georger

Come on, Bruce. 'Monumentous' my eye. Don't you use Google? I read your article. That find was all over the newspapers in 1988. ***** etc. There is much truth to your statement, Robert. Yes, the pliot chute find was distributed widely at the time in the media, and I remember seeing a YouTube clip about it a couple of years ago. Funny, I never connected it when Galen was telling me his story, as I recalled the video characterizing the find as an inconsequential piece of parachute fabric. Galen's analysis casts the find in a wholly new light, in my judgement. Hence, the Oh Wow! quality of my writing, which I gather you are enjoying more and more!!! Perhaps you might say that the most newsworthy bit of my piece is that Galen never knew about the pilot chute until he read about it in Tosaw's note books 20-plus years later and received Georger's newspaper clip. I find it a hoot that Galen worked with Tosaw for years and was kept so much in the dark. Proves that not all DB Cooper crazies live solely on the DZ, eh? Is there some confusion going on? There have been several discoveries of "fabric" pulled from the Columbia and presented at various times. At least three. Two of these alleged to be part of Cooper chute and I think prior to 1980. Then the 'pilot chute' found in 88, a separate find. I will pull the articles on the other finds and post them... Then there was another incident: a young boy who told his father he had seen 'cloth hanging from a tree' in the Shillapoo area? The father reported this to authorities but no one could ever find the tree again ? There was an article about that ...

377 is undoubtedly right about this being a flare chute. And an excellent place for this chute to start its journey to the Tena Bar area is the Yakima Firing Center east of Yakima, WA. The Yakima Firing Center is bounded on the west by the Yakima River, which later joins the Columbia River, and on the east by the Columbia River itself. These artillery flares included the flare itself and a small parachute, with both having to fit inside a 105mm howitzer shell along with the "nose cone" and protective means to separate them from the powder bags. That chute may have started its journey downstream even before the Cooper hijacking. Robert99 That would be very interesting a connection if true! That would be a very long difficult transport by water - but maybe Cooper had a connection to this ordinance center? Machinist?

And yet...look who made up a BS story about it, trying to foist off some lame 'under 40 years of investigative dust' claim and link it to another BS story about shards being found the month before Brian Ingram in the same area? (Corners only, of course) That story smells worse than a month-dead salmon. Do you and Farflung cherry-pick on who you call BS on, or do you have a list of folks who you tacitly accept, no matter what crap they try to foist off on you? If I tried pushing off these stories on this forum, and did it in the phony-baloney way Cook did, well...let's just say it would be an ugly thing indeed. Once again Blevins you either are not aware of or dismiss actual history, namely: all kinds of people have speculated wondering if others found money at Tina Bar, ever since the Ingram find. Speculators and curiosity seekers became a real problem following the Ingram find, and had to be turned away. Then after the formal excavation the bart was closed for a time ... there have always been 'rumors' that other money was found, prior and then after the Ingram find. The Ingram find spured Tosaw and others to speculate that the area was even contain Cooper's remains ... The issues are larger than any one person. Galen or Tosaw or Rainey or Jones or Pringle etal. There have been tens of theories by hundreds of people. That's the historical record - As a self-professed Man of Letters, I would think you would be excited by this, not repulsed. Perhaps you are in the wrong business, with the wrong creden- ials, to make any contribution in this whole matter. There is nothing written in the stars that anyone needs make special accomodation or permission from you ... in this whole matter. Quite obviously, you think the same of all of us! It is deeply personal with you, for some mysterious reason beyond the scope of this thread or the Cooper case. Everyone sees your struggle. The same can be said of Jo Weber. Whatever you are trying to prove, it doesnt seem to be working for you personally.

And I'm saying that Cook misrepresented the information in his statements for the article. I believe he dipped into that 'patch' story in an effort to support his OTHER allegation about the 'corner-only money shards'. Then he dressed up the patch story to make the whole package look better. Quote Blevins you are FOS. Your socalled "PATCH" story is just one of a number of articles published at the time and the only one I can find that mentions PATCH, is the one you presented - This fits your bias. If you want to blame someone blame me. I am the one who brought this to Galen's attention. Galen didnt even know about it. The small chute was identified by Earl Cossey as a possible flare chute - not by Cook or Tosaw! Cook wasnt even on that expedition. Tosaw wasnt even present when it was found by Rainey. Ive talked to Rainey. (part of my "scores of interviews".) Ive talked to another person who was involved and a kid at the time learning diving and salvage ... happens to own a small dive shop today. My only disagreement with Galen about this is I was told the FBI wound up with the chute, in their evidence file, not Tosaw or Tosaw's family. The FBI definately got to see it . . . up close and personal. There are other aspects of this story Galen isnt telling (yet). I he doesn't then at length I may. Like Farf says: we are just discussing things. Trying to review history and sort through things. We dont need a minute-by-minute review and rebuke from you. Thank you very much... Look at the photo of the thing, See the strings at each corner? You say it had no strings wherever you got or invented that! How would you know? Look at the photo. See the strings? Care to revise your statements/propoganda?

I found those articles in less than 30 seconds on my first Google search. You found them after Bruce posted about the find - Here is the Spokane Chronicle version of the story.

That's why I am so interested in finding out if the MAC SOG jumpers in Nam were able to use essentially AM broadcast band very low power sigs to rendevous. Conventional wisdom would lead you to much higher freqs where small antennas work well. Maybe they thought out of the box and made it work. 377 Im willing to bet they didn't. Efficiency very very low. Distance zero. Natural Interference. Selectivity. Antenna issues. etc etc. You might as well conduct SETI on AM ... or VLF for that matter. Out of the box at those wavelengths would be the submarine vlf nets which require power like a small M-class star and underground antennas strung from the North Pole to the South Pole! And rattle the teeth and the brain cells of reindeer herds. Something that could tap into that system and be heard for a relay back .. that would be 'out of the box' at those low freqs and cost the GNP of Portugal!

5. Cooper rejected military parachutes from the USAF at McChord AFB. It was common knowledge at that time that the USAF pilots and crewmen in Southeast Asia were using parachutes with radio beacons and that they could be tracked by search and rescue aircraft. Cooper may have known this, guessed that the McChord chutes would be so equipped, and he would probably would have been right (thanks to the efforts of the FBI). Robert99 I think 5 above is a very good point.. I thnk we know??? the chutes from McChord were not forthcoming anyway, thus had to resort to a private supplier ?

Don't you just hate it? We finally agree on something. I read a bundle of cute explanations by Cook that basically say not a whole lot in the way of hard information. And that type of behavior puts me on guard about that alleged information right away. Sounds like more fodder for another appearance on Coast-to-Coast AM radio. ' Any feeding frenzy is premature. The whole story could be true. I simply raised questions which need to be answered. The answers may come. Or may not. Galen has been working on this for months. Only the announcement is new. Im simply asking questions, not even the hard questions (yet), not passing judgement out of the box, like you. There is virtually nothing to agree or disagree about yet.

If Galen Cook and Richard Tosaw carefully noted the locations where the money and shards were found and the elevations above sea level (or some other vertical reference), then they may have made some significant progress on determining "where" the bills came from. For instance, if the money and shards were found at different heights on the shore or at different depths in the sand, then that would suggest that they arrived at different times. And those different times imply repeatabilty. In view of all the other factors in play, repeatability would imply in turn that the money came from the same source and that the source was relatively fixed and very near Tena Bar. Robert99 Several things are interesting: (a) Palmer's expertise in "shoreline process", as GC puts it, did not have Palmer do any lab work that is known, or saying anything about erosion on the beach which he examined ... then whisked off just months later to the St Helens event to be one of the prime experts on the scene in matters of - "erosion"! When "erosion" at T_Bar was one of the key factors at issue, one would think. The word "erosion" does not ever appear, in the Palmer report. Shoreline process by definition involves erosion. (b) Shards in a "discovery hole". What is a "hole" in this context? I hope this "hole" was not a mind- melded realisation but has some factual dimension? (c) Corner pieces. Stands in contrast to the naturally decayed money Ingram found. Indicates a separate process or same process? It was the corners that allowed the identification of the bills as twenties - corners are about the last thing one would expect to find in a deposit of 'the Ingram kind' if Ingram's bills set the paradigm ? (d) How could anyone go to Tina Bar today and locate the exact spot and "hole" that existed in 1980 but does not remotely exist in physical form today? Some 30 feet of beachfront has ceased to exist since 1980, according to Tom Kaye! Were Galen and the boys standing in the water? Galen needs to provide a map and a few more details if we are to take this seriously -

Why? (a) Yer the self-annointed windbag? (b) you own and work this street? (c) mary had a liddle lamb? (d) you thought you stared in Taxi Driver? No to All of the Above. And the questions were directed to me from Meyer, not you. So I answered them. Tough. Get over it. Meyer: I saw your post above. If you didn't want a response to your questions, then you shouldn't have inserted my name into your post. I'm not a mind-reader, you know. Now I understand. I'll just ignore your questions or comments from now on. Thanks for setting me straight on that. "If I'd observed all the rules, I'd never have got anywhere..." Marilyn Monroe "If I'd observed all the rules, I'd never have got anywhere..." Marilyn Monroe "If I'd observed all the rules, I'd never have got anywhere..." Marilyn Monroe "If I'd observed all the rules, I'd never have got anywhere..." Marilyn Monroe Bookie bookie - you wanna bookie? Me lower price. Only TWO DOLLA! bOOKIE BOOKIE - "Into The Blast - The True Story of D.B. Cooper - Revised Edition" only two dolla!

Georger: No, you should ask Tom Kaye about this, since you are the one curious about it@! Robert replies to this: YOU were the one who brought it up. I couldn't care less. I only heard something about a possible CS team book later. No, you brought it up. So you could bring it up again. So you could bring it up again. So you could bring it up again. So you could bring it up again. You have a whole stable of: So you could bring it up again. So you could bring it up again. Hey sailor, you wanna numma one bookie-bookie? You liek - only five dolla. "Into The Blast - The True Story of D.B. Cooper - Revised Edition" Only five dolla. Bookie-bookie. You wanna?

Why? (a) Yer the self-annointed windbag? (b) you own and work this street? (c) mary had a liddle lamb? (d) you thought you stared in Taxi Driver?

Georger says in part: You should ask Tom Kaye about this. My understanding about the phrase 'This is business now,' refers to the idea that the CS team was considering their own book on the research they did. I keep wondering why you pick on book writers so much. Like the books on Amelia Earhart, (many and legend) there might be some truth here and there mixed in with the speculation. The only non-fiction crime-type book I ever read that I considered almost completely accurate was All The President's Men. Anyone who is investigating anything, planning to do interviews, or considering a career in journalism should read it. Seriously. No, you should ask Tom Kaye about this, since you are the one curious about it@! Now confess. You have a year's supply of Twinkie's hidden somewhere? With the rest of your Survivalist gear and a copy of "Inquisitions for Dummies" ... Your persistent problem apparently in life, is you dont know the difference between "book writers" and "pimps". Or doing research and writing a book vs. pimping. I support legitimate book writers. I don;t support PIMPS! This distinction is akin to the difference between shit and gold. Something most people learn very early in life! Your nose may be out of joint (out of wack). It could be a permanent condition you and your fellow &*&%s will have to learn to cope with, or find another hobby, while devoting renewed energy and devotion to your primary source of being you discovered somewhere along the way - housecleaning. In your case, we shall not go up and down together. You need to get over your personal political delusions. We are, for all practical purposes, different species.

No. Geoff WAS given access to FBI files. At least thats my understanding ... Are you a Notre Dame fan?

Nice work Galen and Bruce. Glad its out.

Well how DARE YOU! challenge my brilliance, daring- do, hi character, extreme integrity credibility, and some such like manifestations of nobility and charisma! Keep in mind small son, I was born and raised in the great State of Washington, in and near the bailout zone of DB Cooper, which is one helluva a lot more than you can claim ... and how do I know? Because YOU SAID SO! So blame yourself; for a change. Im about to go out for a chicken dinner, which is a helluva lot more than I can say for you sitting there in your speedos, shower cap, and no shoes on.. waiting for hot water to boil on your stove! quote: "Ninny Nanny Noo-noo" Marilyn Monroe.

Now do you see WHY I am glad the FBI didnt let anyone touch the Amboy chute much less look at it? One less thing (potentially) to be fucked up -

Once I learned about Tom’s discovery of titanium sponge, I asked him about it. He refers me to his lawyer. “This is business now,” he says. “Once it’s business, the guns come out."" Wow, Tom sounds real OBJECIVE with lawyers protecting HIS business (Citizen Sleuths) with GUNS. Why not let Marla check the chute and see if it looks like the one her uncle talked about? Or let Cook give his analysis, since he is an outside source too! You might want to read ‘Skyjack’ because it throws a pretty harsh light on the characters involved. By harsh I don’t mean inaccurate, it just shows them for what they are. When Tom says “This is business now,” I think he's talking about the integrity and independence of the CS Team and its work product vis-a-vis its mandate with the FBI, and confidentiality, and not some external financial-business plan the team had. It was Geoff and Crown Publishing with the "Business plan", right from the start! Geoff's account above is a 'minimalist' accounting of all that actually happened over a period of time, not some single transaction as he portrays it, to his distinct advantage! Because, there was no "Titanium Sponge" that had been found and identified at that point as an all- encompassing fact. Geoff was wrong. Geoff's statement is a miss-identification and spreading of false incomplete information, just as he was wrong about "two types of silver in the money", etc etc etc. Never mind his breaking of confidences ... it merely defines the different missions Tom vs. Gray were on and the conflict between their missions. Geoff is a book writer - not a forensic researcher. Confidentiality was at stake and Geoff/Crown Pub. very clearly violated those protocols for the sake having something to make a book with, to sell. All under the hubris of Geoff Gray being a 'REPORTER"? The financial "business" was with Geoff and Crown Publishing; so far as I know the CS Team had no financial plans at all. Its all history now. Had Geoff Gray/Crown Publihsing not had some kind of official or semi-official relationship with the FBI, to write some kind of offcial history? of the DB Cooper case, been given acces to FBI files etc., none of this would have come up at all and the CS Team would have had no reason to comunicate with writer, Mr. Gray, at all. Why was private book writer Geoff Gray given access to FBI files at all? That whole thing is fucked up - Tom and his CS Team performed their mission. Book writer Geoff Gray/Crown Publishing wrote their damned book! So, if you want to know if the chute is silk or nylon or cheescloth, ask the accountant at Crown Publishing or Geoff Grays's girlfriend, or RobertMBlevins esq. !

I did a fair amount of work on that chute story in the Newsvine article. I could be wrong on it...but at least someone questioned it beyond taking the word of Earl Cossey. Somebody HAD to, since the Lt. Walling story the FBI tried using to explain it didn't make sense. After I realized it didn't jive, it was like that quote from the film The Outlaw Josey Wales: "If I'd observed all the rules, I'd never have got anywhere..." Marilyn Monroe I was here at DZ when the chute was found - there was a lengthy discussion of the matter that lasted months. You arrived much later. I cant see that you have raised anything new - new to you maybe - but not new to us. You arent the first person to look at a map! Or ask about silk vs nylon. I even posted photos of silk vs nylon threads, etc. Or question Cossey (for a whole slate of reasons most of which you havent even cited and apparently arent aware of...). Or question and research the Waling story... Ckret was here at the time and was questioned. You can go back and read the thread but I cant see you've raised anything new to this forum that wasnt already covered or asked before. You are the first to publish an "article" about it on Newsvine. Ive told you a million times to go back and read the thread ........ rather than claiming to have re-discovered the wheel (over and over again). The fact that Tom Kaye credits you with being the first to bring out or question the distinction betwene silk vs nylon, is just ridiculous and only points to Mr Kaye being out of touch, literally. We previously discussed silk vs nylon here until we were blue in the face, even cracked jokes about it at the FBI's expense, to which 377 laughed.... How could Kaye have missed it! ??? That's just the way Tom is sometimes. Carol may not have even been on Tom's team yet .... Ckret didn't miss it! Snowmman didn't miss it ... 377 didnt miss it, etc etc etc... there really is no need to even continue with this rehash of old-news. READ THE THREAD! You might as well claim to have founded this thread on Dropzone.com ... which followed the previous threads on .......... never mind. Ask Snowmman! You have a contact for him ...

weyyyulllll,,, here we go! .... I recall this gentleman Mr. TeBow ......... ... Let's just say for the sake of argument if TT could win then A.L. should have won, x12 times over! The fix was in ? The pros will sort that nonsense out! I could not agree with you more. And we have LOTS of company. I am a huge AL fan.

Sadism.

This could be moot. It was a Thanksgiving family gathering. However, even though LD was supposedly injured and bleeding for Thanksgiving, neither her sister, brother, or mother will confirm any part of her story, not even the comics on the wall story. Neither her sister, brother, or mother will confirm any part of the very small house was hanging on the wall. The UFO Blevins writes about might have been the house coming and going ... After landing in an English speaking part of French Canada, probably Iceland. But not before 1974. Its in the secret operant conditioning of all secret siblings of which LD had four - Righhhht. That made a LOT of sense. When I suggest that your credibility might be suffering, that post is one of the reasons why. Unless it's just your way of telling everyone you believe Marla's story. In that case, you should stop waffling and say so. Can't have it both ways. Can't pick on the points against it without giving a reason. Or if you do, then it stands to reason you believe her. And if so...you should say why. If you don't believe it's relevant that none of Marla's family members, who were Present and Accounted For on Thanksgiving...will verify even ONE piece of her tale...then you shouldn't even be investigating the case. GEE Mr. Obvious. Smurf 'n Turf. Pound sand. Speak your mind. With Venom . But dont shoot the moon. "If I'd observed all the rules, I'd never have got anywhere..." Marilyn Monroe When I suggest that your credibility might be suffering, that post is one of the reasons why. Do you often repeat yourself? Could be a sign of the Obvious. Mr. Obvious. When I suggest that your credibility might be suffering, that post is one of the reasons why.

This could be moot. It was a Thanksgiving family gathering. However, even though LD was supposedly injured and bleeding for Thanksgiving, neither her sister, brother, or mother will confirm any part of her story, not even the comics on the wall story. Neither her sister, brother, or mother will confirm any part of the very small house was hanging on the wall. The UFO Blevins writes about might have been the house coming and going ... After landing in an English speaking part of French Canada, probably Iceland. But not before 1974. Its in the secret operant conditioning of all secret siblings of which LD had four -

I question claims. I don't have a 'campaign'. My favorite war film is running tonight on AMC. Gotta go. Vet's Day and all. "If I'd observed all the rules, I'd never have got anywhere..." Marilyn Monroe Thanks for your contribution to your Cable Company. Veterans Day was on Sunday the 11th. Today is the 13th, on my calendar ? It is "known" the money could not have arrived at Tena Bar before 1974, and today is November the 11th Veteran's Day. All in one evening!

I don't have a campaign against Marla. I simply question her claims. Her own testimony, her Facebook posts, and other items demand it. 'I couldn't care less about Marla,' you say. Your posts say you do. Check-in time at the Reality Hotel: Do you believe her story or not? If so, why? You sort of sidestepped that question, didn't you? I think viewers would like an answer. "If I'd observed all the rules, I'd never have got anywhere..." Marilyn Monroe Is that a campaign against me now? Viewers would like an answer? You now speak for VIEWERS!? I gave you an answer, numbnuts. Why did you plant this falsehood: "It is known that the money could not have arrived before 1974" ? Viewers would like an answer to that ! BTW: Why dont you send Geoff Gray some angry email asking why HE is tacitly backing Marla's appearance!? Apparantly Geoff does not agree with your viewpoint? Which then brings into question your defending him, since the two of you disagree so fundamentally ... Your campaign against Marla is rediiculous. Its like one egg calling another egg an "eggplant"! And two cocks having a cockfight in the middle of the square. You aint Hamlet, King Arthur!