FLYJACK

this map?? Georger... "** credit to FLYJACK for his current updated version of my old map published at DZ a decade ago - its nice to see FJ copying my old work without giving credit -" I just constructed this map in Google Earth, THE ENTIRE THING, it isn't your 10 year old map which I have never seen. You are delusional. Edit ,, and you are a serial liar Warner. It wasn't 2010, it was around 2013 when I started on DZ. Jo Weber messaged me pushing Duane as Cooper on me but I rejected it. She fabricated the "Bulljax" story and posted it to discredit me and get me kicked off DZ.. this was my introduction to the handful of psychos involved in the Cooper case. I left DZ and the Cooper game when my father suddenly and unexpectedly passed away.. not due to Jo Weber. When I came back to the Cooper game several years later, DZ was closed.. Shutter's site was open so I went there. That is were the new round of psychos emerged.. There MeyerLouie, R99 and (Georger) consistently lied to discredit me... all of you tried get me banned. I get it you wanted to control the Cooper narrative and didn't want disruptors.. except you guys haven't moved the ball in a decade. You and a few others are why I don't even post most of the Cooper info I have and I told Shutter to delete my account. You just aren't worthy. The Cooper game has its nasty, jealous liars and frauds.. whose only contribution is to discredit others with lies and innuendo. It still amazes me that somebody can lie repeatedly without any sense of personal responsibility or conscience. I can only conclude that you are threatened and fear being irrelevant... newsflash Georger, you are irrelevant, you have been for years..

Sounds great... If the chute matches the packing card, we have a problem.. If the chute doesn't match the packing card we still have a problem...

https://themountainnewswa.net/2011/10/25/db-cooper-case-heats-up-again-with-controversy-over-parachutes/ "Further, Norman emphatically declares that he never spoke directly to the FBI during the parachute delivery nor subsequent investigation, yet, the Bureau’s document claims that their detailed parachute information comes from Norman." "In addition, Barry supports Norman’s claim that as far as they know, both back chutes were identical. In fact, Norman seemed a bit dismayed about bureaucratic in-accuracies when I read aloud the FBI description of the two back parachutes and their many differences. However, Barry openly wonders if the FBI received four back parachutes that day – two from Norman that were identical, and two from Earl Cossey that were not." Cossey claimed sage green container/ sage green harness was used by Cooper.. he rejected remnants with sage green harness. In early FBI docs the chute taken was always described as olive drab container,, the Sage Green came from Cossey. We have a two dimensional conflict,, Sage Green/ Sage Green doesn't match Hayden's chutes and doesn't match early reports of chute taken.. If Cossey had the chute taken wrong and he was the go to with found remnants for analysis then his determinations are bogus.

I posted info earlier but the Hayden chutes are only one conflicting dimension here.. there is another conflicting dimension, the colour. Cossey rejected found chutes not sage green harness/ sage green container's... the chutes described in the FBI files were not sage green/sage green... they were both olive drab or one tan one olive drab.. IMO, the FBI is hiding something about the chutes, could be info they initially want to hold back or a massive error they made going forward. It feels like the old soviet "active measures", release conflicting info so we can't determine the truth. The FBI's primary objective is to maintain the positive public perception of the FBI, it isn't to solve cases. If they screwed up they'll cover it up. Everybody needs to remember that FBI 302's are not CONCLUSIONS, they are investigative process notes..

Nonsense. Your claim is BUSTED, it is a FACT that Steinthal S/N's had 5 digits after the year. I was responding to R99's ridiculous denial.. AFTER I POSTED THE FACTS I am not the one with the distortions.. I have to run around wasting my time to disprove your bogus assumptions... then R99 still denies it.. and you blame me.. Where is the.. hey Fly thanks for taking the time to proving my bogus assumption is invalid.. no, I get a personal attack. A few of you need to retire from the Cooper game,, you've lost perspective.

Yes, Iv'e seen Hayden's chute at the WSHM in person.. have you? Why do you ask? Are trying to discredit me.. so you can reject the fact I posted earlier which you don't accept. Steinthal chutes did have S/N's with 5 digits after the year. FACT. Shutter's argument BUSTED. Are you interested in pursuing the truth or winning arguments? It seems the latter for some of the so called Cooper sleuths... Shutter and Blevins refuse answer this question, maybe you can.. Which of Hayden's chutes did Cooper jump with? The one left on the plane or the one now at the WSHM? .

McChord chutes were AAD or static line per media reports, not Hayden's. Everybody has this completely screwed up... The data from the packing card found inside the back chute left on the plane does not match the packing card for the back chute returned to Hayden. Both were packed May 21, 1971 by Cossey which matches the FBI Hayden's claims. It is that simple. Both of Hayden's back chutes are accounted for AFTER Cooper jumped. Cooper did not use either of Hayden's chutes.. Shutter, Blevins and R99, none of your arguments undermine that. They are all desperate confirmation bias riddled red herrings. From there we need to figure out which chute he did take.

Like herding cats.... If you read my reply above,, Shutter's assumption is debunked. Please, don't let facts stop you from making up stuff.

This one was a woman..

You don't like the size of the serial number? The fact is they aren't the same, neither is the date. They should match if they are the same regardless of the actual number. Do you have evidence that S/N's for Steinthal chutes don't have 6 numbers? or are you using an assumption to draw a conclusion.. 1967 Steinthal 67-8412 https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/28-diameter-orange-white-tan-green-2006188302

Robert,, You are drifting OT again.. Ironically, you have essentially the same illogical argument as Shutter. Basically, we don't have proof for which chute Cooper took so it must have been one of Hayden's. It is true we don't have proof of which chute Cooper took but do have proof he didn't take one of Hayden's.. both are accounted for. Neither of you can tell me which one of Hayden's chutes Cooper took. Since he didn't take either of Hayden's and we don't have proof of which one took we need to use logic and reason to try to figure it out. Cossey's or McChord's. NYTimes.. "Two military models were found at McChord Air Force Base in Tacoma and rushed to the Seattle field." Himmelsbach claimed Cooper requested chutes from McChord. FBI files, Cooper expected chutes form McChord.. Cooper rejected "auto" chutes from McChord and requested manual ones, (Hayden's) Cooper was expecting them from McChord, so when did he reject them before or after he saw them? How could he reject chutes he was expecting without seeing them? If after he saw them it had to be on the plane. That means they were delivered earlier and matches Finegold's story.

Of course it is the serial number. The descriptor is below the line.. That card is poorly designed but that doesn't change the data... Are you seriously hanging your argument on that nonsense. You should be embarrassed for that. .

Robert, According to you everyone if full of BS.. Finegold, Himmelsbach, the NYTimes, Cossey, Bruce Smith.. but even if true which it isn't Cooper still didn't use either of Hayden's chutes. So which of Hayden's chutes did Cooper use? Maybe somebody can provide an actual answer before this COVID-19 zombie apocalypse gets really rolling.. The problem is both of Hayden's chutes are documented in existence AFTER NORJAK. So, which chute did he take?

A chute remnant was found in the river (blue line) between Heisson Bridge and Lucia falls.. the FBI dismissed it. The (red line) is the railway is right next to the river where the chute was found. Heisson General Store right on the railway line is most likely the store that had the break-in Norjak evening. The (wide black line) is the approximate flightpath about 4 miles from the Heisson Bridge between the 20:12 at 20:13 time mark.

From you that means nothing.. your recent posts about the Hayden chutes are littered with logical errors and irrational nonsense. I was trying to be nice but you are truly clueless.. Shutter - "226 is not a S/N.." "unbelievable", it is written right on the packing card.

It wasn't an insult, it is a fact. I asked you a simple question, which of Hayden's chutes did Cooper take? You claimed it was simple but you can't answer it and you know it. So, you tried the Georger fallback passive aggressive mockery. I am done with this garbage.. keep your toxic crap over there.

Exactly, you have no answer to a simple question.. Your passive aggressive BS is just like Georger, Shutter.

Hayden's chute is marked as evidence. he only got one chute back....seems pretty simple to me? Simple question.. Which one of Hayden's chutes did Cooper take? The one left on the plane or the one Hayden got back?

Hardly, I am tired of childish, idiotic, incoherent and false comments from positions of ignorance.. Keep that crap over there.

Get a grip R99, you are out of control and confused again. YES, Al Lee brought the chutes to the plane and Tina brought them on board. I said that already. I am speculating based on several factors that perhaps the McChord chutes were brought to the plane before that and the chutes from Tina were the replacements Cooper asked for. Use your noodle.. For Cooper to reject chutes he believed were coming from McChord he must have seen them. He could only have seen them if they were brought to the plane earlier. Larry Finegold's claim which was always discounted makes sense in this context.

Ground elevation where chute was found 400ft. If Cooper's chute deployed in 200 ft of exit,, What is the drift from 9400 ft. elevation? The chute was found about 4.5 miles NE from flightpath which had a half mile error plot. It lines up with 20:12-20:13: time. Is 4 - 4.5 miles drift NE within a drift zone from 9400ft? assume SW wind at 25-30 mph. Did a quick/rough calc and max distance looks to be 3 - 3.5 miles.. It is close.. the variable is the precise location of the airplane.

Totally irrelevant, could be confusion by the FBI in the summary or maybe both of Hayden's were left on the plane if there were two chute deliveries to the plane. That document doesn't show anything other than confirming that both of Hayden's chutes were left somewhere and not taken by Cooper. The packing card being new before Cossey packed Hayden's chute is irrelevant, meaningless. The chute at WSHS is a lost leader, Hayden's chute was repacked 2X after Hayden got it back and the card signed, if the S/N 226 was wrong wouldn't those packers have noticed and checked. It still doesn't matter both of Hayden's chutes are accounted for.. no way around it. FACT Is,, both of Hayden's are accounted for, COOPER DIDN'T TAKE EITHER. What I am trying to sort is which other one he took. Either Cossey's or McChord's but I am leaning toward McChord's based on Finegold's statement.

Himmelsbach claimed Cooper demanded chutes from McChord. per FBI doc, Cooper was expecting chutes from McChord. News reports were that he rejected the McChord chutes due to opening system. So, if he was expecting chutes from McChord then when did he reject them, he must have seen them to reject them and request others. How could go from expecting chutes from McChord to rejected them without seeing them. If you wanted 2 chutes for a hostage, wouldn't the best chute for a hostage be an AAD equipped chute,, Larry Finegold had indicated an FBI agent he knew brought chutes onto the plane. These may have been the McChord chutes. Larry finegold.. "It was not long after the jet landed that Finegold became perhaps the first passenger to learn what was really going on. A man boarded the plane and came down the aisle. Finegold recognized him as an FBI agent he’d worked with before on federal cases. “He said, ‘Larry, there’s a skyjacker on the plane, and we’re gonna get you off the plane in a couple minutes,’ then he walks [toward the rear of the cabin] because I think there was an exchange,” Finegold said. “This was happening behind me. [The FBI agent] was bringing on the money and the parachutes." My current theory,, subject to change.. Cooper asked for chutes from McChord. They were delivered to the plane. They had AAD. Cooper demanded replacements with manual opening. Tina brought the replacements.. Hayden's. Cooper ended up using one of the McChord chutes. The FBI was looking for the wrong chute... The chute found in the south Fork Lewis R one mile from the general store and right next to the railroad may have been the chute Cooper used. It was rejected by the FBI and not collected. If Cooper did use an AAD chute and opened nearly immediately, what would the drift have been???

I am moving on to figure out the chute Cooper did take,, if people can't see that there is no way he took either of Hayden's I can't waste anymore time on what I already know to be settled, everything is posted to figure it out. Now, I found information to suggest there were two parachute deliveries to the plane. For Cooper to reject the chutes from McChord he had to have seen them. They may have been placed on the plane earlier and Tina brought the replacement back chutes on with the fronts. The FBI is hiding info and engaged in disinformation... they may have been doing it intentionally to keep chute info secret or they may have completely screwed this up.. I now think it is possible Cooper used a McChord chute with an AAD and probably contained a beeper.

YIKES, this is so simple. You guys have completely missed this for almost a decade and still can't see it right in front of you.. 60-9707 is only 6 digits...Steinthal in photo is 66-12982 consistent with most chutes. 226 matches nothing and proves nothing given those numbers... 60 = the year of the chute manufacture (not fabric manufacture), 9707 and 12982 is the S/N sequence number consistent with Steinthal parachute numbering system. The 226 is the S/N for the chute returned to Hayden, it is probably not a Steinthal chute. The FBI docs I've already posted match the S/N 226 for the chute returned to Hayden in 1975 to the one returned to Hayden. There is no question that the S/N for the chute returned to Hayden is 226. << that number suggests it is not a Steinthal. The packing card appears to be a new one with Hayden's chute. no others packed it prior to Cossey? the date on the strap pf Hayden's chute states APRIL 4/57 while the card states SEPT 9/57. that's also wrong. the "226" is carried over from the description above it..."26' ripstop conical 226" The packing card is not new, the reverse side has it packed by Cossey May 21, 1971.. I assume the card can be replaced anytime a chute is legally repacked. There is no issue there. Completely irrelevant. It was packed prior to NORJAK. I explained the problem with the misreading of descriptors on the packing card above, it is irrelevant, the data is correct you can see it on the card, if you still can't get it I can't help you. The date on the strap is for the harness not the parachute,, the parachute date is on the card Sept 1957. It is all there, you just can't see it for some reason. COOPER DID NOT USE EITHER OF HAYDEN"S CHUTES.. PERIOD, there is no way around it. So did he take Cossey's or McChord's,,, I may have figured that out,,,, The FBI has been looking for wrong chute, at least publicly.