude of Cooper's opening the parachute, the ground elevation at your specified point, etc. Using your approach, you are basically suggesting that the entire southern Washington area be searched. Robert99

Blevins writes: There is going to be a certain amount of guesswork involved determining any possible landing locations. R99 replies: And just who is going to do the guessing? Blevins writes: Placard: I don't believe you'll find Cooper or any artifacts near where the placard was discovered. Occam might say the placard flew away the moment the airstairs were opened. R99 replies: Isn't the placard an artifact in this respect? And what does that last sentence mean? Blevins writes: We know the stairs only dropped 24-36" after they were opened. So...*surprise* for Cooper. Jet is moving along at three miles a minute or so. You need to know how long between the first moment the indicator light came on...and then later, when it flashed off and then back on for good...for that moment on the engineer's panel. That would most likely be the jump point. R99 replies: Could you amplify on just exactly what is logical about the above comments? Blevins writes: Sure, this is nothing new. But in order to create some possibles within reason, you have to come to certain agreements even if some of it is guesswork to a degree. R99 replies: Whose "possibles within reason" and what "certain agreements even if some of it is guesswork to a degree"? Blevins, You are only trying to substitute your judgment for the judgment of other people. Basically, the only thing needed is the geographical position of the point where Cooper jumped. If you actually know the flight path and the time Cooper jumped, then the problem is essentially solved. Unfortunately, neither is known with the required accuracy so other means must be used. Robert99

Right... unmodified. You would not have found many of those around a dropzone at the time. First stop would have been the rigging loft to add and subtract "stuff" from the harness AND the container to make it into the typical "cheapo" back in the day. ( I had several and I STILL have several in my "loft") In the late 1960s, I regularly flew a sports aircraft that had an extremely tight fitting cockpit. A standard 28 foot backpack parachute was extremely uncomfortable in that cockpit and some flight times were in the 6 to 7 hour time range. So I told my problems to a rigger and he spent a month or two just finding an NB-6 for me. And the day he found it, we popped it and he gave me a list of things to do to the container to improve the comfort. I followed his instructions and still owned the chute in early November 1971 when it was included in the sale of the aircraft that I had been flying with it. D.B. Cooper was only a week or two later. Robert99

Blevins, You claiming others are cherry picking? Please! And you also saying that the FBI is right about the flight path? Are they right about KC? Maybe you and Jo Weber should join forces on these matters. Robert99

If he went in as a no pull the stainless steel ripcord cable would last for centuries. If he pulled and tossed the ripcord, same outcome, but harder to find if separated from the harness and container. The cadmium plated metal hardware on the Navy harness would be intact for far longer than Cooper has been missing. Hard to say about the fabric material since its longevity can vary so much in different environments. UV rips that stuff up fast. 377 UV in a mixed Alder-Douglas Fir- Western Hemlock-Western Red Cedar FOREST in the Pacific NorthWET???? The harness and even a good percentage of the canopy would be quite fine thank you. is any metal on the canopy? again still very hard to locate after so much time has passed..... Starting at the harness and working up to the pilot chute, the four risers would be connected to the harness by seperable links, which you could consider to be either part of the canopy system or the harness. Personnel in the Portland area have told me that the NB-6 Cooper used had the shroud lines sewn to the risers, so no seperable links would be used there. Thus the only metal associated with the actual canopy would be in the pilot chute. This would include the normal pilot chute spring and a small "pyramid" type stud attachment that is mounted at the very bottom of the pilot chute and, when the pilot chute spring is completely compressed, this stud projects through the center of the spring and emerges out the top of the pilot chute. The compressed spring is then placed on top of the folded canopy and the stud projects through both flaps of the container and is locked in place by the third pin in the rip cord. The NB-6 parachute cannot open under normal circumstances unless the rip cord is pulled. Robert99

R99 replies: From the above it might be a good idea for Blevins to look at the data. Something else was found. Can you name it? On the matter of the brief case and the "bomb", of what use were they to Cooper once Tina went to the cockpit? Would "absolutely nothing" be a reasonable answer? On the matter of drop zones, what is the location of the one you are referring to? Search anywhere you want, but you won't find Cooper without looking at his actual jump point. Your whole jump zone scenario reminds me of a story from, I think, a book by Carlos Castenada. On the last two or three pages of that book (pages 125-127, I believe), Castenada explains that the characters in his book didn't find the cities of gold, for which they had been searching, because those cities never existed in the first place. Castenada then explains that they DID find a beautiful place to search for their dreams. Dream on. Robert99

Fossett was found one year and approximately one week after he disappeared. Only a very small bone portion of the body was found but it apparently was enough for DNA testing. As Mrshutter points out, if you want to find more of Fossett you are going to have to locate some animal dens first. Fossett crashed when he flew into a severe downdraft that he could not escape horizontally (he was quite low with respect to the local terrain) and could not climb out of vertically (he was about 10,000 feet ASL). Robert99

If he went in as a no pull the stainless steel ripcord cable would last for centuries. If he pulled and tossed the ripcord, same outcome, but harder to find if separated from the harness and container. The cadmium plated metal hardware on the Navy harness would be intact for far longer than Cooper has been missing. Hard to say about the fabric material since its longevity can vary so much in different environments. UV rips that stuff up fast. 377 understood, my main problem with the metal was the amount or size of the metals left after years of exposure making it very difficult to find with a metal detector as Robert suggested, using a metal detector looking for a ripcord in a large area would be pointless if not impossible The NB-6 parachute assembly alone has about two pounds of metal that will react to a metal detector. In addition to the metal in the parachute assembly, Cooper also had a pocket knife, which he apparently routinely carried, a belt buckle, and other metal in his clothing and shoes. Presumably, Cooper put the NB-6 parachute over his raincoat. If Cooper was a no-pull, it is reasonable to expect that the raincoat, parachute, and other clothing, would keep at least some of the major bones contained in a small area for quite a while. If the money bag was made out of a durable material and tied to the harness, as well as Cooper's waist, then portions of it should survive for a lengthy time also (forget about the money, it is gone). In reality, you would be looking for a relatively large amount of metal in a fairly small area (about 2 by 3 feet). I have been assured by a leading metal detector company that all of their current metal detectors (as sold to hobbyists) could locate this under more than one foot of soil. For where Cooper might have impacted, see previous posts on the constraints concerning how the money could have gotten to Tena Bar. There is no need to search fifty square miles or so. Robert99

Show me where I say on this thread I'm a 'Cooper expert'. I often direct peoples' questions on this forum to the people who have studied the case in-depth. Mostly I send them to Sluggo or Georger, for example. The main reason I avoided reading the books on Cooper, and went for the news articles and FBI PDF's instead was simple. I didn't want any preconceived notions from other authors before putting Blast together. You start doing that, you also begin trying to fit pegs into holes that don't fit...to make your evidence look better. Contrary to popular belief, I try not to do that. If you want to call that type of research pathetic, be my guest. On a matter of point, I have created nearly 500 illustrated articles for my Newsvine column in the last six years. Many of them were heavily researched beforehand...and a few are considered to be THE article on a particular subject. Some about NASA, a six-parter on missing adventurer Steve Fossett, and one on the Buddy Holly crash, to name just a few. The KC job was just another research project to me, the only difference being I had to go out into the real world to do much of the research, and the interviews. I've also edited just over fifty books, and written several of my own. That's a LOT of work. When you reach this point, or come close to it, then I will listen to you more on your criticism about how I do research for articles or books.

Alive, well, and too busy for frequent visits to this thread. I really bit off more than I could chew with the Vogtle 3&4 Project. I'm too old for 70-hr weeks. But, if you make your bed, You have to lay in it! No, not lost intrest in NORJAK, interest is still high. In fact, the direction this forum has taken, definately caused me to be less willing to spend time here. Sluggo writes: In fact, the direction this forum has taken, definately caused me to be less willing to spend time here. R99 replies: Sluggo, this means that you are still sane and mentally compentent. Welcome back. Robert99

Jo, What are you trying to say above? 1. You say the book (Ha Ha Ha) is fiction. 2. You say the book contains things that only Cooper could know. Could you list some of them? 3. You say some of the information was not public in 1983. Could you list some of that information? 4. Are you saying that the author of that book is the hijacker? 5. Again, just what are you trying to say? Robert99