smokin99

Robert99 stated: Jo said: Jo: Maybe the person referred to herself as "Sister so and so" and you automatically thought "Catholic nun". Other religions use the term sister or brother to refer to themselves and each other. I'm thinking that this might be an LDS custom. Elder, brother, sister, etc. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

It's a loaded question, Robert99. And I'm not dodging you on it. But it's difficult to answer because first, no one knows if any of the 66 or so prints actually belongs to the hijacker. Second, the DNA sample itself is suspect. There is much debate about it because of the age of the sample at the time it was taken, that multiple people have handled the tie during the years before DNA came along, and other factors. Outside of the FBI, no one really knows how viable the sample taken is, or what results they were able to obtain from that sample. They can't even tell you for sure it belongs to the hijacker. I've never based the case for Christiansen on DNA, but on other evidence gathered outside of the FBI's investigation. I have always believed that if the case were eventually solved, it would be by witnesses who could fill in the blanks sufficiently to satisfy the FBI that indeed, they had their man. This evidence is important, and cannot be written off with a 'what if'. It needs to be checked. You may be putting the cart before the horse, anyway. The reality is that if the FBI decides to take any action at all on my report, that they would do an investigation based on that report...before moving on to any DNA comparisons. Let me put it this way. If they investigated the witnesses and examined the photos and docs...and found alternate answers to them...and then move on to DNA/print comparisons without a match...then yes, I would accept the results and relegate KC to the list of people eliminated as possibly being Cooper. In fact, they wouldn't even have to do the print comparisons or DNA to satisfy me. Let's face it, if I'm wrong on the evidence regarding Kenny, then I have no case at all. First of all - You know I wasn't just talking about DNA - I can't imagine that they would put resources on DNA as a first step for anyone. But I would imagine that if they did anything first it would be a comparison of prints - not interviews or DNA. It's Smokin not Robert, but what I was getting at, as I noted in my response to Mr Shutter, is that, rightly or wrongly, unless there is a positive match, everyone is still gonna fault the evidence that they THINK the FBI has when it comes to excluding their suspect. So pretty much, the answer is no. You didn't need to cage your response in relation to how viable you think the evidence is - we've all beat on that dead horse. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

While I appreciate the FBI doing the public involvement thing, I'm also not entirely convinced that they, the FBI agents, are just turning over every thing to citizens sleuths, authors, or journalists. I'll go even further to say that I'm not entirely convinced that any given current FBI agent is even necessarily aware of everything that had been collected or done in this case. Just an opinion based on a lot of little things that are reported (but then how much of that can you believe). I think we're in an infinite loop.

Bingo....Kind of what I'm getting at. The simple fact is, unless they get a MATCH (and maybe not even then if the match is for the other guy), I'd wager that every one will fall back on that loophole - in other words no one will accept that their guy is excluded even if the FBI says that are.

So...just curious...if he calls you back and tells you that they don't need any of that stuff because they actually have already checked Kenny's fingerprints/DNA previously sent in and he's been eliminated as a suspect - what will your response be? Well, that would certainly be a surprise, since in one phone call they made to me, and in two additional emails...they have said they have NEVER investigated Christiansen. The only contact ever made between the FBI and anyone involved with Christiansen was when two agents out of the Minneapolis office talked to Lyle Christiansen briefly at Lyle's house. And that was many years ago, even before the Geoff Gray NYM article in '07. No, they haven't checked KC's DNA or his prints. That is a fact. I'm hoping maybe after they read the report and see the available evidence they will. I'm going to drop another thing with my comments here: Although I have posted just about everything here at Dropzone that we know about Christiansen, I did hold back on a couple of items, and those are included in the report. They were discovered after the revised edition of the book came out in January 2011. Not case-breaking necessarily...but important. But to answer your question, if the Seattle FBI reviews the report and the evidentiary documents, and gives me a solid reason why Kenny isn't the hijacker, something you can hang your hat on that refutes the witness testimony and the evidence, then I will accept that and move on. I had to try, though. To tell you the truth, if they put Helen Jones, Mrs Geestman, Jones' daughter, and Geestman's sister Dawn in one room...and Mr Geestman in the other...they will probably get to the truth rather quickly. What that truth is for sure, I don't know. What I DO know is that all those lies by Bernie Geestman need to be addressed once and for all. If the FBI moves forward on this, they will probably speak to Foss Tugs, check his employment record with Boeing and NWA, examine the document on the sale of Kenny's house and adjoining lot, talk to Ann Grimes about the details on the house sale, query him on that 5K loan he got from Kenny so his sister and her kids could move out of his house, and then ask him why he told Decoded he thought Kenny could be the hijacker...when those people in the next room say he was WITH Kenny at the time of the hijacking. I should have done this a year ago instead of arguing points at Dropzone. LOL Robert - Your making this way too complicated. I didn't say that they had checked anything - I said IF they come back and say that they have checked them and no match --- or, OKAY, IF they decide to check them based on your report, and THEN they say that they have eliminated KC. Not by interviewing Bernie or Helen or wives, or sisters, or daughters - just the exclusionary evidence that the FBI has supposedly used to exclude others. Look - the FBI could probably care less what you, I, or others really think of their conclusions. I'm just curious and it's a simple question: Will you accept that KC is excluded based on a no-match to the fingerprints/DNA that the FBI has? but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

So...just curious...if he calls you back and tells you that they don't need any of that stuff because they actually have already checked Kenny's fingerprints/DNA previously sent in and he's been eliminated as a suspect - what will your response be? but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Or as a dead one....but I'm thinking lately that the chance that he survived is looking slim. off subject for a sec: FWIW to my Georgia/Alabama friends..... Since a house divided against itself cannot stand, I hereby cast the deciding woo! woo! here at the corner of God's Little Acre and Tobacco Road. I'm rooting for GA and hoping Bama wins............ Yep....Bama to the left of me ...GA to the right....here I am stuck in the middle with woo! woo!...... Roll Tide, how bout them Dawgs Carry on but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

I just looked at the news footage from that night - I saw 3 dark, narrow ties. I also notice an assortment of colors and sizes in looking at various photos from that time period of unrelated groups. Just saying - I just don't know that you gain a lot from the clothes he was wearing IF, indeed, that was his tie. Was he a poor man, or a g-man, or a insurance salesman, or did he just hate wearing ties so he just clips on the one his sister bought him for his birthday 12 years ago. I also tend to think that if he stuck out too much, witnesses would have remarked on that? As to witnesses, you have to remember that he was in the back of the plane, sitting to the back of most of other passengers on the plane. Got a seating chart of where they were? If they saw him standing it was probably as they were sitting down - with him walking down the aisle after boarding. A key point - no matter how folks might want to disregard it - is that descriptions on the scene - written in the notes and transcripts while the plane was still in the air - by the person(s) that were in the best position to know is that he was abt 6'1", 175 lbs, 50, black hair. Even if the exact height is not known, the flight attendant who was with him the most would seem to know whether he was taller or shorter than she was. And probably would have noticed if he was wearing 5 inch elevator shoes.

No. I sent him an email just checking on him but no response. His awesome Cooper website is still up and running. Unless someone else is using his username and profile, he last visited a website involving another hobby of his in August, 2012, so a good chance that all is well and he just "droppedzone". I enjoyed his contributions - maybe he'll show again one day. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Forest Service using 727s as jumpships? That would astound me. 377 Just though I would share.... wonder what possessed this guy....lol..in the Oregon forest no less... http://www.mymodernmet.com/profiles/blogs/bruce-campbell-boeing-727 LOTS more info here at "AirplaneHome.com" http://airplanehome.com/ but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Jo posts... Yeah, last year was really big being the 40th anniversary, symposium and all. Plus DB was back in media spotlight with the LD Cooper thing and GG's book. I wonder what the turnout will be this year as well... Party on....

A picnic with a table full of deviled eggs. That sounds like something out of a Coen Bros movie. As for the bread buttering corn......one of the parts of the movie "War Games" that always struck me - they are sitting at the table - and Dad starts slathering a slice of bread with butter and then proceeds to roll his corn in it. Only time I ever saw that particular practice. Various remembrances: my family always called the sliced bread that came in a bag "light" bread instead of "white" bread. We lived kinda of in the country - party line phones, dirt roads, You could walk down the road or in the back of the house and have your pick of green plums, mayhaws, figs, peaches, blackberries and muscadines. Just watch out for snakes. We never ate salads - if it didn't come out of the ground in the immediate vicinity we didn't eat that particular vegetable - and we didn't grow lettuce. First time i had a salad was at 15 years of age - I went to a restaurant (first time for that too). I thought that dressing was that stuff you had on Thanksgiving with turkey. Little did I know that people put that on lettuce and called it a salad. Also the first time i sat at a meal where there were two forks.

I've never thought about it, but we did too. So I looked on a can and that's what the Ocean Spray folks call it also. I'll have to look that one up. Great Thanksgiving post. Everything is pretty much as you described it with a couple of regional substitutions. The rolls were either burnt or -- just forgot to put them in the oven to start with. About the only thing you left off was that funky fruit salad thing that always showed up - sometimes in a mold, sometimes just a can of fruit cocktail in some whipped creme. I don't recall ever seeing that particular dish outside of Thanksgiving and family reunions.

Well I guess that cleared that up. Not sure if #4 qualifies as a drive-by shooting or a hit and run, but I suspect we will hear more on that topic soon. eta.....lol.. that was quick. That's what happens when you leave your computer in mid post. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Hello???...Hello??? Rein in your green eyed monster. Did Galen Cook ask Bruce Smith to come on Dropzone and post as his proxy????? That would be the question you should ask before making your asinine assumptions. In order to "use a shill" you have to be an active participant. From what I am reading from Bruce - he has conversations with Galen and then chooses --- on his own-- to post those conversations. Perhaps Bruce Smith can enlighten us as to whether Galen Cook is "using" him as a "shill". Smokin99: Why don't we cut through the baloney and see what brand of mustard is being used on the sandwich? Smith has claimed that the reason Cook doesn't post on his own is because he was banned by Quade. If this is not true, wouldn't you like to see Cook post up his own case? And wouldn't you like to know WHY Cook said that? Let's just say for a moment that Cook told Bruce Smith he was banned and Smith has no idea whether it's true. I'm simply asking if it is. And if it ISN'T true, then Cook should post for himself, instead of using the Mountain News and Bruce as a platform while being able to dodge questions at the same time. I'm not perfect, but I only LOOK stupid. Robert, I get that you want Cook to post here, but you are just making a lot of suppositions - While definitely not perfect, maybe you don't look stupid - just a little obtuse at times.

Hello???...Hello??? Rein in your green eyed monster. Did Galen Cook ask Bruce Smith to come on Dropzone and post as his proxy????? That would be the question you should ask before making your asinine assumptions. In order to "use a shill" you have to be an active participant. From what I am reading from Bruce - he has conversations with Galen and then chooses --- on his own-- to post those conversations. Perhaps Bruce Smith can enlighten us as to whether Galen Cook is "using" him as a "shill". Smokin99: Why don't we cut through the baloney and see what brand of mustard is being used on the sandwich? Smith has claimed that the reason Cook doesn't post on his own is because he was banned by Quade. If this is not true, wouldn't you like to see Cook post up his own case? And wouldn't you like to know WHY Cook said that? Let's just say for a moment that Cook told Bruce Smith he was banned and Smith has no idea whether it's true. I'm simply asking if it is. And if it ISN'T true, then Cook should post for himself, instead of using the Mountain News and Bruce as a platform while being able to dodge questions at the same time. I'm not perfect, but I only LOOK stupid. Hint. You're not perfect and you look stupid. Here's the deal: Bruce Smith says that sometimes Galen calls, they talk, then he (Bruce) posts snippets of their conversations. No where in that dialogue does anyone suggest that Galen asks Bruce to post for him. Really that is the only thing that should be of concern...... However,,,,,maybe I'm missing something here, but I've been hanging out at the dropzone for a bit longer than you - and I'll go out on a limb here and say that Galen Cook has never been a prolific poster on the Dropzone. I even have my doubts - though I'm not totally sure on this one - that he has ever been what one would term a "regular" poster. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Jo... I really don't care why he doesn't post on an internet forum. Each to his frickin own. If my goal was to write a book on one of the most infamous crimes of the 20 century and I thought i had a fresh take on it...I mean really - why would I want to dilute my product by posting my every thought/chapter on an internet forum? Actually, Smokin...Galen Cook DOES post. He just uses Bruce Smith to do it. Or haven't you noticed? Pretty obvious, hard to deny. Bullshit. If Bruce Smith chooses to post his conversations with Galen Cook, then that is Bruce Smith posting. Not Galen Cook. But you know what? What fricking difference does it make anyway? If you're gonna write a book get the most mileage possible. I personally would not divulge all on an internet forum -- but hey...each to his own. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Hello???...Hello??? Rein in your green eyed monster. Did Galen Cook ask Bruce Smith to come on Dropzone and post as his proxy????? That would be the question you should ask before making your asinine assumptions. In order to "use a shill" you have to be an active participant. From what I am reading from Bruce - he has conversations with Galen and then chooses --- on his own-- to post those conversations. Perhaps Bruce Smith can enlighten us as to whether Galen Cook is "using" him as a "shill". but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Jo... I really don't care why he doesn't post on an internet forum. Each to his frickin own. If my goal was to write a book on one of the most infamous crimes of the 20 century and I thought i had a fresh take on it...I mean really - why would I want to dilute my product by posting my every thought/chapter on an internet forum? but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

WTF......did you guys have any problem with Geoffrey Grey not posting on Dropzone? Or Richard Tosaw not posting on Dropzone? Or Ralph Himmelsbach not posting on Dropzone? Or "Name a DB Cooper Author" not posting on dropzone? Jeez..........maybe the really savvy writers save their shit for their books. You think?? but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

whats the 'motivation' for anyone posting here? Dang I like you Bruce Smith. You're kinda of out there with some stuff, but I think you basically put forth a genuine, honest article. Even when they close the door on you, you always manage to come up with something to write about anyway. I love to read your stuff..so keep it coming. And btw, I will be looking forward to my percentage of the lotto winnings. 7 27.

Cool! I wanta go fishing with him! I'll take my tuna grilled! My cholesterol is lowering just thinking about it. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Wonder what Danny Boy ate 41 years ago? Don't sigh....Tis better to be alive than well fed.

lol...so many Coopers...so little time. looks like BruceSmith is off the hot seat with Jo and Blevins..... And Galen Cook is in the turkey fryer with both. Life in the fast lane. As for smokin99 - I've baked three pies, made a broccoli salad, collard greens, got my dressing in the oven, turkey ready to go in the oven when I wake up, dirty martini by my side, thinking about a corn casserole/souffle, watching Gone with the Wind on Turner Classic Movies, sneaking a page or two of a Ken Follett novel that's resting on the arm of my chair, and Dropzone on the laptop. Am I multi-tasking or what? Totally content - Happy Thanksgiving to all that partake. Ah hell - it won't hurt to count your blessings even if you don't.

7, 27 Though, technically..... the anniversary is not until the 24th, right? lol....doesn't really matter..I got married on the day after Thanksgiving which that year happened to fall on the 27th, but we always celebrated (yeah, right ) on the day after Thanksgiving, no matter the date. A lot easier to remember - if you're into remembering things like that but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill