georger

Thanks for putting up the link -

Funny. NPR just had a story including interviews with Geof Gray and Agent Gutt. Nope - AB Houscleaning wasn't consulted. Geof's book was mentioned. The reporter mentioned the money find and evidence the FBI has in this case which include Cigarette butts, finger prints, and 'saliva'. No mention of skin cells from the tie. The NPR reporter said work on the new suspect is a low priority with the FBI and probably will not be finished by the Anniversary. Geof Gray said he wouldnt be surprised if work on the new suspect stalls due to 'flawed forensic evidence the FBI has in this case'. The reporter/FBI were very clear: this is a new deceased suspect never brought forward or investigated before, ie. brand new name.

It was a thought experiment that you became obsessed with. Nothing more, nothing less. I don't have a reason to do any other thought experiments here. It's not unethical unless I'm from the FBI, but at this stage, they're the ones expressing the most optimism. I'll go ahead and extend the offer to anyone ever affiliated with the FBI, but I want them to give me some odds. I'll gladly bet against the FBI all day long when it comes to Cooper because they've shown me that they'll never figure this out. If you're reading, I will be your counterparty and we can make a deal. I didn't realize Blevins liked to wager. I've read where he was 90% confident that KC was Cooper. If someone here is willing to split the cost to get KC's fingerprints or DNA independently tested against what the FBI has, I probably would be willing to make a wager to make it all worth our time. Blevins and KC should be out the discussion, period, and anything I could do to help expedite this, I'd probably be willing to do. The primary benefit of having Blevins involved is that his PR machine keeps Cooper in the mainstream media - but the benefit is balanced with us having to hear more and more BS that doesn't add up in the slightest. It's a bit irritating to see on TV, and even more unbearable to have to skip his posts on here whenever I make my annual visits. I'm sure I'm not the only one that feels this way around here. what a wonderful first read of the day!

I did just that.....and found a reporter that named the suspect. She may be on to something! http://thestir.cafemom.com/in_the_news/123897/break_in_db_cooper_case You mean Farflung !? Im going out for popcorn. Maybe its on at my local sports bar?

Georger replies: No. You dont know for sure. Well you know but you can't or won't admit it, least of all publically. You are like Jo (caught in the same dilemma) ... or you wouldnt have launched this ship with gaping holes in its side, at all. But you are a gambler. I am a steely eyed missle man, by comparison! Its just our different natures. No big deal. Not for me at least. I've always tried to be forthright on my posts here at Dropzone and I usually don't hold anything back, even the names and locations of some of the witnesses, and what they said. And I saw Apollo 13, too, Steely-eyed Missile Man. That's a good quote, by the way. YOU are the one going to absolutes by saying you 'know' the Seattle FBI isn't looking at KC. I am not a gambler. I am the sort who requires verification, second sources, and evidence, whether it be documentary, circumstantial, or direct. Please don't put me into the same boat as Jo, who I'm sure means well, but who also offers up mysterious and ambigious 'revelations' and little or no hard proof. I've said from the start that Porteous and I suspect KC was the guy. I've also said we can't say for sure. This is one of the reasons I am waiting to see what happens from the Seattle FBI before agreeing to any interviews. The hard truth is this: Either KC is the person being looked at or not. And even if he is, there is still no proof (for certain) that he was Cooper. I figure right now it's in the hands of the FBI and we will all have to wait for the results. I'll admit it's a bit of a coincidence that Porteous has been doing what he's been doing lately with those Special Agents back east...and now the Seattle FBI is doing what they are doing now. But, it could still be a coincidence. (Like enough of that hasn't gone around in the Christiansen case already.) why in God's name would you look at a "cow" when it obviously was a "cougar"! Cant you see tracks in the snow? Or is it the book-thing? How many stow-aways can this case support on it's back? There was ONLY one Cooper ... not fifty seven!

I like your linear way of thinking. Your previous post included. Your comments are noted for future reference. Thanks! PS* I very much like your thought process. Appreciated.

Nice to see your shadow again. Any new modus ponems?

As far as Georger's offhand comment about KC being 'off the board,' I will ask how he came into this information. That's strictly your personal opinion, and you have no way of knowing the Seattle FBI's current suspect any more than I do. Odds are that you are right. But you don't know for sure. . No. You dont know for sure. Well you know but you can't or won't admit it, least of all publically. You are like Jo (caught in the same dilemma) ... or you wouldnt have launched this ship with gaping holes in its side, at all. But you are a gambler. I am a steely eyed missle man, by comparison! Its just our different natures. No big deal. Not for me at least.

I get where you're coming from, but couldn't law enforcement colleague - in this context - mean any law enforcement outside of the FBI? I've heard the term used before in cases where multiple jurisdictions/agencies were involved. So BCA or Secret Service does not sound so far fetched to me. Could be any of the above. Several things strike me and fit with conversations I have had over the last year. The FBI chose to make this statement, at this time. The fact of Blevin's book and media campaign, the anniversary, media attention building - cannot be a coincidence. This release was no accident or entirely coincidental, in any event. It could be Vicki's Dad, something entirely new, or merely anecdotal to other things developing and at the end of this no new candidate will emerge. It sounds like a new candidate but until that emerges with a name and more information, this could be just another false alarm, at the same time the FBI is already having to deal with media attention this year, in lieu of other plans the FBI has for this case. On the face of it it sounds like a new candidate. It sounds like a process has been unfolding behind the scenes. But there are always people looking for suspects et cetera. Clearly KC is off the board. Weber already was. Galen has been silent and I cant blame him with all of the KC nonsense going on. If Geof Gray knows something he certainly did not tell the reporter. I know this much. Im not going to spend two seconds trying to track this down. In fact I had a long night last night, little sleep, a hundred people to help after a lecture in astrophysics, and "Ich" am going to go in a take a nap ... its just past noon. And tomorrow is going to be a very busy day ... That is all I know with any certainty. Smokin, I always look forward to your posts and respect them, likewise Orange.

Ah.. so definitely something that would fall under "law enforcement". I believe the words are: law enforcement colleague. Someone who has worked with the FBI before but who has independent law enforcement status, ie. not FBI themselves. Who fits that catagory that had a specific theory of the case and was looking for suspects, who has been at this for years behind the scenes ........ or, it could be someone brand new who nobody has heard of (not even jO wEBER! or her main contact in WA, _________________). You can bet Jo's phone bill will be high next month.

Maybe by December you will know something - once the crackpots have had time to cool their heels. Just a guess. The Hannaford article is tabloid. Two major crackpots were put at the centre of the article and negative references only to Dropzone. That defines the artcle. Hannaford was handed a story. Otherwise the article is tabloid trash.

First, you dont know that at all. Secondly, you evidently missed the key sentence in the article. That sentence reads: " And it comes from a credible lead who came to our attention recently via a law enforcement colleague." ?? Re DNA - that was what the article said, and not the first time it has been discussed. Are you saying that they misquoted the FBI, or are you saying that unbeknownst to (some of) us, there is actually a complete enough DNA sample that they will be able to definitively finger someone without a court challenge to the DNA evidence? And who said I missed the sentence? I hadn't got that far at the time. Is this a lead that some of the DZers have been working on behind the scenes, Georger? So, those of us not in the know are dying to know who the suspect is and what the evidence is, but I guess we'll just have to wait... And Blevins, sorry, but you're clutching at non-existent straws. The clear statement is that it is a name that has not come up before. Christiansen has come up before. There is only one logical conclusion. sorry, I didnt mean to jump on you. All I am saying is the whole dna/mtdna route can change on a daily basis. This is not allegory but fact. I will reserve the rest for a few days. Im not going to second guess the FBI now that the article has been published. It would appear this article caught Blev by surprise. Strange. Jo is al quiet.

all known candidates especially those discussed here are out. Period. That is what the article says.

Still working my way through the articles. As we know FBI confirming the DNA samples can only exclude suspects, not confirm anyone. First, you dont know that at all. Secondly, you evidently missed the key sentence in the article. That sentence reads: " And it comes from a credible lead who came to our attention recently via a law enforcement colleague."

I'll assume by 'a certain writer' you mean Alex Hannaford. His article is due to appear tomorrow online. He's the most recent person to get an interview with Eng. I think it comes out in either the Daily Mail or the Guardian, I have notes but I am not on my office computer at the moment. Because England is (I think) ten hours ahead of Seattle time, it's possible the article may appear online by this evening late. For the anti-KC fans, I believe Eng will have comments on why they don't think it was Christiansen. That's expected. Of course, this comes to you from the same folks who once swore Cooper was Richard McCoy and now believe Cooper died in the jump. And we won't go into the Amboy chute thing, which (again) has not been addressed well by the Seattle FBI, IMHO. For The Record: I am fully prepared to accept the fact that Kenneth Peter Christiansen was NOT DB Cooper. The only thing I ask is definitive, 100%-verifiable information that eliminates him as a suspect. That is not too much to ask, and I think it's quite fair. In the event that KC is absolutely proven not to be Cooper, I will pull the book. My only satisfaction would come from helping to bring enough attention to him to help eliminate him once and for all. That's not much, but I suppose it would have to do. I have never been able to say for sure KC was the guy. A final answer on him would at least bring closure to the theories. Maybe Eng knows something we don't know...something that will finally eliminate Christiansen. Amanda Knox: It's a complex case. Her initial verbal confession was thrown out, but not her five-page manifesto she gave to the Italian police. Her courtroom antics were beyond belief. Then she testified she came home and found blood all over the carpet and in the bathroom - and took a shower anyway. The jury found this strange, and so do I. Her false implication of Lumumba, who lost his nightclub and spent two weeks in jail, didn't help her case, as well as doing cartwheels and the splits at the police station while waiting to be questioned on the murder. Personally, I think she deserves to spend the rest of her life in jail. But that's just me. Even after all of this, it is possible that Knox will be released anyway. I wouldn't want to be her NEXT roommate. Ahhh, but will Gort and Klattu be returning to Murengey, any time soon! ? Earth free at last! Free at last! Tell us the inside story _ Nancy B. Well, since Georger decided to re-print/re-quote/re-iterate my entire post without any real comment, I just did the same thing. It's like the Twilight Zone around here sometimes, I swear. (*Insert wrap on theme music here*) I will obey! Dont beat me anymore. Please let me wife and children go! I'd settle for two things. Learning how to use cut and paste properly, instead of subjecting thread readers to the same post in its entirety. And an intelligent comment instead of an insult, at least once in a while. You've done the latter so many times, it's not only overkill...it's probably becoming tiresome to everyone. Hey! I'm blonde. Remember? Have the intelligence of a sixth grader you said. Did you say: Tiresome ? Look in the mirror, pretty boy. This is Peggy. Georger is on vacation. Can I help you?

I'll assume by 'a certain writer' you mean Alex Hannaford. His article is due to appear tomorrow online. He's the most recent person to get an interview with Eng. I think it comes out in either the Daily Mail or the Guardian, I have notes but I am not on my office computer at the moment. Because England is (I think) ten hours ahead of Seattle time, it's possible the article may appear online by this evening late. For the anti-KC fans, I believe Eng will have comments on why they don't think it was Christiansen. That's expected. Of course, this comes to you from the same folks who once swore Cooper was Richard McCoy and now believe Cooper died in the jump. And we won't go into the Amboy chute thing, which (again) has not been addressed well by the Seattle FBI, IMHO. For The Record: I am fully prepared to accept the fact that Kenneth Peter Christiansen was NOT DB Cooper. The only thing I ask is definitive, 100%-verifiable information that eliminates him as a suspect. That is not too much to ask, and I think it's quite fair. In the event that KC is absolutely proven not to be Cooper, I will pull the book. My only satisfaction would come from helping to bring enough attention to him to help eliminate him once and for all. That's not much, but I suppose it would have to do. I have never been able to say for sure KC was the guy. A final answer on him would at least bring closure to the theories. Maybe Eng knows something we don't know...something that will finally eliminate Christiansen. Amanda Knox: It's a complex case. Her initial verbal confession was thrown out, but not her five-page manifesto she gave to the Italian police. Her courtroom antics were beyond belief. Then she testified she came home and found blood all over the carpet and in the bathroom - and took a shower anyway. The jury found this strange, and so do I. Her false implication of Lumumba, who lost his nightclub and spent two weeks in jail, didn't help her case, as well as doing cartwheels and the splits at the police station while waiting to be questioned on the murder. Personally, I think she deserves to spend the rest of her life in jail. But that's just me. Even after all of this, it is possible that Knox will be released anyway. I wouldn't want to be her NEXT roommate. Ahhh, but will Gort and Klattu be returning to Murengey, any time soon! ? Earth free at last! Free at last! Tell us the inside story _ Nancy B. Well, since Georger decided to re-print/re-quote/re-iterate my entire post without any real comment, I just did the same thing. It's like the Twilight Zone around here sometimes, I swear. (*Insert wrap on theme music here*)'Don't give up reaching for the stars... just build yourself a bigger ladder.' I will obey! Dont beat me anymore. Please let me wife and children go!

I'll assume by 'a certain writer' you mean Alex Hannaford. His article is due to appear tomorrow online. He's the most recent person to get an interview with Eng. I think it comes out in either the Daily Mail or the Guardian, I have notes but I am not on my office computer at the moment. Because England is (I think) ten hours ahead of Seattle time, it's possible the article may appear online by this evening late. For the anti-KC fans, I believe Eng will have comments on why they don't think it was Christiansen. That's expected. Of course, this comes to you from the same folks who once swore Cooper was Richard McCoy and now believe Cooper died in the jump. And we won't go into the Amboy chute thing, which (again) has not been addressed well by the Seattle FBI, IMHO. For The Record: I am fully prepared to accept the fact that Kenneth Peter Christiansen was NOT DB Cooper. The only thing I ask is definitive, 100%-verifiable information that eliminates him as a suspect. That is not too much to ask, and I think it's quite fair. In the event that KC is absolutely proven not to be Cooper, I will pull the book. My only satisfaction would come from helping to bring enough attention to him to help eliminate him once and for all. That's not much, but I suppose it would have to do. I have never been able to say for sure KC was the guy. A final answer on him would at least bring closure to the theories. Maybe Eng knows something we don't know...something that will finally eliminate Christiansen. Amanda Knox: It's a complex case. Her initial verbal confession was thrown out, but not her five-page manifesto she gave to the Italian police. Her courtroom antics were beyond belief. Then she testified she came home and found blood all over the carpet and in the bathroom - and took a shower anyway. The jury found this strange, and so do I. Her false implication of Lumumba, who lost his nightclub and spent two weeks in jail, didn't help her case, as well as doing cartwheels and the splits at the police station while waiting to be questioned on the murder. Personally, I think she deserves to spend the rest of her life in jail. But that's just me. Even after all of this, it is possible that Knox will be released anyway. I wouldn't want to be her NEXT roommate. Ahhh, but will Gort and Klattu be returning to Murengey, any time soon! ? Earth free at last! Free at last! Tell us the inside story _ Nancy B.

Skyjack 71 says in part: This does not matter *if* they were able to get one good profile on the original sample. From then on, the data's on the computer. Then you compare it against another profile that has been run from provided DNA. I don't know about the quality of the original sample, but my best information is this: Supposedly the FBI ran the profile on 'epithelial neck skin cells' or something to that effect. This type of DNA profile can be matched to another profile, but not always. It CAN eliminate someone however, (which it will do in probably 99.99999% of cases) but it sometimes can't be matched. I know that sounds weird, but here's what it really means in a down-home sort of way. If a suspect's DNA is NOT eliminated by the test, you had better move that person to the top of the suspect list. This person will almost certainly be the hijacker. However, you couldn't rely on this test as your main evidence for a conviction. You would need corroborating evidence or the case would be tossed or hung by the jury. It's more of a tool than recognized evidence that could be sold in court. That said, the dot gov website that covers DNA and the justice system says they CAN run complete profiles from skin cells. Maybe not from skin cells that are more than 35 years old when you take them, though. This might be why they only have a partial profile. And you shouldn't take only my word on these things. I did some research, yes. But I'm NOT a geneticist. Here's a guess on how the FBI may have come up with a profile: 1) Everyone knows a lot of people handled the tie. So does the FBI. 2) If they were trying to extract skin cells from the tie, they might try drawing them out a few at a time around the neck area...and then check to see if a large group of the cells match. Supposedly, the FBI took the sample cells from the area where the top of the tie touches the neck. 3) *If* they find a large number of skin cells that match in that area of the tie, they could logically assume they are from the hijacker's neck. Maybe. 4) Then...they run the profile. No one is completely sure if the sample is valid, but now they have DNA infomation to work with. 5) If the provided sample from a suspect CANNOT be eliminated, then the FBI would probably look at that suspect much more closely. All it really is to the FBI is another wrench in the Cooper Toolbox to perhaps solve the case. Im no longer stunned by the immaturity it takes to throw some piece of long-winded boilerplate like this together when it is obvious you havent the faintest idea what you are talking about ... and never will know. The audience wont be able to follow your confused messianic sermon anyway !! Forgive him Lord. He knows not what he does.

It seems obvious to me, that had Duane ever served in a formal or even a informal capacity for which there were records (of any kind) he not only could have, but would have filed for benefits later, based on that service. Duane never missed an opportunity that was a sure-fire thing. That was his nature. Duane never filed for benefits of any kind related to his supposed service, nor have you ever claimed he did or was even entitled to benefits. Thousands of veterans whose records were lost for whatever reason later filed for benefits and most got them ... It seems to me you need to be taking this up with the War Dept or somebody. ???

As far as I could tell, there have never been any cut-sheetrock access panels inside the home. One reason might be because the water lines don't run up there and the distance between the peak of the roof and the attic joists is really short. Less than four feet. Forget about standing up, even at the highest point. It would not have made a good place for attic storage, as some people do when they add a floor to the attic and an access. That's probably why no one bothered to put one in. Given the age of the place, small size of that cabin, high humidity of the area, my guess is all of the ceilings in that cabin have been replaced with new sheet rock at some time. Im only guessing. Maybe the roof too but definately reshingled... you have never mentioned the condition of the roof sheeting 'above' the 'hiding hole frame' if a pipe ever went through the roof there ? During the TV film I noticed how even (and new looking) the front room ceiling was, likewise the bedroom ceiling (the little the film shows of it ). That hole is in a perfect location to have once supported a flu pipe (wood stove in bedroom) or attic access hole, years ago. The very first order of business would be to determine if the ceiling has been replaced, which should be easy to determine. The old dry wall ceiling would have been installed with ring shank nails vrs screws, for one thing. Old drywall would have been thicker and untempered with thicker paper covering vs the newer (cheaper) versions. Today there are many different varieties of wallboard available (including green board for high humidity situations) which were not available when that cabin was built or in Kenny's day. That place was a cabin, not a real house. Built accordingly. It still is a cabin archetecturally. That hole is a very minimal security hiding place! That stands out and is obvious. Easy access to it from inside the cabin standing on a chair. Just bust out a piece of the ceiling with one's fist and look into the attic to see what's there or crawl up there. Simple as that. You are making more to gaining access to that attic than is actually involved, You dont have to go to the outside and have a ladder! No theif would bother. And no deterence whatever from law enforcement. Law enforcement would consider that hiding place a joke. Only a moron would use that place to hide something of a serious nature like $200,000! Lastly: if you don't want people commenting, don't post? Simple association.

Frankly, this is pathetic (at best)! Give it up Bruce. I go further than Blevins on this - miles further - "No, that’s not going to happen,” Lee said matter-of-factly." IMHO, Bruce you are looking at an injunction coming your way if you don't stop, and Jo Weber also. Stop being thugs.

4) I had an expert in countertops examine the Formica piece. He estimated it was made before 1980 but cannot tell much else about it. 6) The 'hiding spot' is located above what used to be Ken Christiansen's bedroom, but there is no access to the attic from inside the house. CONCLUSION: It was obvious that someone decided this was the best place to hide something inside the house, because there is no access from inside, and the access itself is difficult to reach from outside. . Q: and there never was access to it from inside the house? A: from the design it looks like a Bulgarian made it. Or a mouse. ?

I guess I feel better now. Thanks DBC thread for always being consistent, you are my rock. Thugism is no vice. (Thuggism von Cooper oder andere, nicht umgekehrt uber alles. Seig Arbeit macht frei. )

Keep up the good work while we all go on vacation.

Looks the same to me days after I was first there and twice now tonight. Guess you are looking at a different site. Since Blebins is now the offical outlet for the FBI and all Cooper news, I will just sit back and go along for the ride. Hell I may even ask Blevins to speak for NASA too! Any news from the Allen Seti Array? Any news on Casey Anthony? Any news on the debt ceiling? ITS ALL GOOD 377 doesnt get Snowmman but he does get Blevins and Jo - forever.