georger

没人在乎！ Méi rén zàihū! Do you understand now ? Nobody cares, Robert. Your obsessions are not anyone's concern.

ok

'Radar wasn’t common until 1940 when the British were dealing with German air traffic over London. Before radar—which really didn’t make the ATC scene with great effect until the 1960s—controllers hovered over maps and plotted airliner progress as dispatchers phoned in position reports. Direct pilot-to-center radio communication wasn’t available until 1949. Controllers tracked aircraft progress with small “shrimp boats” pushed across the map. Each represented an airplane and had a clip holding a slip of paper with the call sign and altitude. Shrimp boats would serve well into the radar age on flat-top radar displays. Before digital data tags, controllers wrote aircraft data on the plastic data tags and gently nudged them across the scope.' https://www.avweb.com/recent-updates/business-military/atc-history/ 99 why dont you write the difinitive history on the topic.

You are correct.

Shrimp Boats - for R99 avionics expert. Let's add to R99's avionics education! Dr Edwards explained the term Rat used in one of his articles. The term Rat used derives from the early years of air traffic control. Rat was being humorous/sarcastic but he was also serious, in his use of the term ! He was telling controllers to mark his position and he was 1000% serious. See: http://web.mit.edu/6.933/www/Fall2000/mode-s/atc.html 'The controllers determined if there were any conflicts in route or altitude, and modified the flight plan to ensure safe separation of aircraft. When this was completed, the controllers would issue a clearance to the dispatcher and on to the pilot. The air traffic controllers would then write the flight plan information on a chalkboard and a note card, which was attached to a brass holder - the "shrimp boat". The shrimp boat (brass holder with card) was moved along an airway map to approximate the positions of aircraft in the sky, as the pilot called in his position. If the controller detected a potential conflict, it notified the aircraft of appropriate altitude and route changes through the dispatcher. '

Edwards explained the phrase 'shrimp boats' .... did you not read it and agree? Are Edwards credentials inferior to yours? Is his research flawed regarding shrimp boats ? Has the west path and promotion of it become a 'cult' ? A cult requiring special credentials ? What other proof do you have of a west path? The money find? What about the money find requires a west path ? Most of the known mechanisms which could place money at Tena Bar require or involve the area of east of V23, vs west of V23 ? You previously said "water flows down hill". The Columbia flows east to west by Tena Bar.

Edwards explained the phrase 'shripmboats' .... did you not read it and agree? Are Edwards credentials inferior to yours?

You are missing several crucial points required before you can process this issue. 1. You must come to this issue with *faithe*. Faithe in everything R99 and Ulis may say. Every word is crucial. Record every syllable R99 prints and play it back later many many many times. 2. R99 has said the FAA has the missing documents which will prove a west path. So you must get the FAA to release that secret documents, or documents. That may take a Presidential or a Congressional order. Good luck with that. 3. Assuming the FAA does release its secret document(s), assuming those docs even exist, then the document(s) may not say what 88 and Ulis say they must say. Faith now become a critical factor again. 4. You must believe every word R99 and Ulis say, without any hesitation or impure spirit or doubt. 5. Or, you can wait for some other development in the DB Cooper case - which is doubtful. It may take forever. 6. But, you must dismiss and not even consider any and all other evidence however remotely connected to this flight path issue (Tena Bar money, hydrology, evaluations and post by other people, visions and posts on this topic by others including this one, ...). You cannot stray from the Word as given by R99/Ulis. They are the only people on Earth with the credentials to speak on this matter. .. Have your loved ones take photos of you before this journey starts so they will remember you as you once were before entering this Black Hole. Good luck with your journey. Report back if you can. Goldstone has instruments recording your journey and will issue updates to CNN every month .... if nothing is heard from you in five years this mission may be terminated and services for you held ... I am not kidding. This is only the beginning of your journey with R99 and Ulis! Good luck. PS: Oh! and funding for this mission may end without notice. You will have to make your own arrangements regarding that .... no help with that is available. Likewise, R99 and Ulis are free to change or revise their theories/accounts at any time.

The 'everyone has a grudge' theory. The mass of men live lives of quiet desperation. Goldfinger. He's the man, the man with the Midas touch. A spider's touch. Such a cold finger. Beckons you to enter his web of sin. But don't go in. Stay home and wash the dishes instead! That is the only choice you have. Cooper could not control his hormones. And Rataczak saved the Golden Maiden. (from herself!) ? The plot thickens. There is a secret flight path, a western flight path, that authorities unnamed have hidden all these years! The pure and uncorrupted know it because only they can sense it! The just and uncorrupted will triumph in the end ... so touch the stone of redemption and take on this knowledge. All you have to lose is your chains. Seeing makes one free.

Its all relative. Wally told us about it. I have no idea where he got it! Not the faintest idea. My impression is during the time the flight test was being planned lots of people were juggling ideas and discussing thoughts and impressions ... the military people were not just standing around taking orders but there were discussions back and forth between the military people, NWA people, the FBI, etc. One gets the picture of complex free flowing discussions happening between all of the parties ......... that informality surprised me a little. There was also discussion about Mr Cooper, hijackers, recidivism among hijackers, etc., and would Cooper strike again all based on the theme of a true grudge. When grudges rise to the level of an actual hijacking, grudges dont easily go away? In your profession you might have some thoughts about that? Would be interesting to know your thoughts !!!

The goal is actual information about the hijacker ? I use the Una Bomber case as an example because a classmate of mine was personally involved in the case, actually knew and interacted with Ted Kaczynski, followed the una bomber case etc., but did not know Kaczynski living a few miles away was the Una Bomber, until the FBI broke the case using Ted's Manifesto. Then it all made sense. My friend wrote his book about the case. It took concrete evidence to break the case. All psychological profiling of the una bomber failed until the very end when more concrete information was all but certain. The same will probably apply to the DB Cooper. A tangible tip lead to McCoy's identification and capture ... vs. psychological profiling. At the same time the Cooper hijacking occurred, social science was developing and using The Dictionary of Occupational Titles. I had a copy of the DOT sitting next to my desk in 1971. We used it to try and match Voc Rehab clients with potential job and training programs prior to recommending funding for a client. DB Cooper fits some occupational profile, but which one ? There is no vita for DB Cooper. (A digital version of the DOT still exists today) (Wally reported) Someone suggested a test during the Flight Test of N467US suggesting a test that might estimate Cooper's IQ. A discussion ensued and the test was not conducted because of the uncertain methodology being suggested. Tina had failed to get the rear door open and the stairs down - Cooper sent Tina to the front and then got the door open and the stair released himself - light went on in the cockpit. How much intelligence did it take to solve that puzzle and get the rear door open and the stairs released? Tina's IQ is estimated at slightly above 100 - average IQ. Could an average untrained person do it in say 2 or 5 or 10 or 20 minutes? The test was bypassed because nobody was certain what the correlation is between IQ and performance in that test. That test had never been standardised for people to use to estimate with! Has anyone ever tried tracing letters to the editor to Cooper? Manifestos? Threat notes? etc It worked in the Una Bomber case - it might just work in the Cooper case ? Several guys talk about this in the new Discovery channel program.

I sometimes opt for humor when things get totally crazy. No one is going to match Nicholson's credentials or his superiority. That was proven years ago and he still brings it up. Most people dont care and continue to try and post and discuss anyway. But, a few of us actually found R99 impossible to deal with years ago, and the record reflects that. I see nothing in the Cooper case that is a life or death matter! Others see it differently, have different tolerance levels, different expectations, and act accordingly. Math seems to be asking for a psychological evaluation of Cooper? People with credentials to do that? My personal bias is there is so little known about Cooper any guess at his psychological makeup would be just that - a guess. We already saw the FAA Psychiatrist fail badly in his prediction about what Cooper would do. His 'diagnosis' was probably based on some profile at the time. So much for profiles. We also do not have the full testimony Tina provided concerning her whole time with Cooper, every event that occurred during that period, and Cooper's reactions on all of those occasions. I wish I had five hours to spend with Tina, or even better five days - to get more insight into Mr Cooper based on a whole long series of events Tina witnessed Cooper performing through. My bias is 'performance' and how people perform during situations and in problem solving. I just dont think we have enough information to psychologically place or evaluate DB Cooper with any reliability. That is not a hedge on my part. I think we need a lot more information... just as we need more hard evidence. Prints, dna, voice print, etc. Likewise, a very wise man once said to me: credentials are as credentials do. (I think his name was Forest Gump). Take it or leave it.

Read the thread. I was licensed by the Iowa DPI as a psychologist-evaluator and testing coordinator 1970-74. It was a total surprise based on course work I had done in grad school... I had taken a job with Voc Rehab. I have nothing to match R99's Mishegas. I recommend that the US Justice Dept and the FBI fire Paul Soderlind and the USAF and hire Robert Nicholson and Eric Ulis, instead. Put George Santos in charge of all DB Cooper discussion, under the authority of ... King Charles and Tucker Carlson. Amen! additional reading ps: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leonhard_Euler

I may address this nonsense later tonight when I have time. Essentially, I come from a family of engineers, educators, and military people. My father retired from the USAF at a base in Georgia in 1966; my mother served until 1944. All of my uncles served during WWII. My step father was an engineer with Paton, landed at Normandy, and went all the way to Berlin. I just find it interesting (if not comical !) that You and Mr. Ulis claim to have better insight and more information than engineers like Paul Soderlind, the USAF, flight controllers, etal, concerning not only the flight path of flight 305 but other aspects of the DB Cooper case, in addition to making social judgements and clinical diagnoses of people you two deem competitors on DB Cooper forums, etc ! Those are tall claims ! I sometimes wonder if you guys haven't formed a cult and will soon be announcing 'commandments' from Heaven, in a standoff with the members of the Eddyville Women's Swimming Club ............... given your superior knowledge and history in "swimming and quantum mechanics " ? Give me some time to get to the grocery store and think this over as I move from the meat counter to the vegetable aisle! Maybe I will have a REVELATION ! ???

Thanks to OleMiss for copying this! From History's Greatest Mysteries, 2020: Ammerman: We knew it was a hijacking. We didn't have a flight plan on it because nobody knew exactly what the routing was going to be. So we were told "Just follow him. Keep everybody else away from him." It became fairly obvious that he was on Victor-23. Ulis: The first priority here when tackling this case is trying to figure out the path that the jet took. Can you gauge precisely how you could identify the exact location of Flight 305? Ammerman: Yeah. What I'm looking at is a map on a video screen. Aircraft are being presented in what would look to you like an equal sign. On the leading slash, the aircraft itself could be anyplace on that line. So it could be in the center, it might be at the left side of the line, it might be at the right side. We don't know. Ulis: Any idea of roughly what kind of distance you're looking at there? Ammerman: I would guess four to five nautical miles long, that line is. Ulis: How do you know that he's actually within Victor 23 if you've got sort of that much play there? Ammerman: Sure. It's very uncertain just exactly where the airplane was within that target area that we're seeing. Conclusion: On the leading slash, the aircraft itself could be anyplace on that line. So it could be in the center, it might be at the left side of the line, it might be at the right side. We don't know. It's very uncertain just exactly where the airplane was within that target area that we're seeing.

Then why do you keep attacking me - for years! Are you jealous of me or obsessed with me personally? What's the nature of your obsession going on now for years ? We went through this crap with Jo Weber and then Robert Blevins .... there is nothing about the DB Cooper case that requires obsessive-compulsive behavior or extremism! What's your connection to the Cooper case? Any? Do you have any tangible connection to the case? Family that were involved in the State of Washington or anywhere else? A relative in the FBI or Law Enforcement who worked on the case? Anything ? You have always claimed 'special credentials in avionics et-cetera' you say no one else has to bring to the case? It must be your personality ? What else could it be ?

ok ... you will never contribute anything to the DB Cooper case!

I never said any such thing - So, list the ranges and resolutions (areas covered) etc Ammerman used during his control of 305 etal ? Give us blip size vs area at each resolution. You use the term 'ranges'. Tell how blip (symbol) size changes with each different resolution/range? Huh? Huh? What range and blip size are we seeing during the Ammerman/Ulis questioning? Are the examples shown us in the A/Ulis segment the same images A actually saw during the time period Ulis is asking about? Where on the FlightPath is 305 in the radar image History showd us during the Ulis/Amm. segment? I will bet neither you or Ulis knows! Was that image anywhere near Tena Bar? My guess is Robt, you dont know squat about this! Surprise us for a change. Get off your throne !

That could happen, some day, sometime. Anything is possible! Even cows flying over the Moon dropping $20 dollar bills! But, the SIZE OF THE PLOT ON A RADAR SCREEN is artificial, and NOT an indicator of actual 'position' ! You might as well use the size of the door knobs in the room! That claim by Ulis is total nonsense. Its an idea that only a huckster would come up with! That is 'casino trickery' meant to stack the odds in favor of the House, and the House is Ulis trying to maneuver Ammerman into a position Ulis wants! The answers Ulis wants. That is the Putin premise: Nothing is true and everything is possible! In addition - the size of plots/images on a radar screen are adjustable to the users needs/wants. So when Ulis asks about the SIZE of the 305 plot, he might have also asked: which knob adjusts the size? That probably never dawned on him. Moreover R99 is well aware of this and has left it out of the discussion, socalled. Has anyone here ever run an oscilloscope or a radar screen ? The size of the plot for 305 and other planes on any radar screen was not a precise metric. Which is actually kind of funny. Its like a mistake a child would make (assume). Which raises the question: did Ammerman have controls where he could switch between screen resolutions? And did he switch resolutions at any point while following 305 etal ?

We need a plot of 305 against the scale of the Solar System or the Universe! 305 could have flown near/over Jupiter ! Ulis is playing games with this.

Is there a transcription of the actual exchange between Ammerman and Ulis? Who says what ? Ulis is pushing A to say what he wants A to say ... but A never says 305 flew over Tea Bar. All of this is old newz... Ulis even asks A how big the radar plot symbols are on the screen, how many MILES big .... Ulis is pushing A to come up with anything Ulis can use!

OK.

Its obvious when someone is trying to engineer or force the result they want. That was particularly true of the exchanges between Ammerman and Ulis. Ulis wants Cooper to have jumped anywhere near Tena Bar in order to explain the Ingram money find. Colbert wants the Ingrams to have been addicts who were lead by their drug dealer to go to Tena Bar and 'dig here' ... and five days later the money is found! (It either happened or it didn't!) And of course the drug dealer doesnt fit the Cooper profile/sketch. Imagine what this case would be like without Tom Kaye! It would be pure witchcraft! Bad actors have no business trying to capture the Cooper case! The case is bigger than one actor.

The new History channel program at 8:00 cdt with Darren et al was interesting, thought provoking, and very well done, by all involved. This program brings everyone up to date with the newest generation of researchers working on the DB Cooper case. I thought everyone involved was excellent. Its a program worth watching and a welcome surprise! It was flanked by repeats of older Cooper programing beginning with the Colbert-Rackstraw/ Mucklow program where the FBI closes the case, and another program closing the evening with Ulis chaos. We turned away to another channel and then CNN and local news ...

All of that is subjective - Im talking about physical evidence. Like the money find at Tena Bar. There are only a few options for that happening given the flight path and the drop zone.