georger

That could be interesting. How many chutes does Hayden have that he says were selected for Cooper. One or two? It has to be one if Cooper used the other one? Correct?

Play it again Sam.

Other experts? Okay. Name ONE. And not 'every account' says that. Just the last couple of articles done on the event, only one day before they wrote it off completely for good. And in none of those articles or releases does it say that these experts had a hand in it. Only Cossey is mentioned. In the articles where the 'experts' are mentioned, the FBI rep only says they are GOING to do it. No one knows if they really did. Beats me. Ask the people who wrote the articles and the FBI, I guess. Havent we been over this conspiracy ground of yours 1 million times and still you have made no progress with it.. You do know the FBI does not live to make internet super sleuths and book writers happy. don;t you? ?

Smokin and Georger, If Cossey's back pack had a left-hand pull, which was rather unusual for that day, then perhaps it suggests that Cooper was left handed and selected the NB-6 for that reason. Robert99 That has been suggested before. Nobody has ever addressed this, so far as I know. Likewise, did one of Hayden's chute have this strange left hand hard pull, if he owned both chutes? It must have ? Or are we now talking about two guys and four chutes! ... and where this ends nobody knows. except that one serial number matches one of Hayden's chutes ? I can already hear the answer: No. Hayden's chutes do not have a lefthand hard pull, debated for months re- the Cossey chute Cooper chose. Therefore: Marla made it all up! I keep wondering what progress Gray has made with this, if any? Or maybe he has more info we don;t have?

I took a lot of heat about it. That's okay, but let's remember that it was Cossey who was the main source for saying the Amboy chute wasn't Cooper's. Quote We don't know that at all! You take heat because every account says 'Cossey and other experts'. What is there about "other experts" you don;t understand or keep refusing to accept, and why ?

I don't think there is dispute that Hayden owned them (at least one of them) (See the pdf file, plus the Hayden chute's serial number matches the serial number posted by ckret (from the intact chute that was left on the plane) I also don't think there is dispute about who packed them AND who probably had knowledge of them - Cossey was the rigger, it was Cossey's seal. The only dispute is that the story changed from what was in the FBI file (chutes came from Issaquah and hayden) to chutes came from Issaquah and Cossey. The pdf and Carr originally say that Hayden had the two chutes in question and put them in the cab. Tosaw says that the cab picked them up from Boeing where Cossey had left them. Cossey (and Carr revised) says that the two in question came from Cossey's house. What is the date of the PDF? Is it possible whoever wrote the pdf didn't have all of the facts straight. Two front reserve chutes came from Issaquah. Emerick is named. But in another account Emerick was not there at the time, and some woman is named as the person who actually got the chutes off a shelf and gave them to the WHP. Cossey explained later that was how the dud training reserve got selected, because Emerick wasn't there and would have known better. All of these versions are back in the thread - Tosaw's words are: " "Cossey told Lee that he had recently packed two back chutes and that he could pick them up at nearby Boeing Field." I guess it is possible that Cossey had recently packed Hayden's chutes and used them. Ownership is then generic for Cossey, and literal for Hayden? Or Haden had them, but Cossey had recently packed them? The dispute is: 'who' sent the chutes off to Boeing field.? Hayden or Cossey? Who had the chutes in-hand to send?

New article on Mr. Cossey... http://www.kirotv.com/news/news/former-relative-says-hell-be-surprised-if-man-kill/nXZ72/

Smokin99! You are certainly SMOKIN' today. I think you're on to something very important, and it jives with a PM that I just received from Snowmman, who advises me to consult with Tosaw, p. 14. "Lee phoned Cossey at his home and told him about the emergency and that they needed two back and two chest parachutes. Cossey told Lee that he had recently packed two back chutes and that he could pick them up at nearby Boeing Field." So, it appears that once upon a time Cossey's story jived exactly with the Hayden scenario. Then Cossey changed his story and interjected himself into the saga and the investigation. In 2009-2011 Cossey told me that he was home when NWO called, he owned the two chutes and they were at his home and then he put them into a taxi that headed to Boeing Field. He never explained to me why he didn't send them to Sea-Tac. At least that is what I heard Earl tell me. He denied ever knowing Hayden. He said that NWO paid him for his chutes. From then on Earl became the go-to-guy for Cooper parachute questions. He became in effect the FBI's tech spokesperson. He also helped shape the FBI's new narrative that DBC was a fool and died in the jump, using the "NB-8 is an inferior chute" as ruse. It worked for 40 years, but has been unraveling over the past two years. That demise also threatens the FBI who have relied on Cossey to shore up their spin story on Cooper. Quote new format has this all screwed up! Key in the above are Cossey's words: "Cossey told Lee that he had recently packed two back chutes and that he could pick them up at nearby Boeing Field." had recently packed two chutes From Coss' perspective they were 'his' chutes. From Hayden's perspective maybe he owned them!? Maybe Cossey grabbed what he had and was confident in. Isn't that what one of Cossey's friends posted here years ago? That is was an emergency, a mad scramble. He only had two chutes he was confident in. But one had been modified for his personal use (left hand hard pull) and he forgot about this at the time, then worried about it later . . . Maybe Hayden and Cossey both sent two back pack chutes!? You may have misunderstood what Cossey was saying and he may even have been pulling your leg? Maybe he didn't want to be talking with you about this at all ?

Here's what I think about the chutes, based on my reading of the posts. When ckret/Carr was reading from the files, he posted that though all four were packed by Cossey, 2 of the chutes actually came from Issaquah and two of the chutes came from an unnamed person who now has ownership - courtesy of a cab. Then approx 6 months later, two of the chutes came directly from Cossey, from his house. Now, folks can say what they will on this forum, and yes, in the scheme of things, it might appear to be a small thing, but the two statements just plain don't match. My supposition is that Carr got the original information from the files, and then he changed it after he talked to Cossey (he interviewed Cossey and was quite taken with him per his posts). This was in the time frame of the story changing, if I remember correctly. Hey, I'm not saying that Carr decided to go with a 40 year old memory as opposed to what was written in the FBI files from interviews of the time.....but it sure looks that way. Is that good procedure or not? Frankly, I don't know. Inconsequential? Don't know that either. But yeah, in my mind, just sayin, it kind of raises some questions. I think Mr. Burnham's account jibes with other's accounts and has to be taken as factual, which explains the reserves, ie. "What I remember hearing was that the WSP drove out to the clubhouse and picked up parachutes (must have been the reserves) and took them to the airport. Linn Emrich ? lived at the field and so he must have got them out of the equipment room. We had that prop reserve all sewn up so that when we had students practicing throwing it out that we didn't have a big mess to untangle every time. My memory is that there was so much material removed from it that it was obvious that it was fake. Linn would have known that, so that is one aspect of this that I don't understand. " So, at dispute are the two backpacks ... unless there were four (4) backpacks collected? Two from Cossey and two from Hayden? (The Hayden backpacks not delivered or used). ? Let me back off and not complicate this further -

Bob everyone will appreciate your remarks - thanks again OM. Maybe Coss encountered an intruder in his garage? I hope this breaks and you get to the bottom of it - Thanks again...

Come on, Bruce. It hasn't 'run rampant,' although it's been mentioned occasionally. I made a comment about it saying there ARE 'Cooper Nuts' out there and the cops should check Cossey's phone records, just in case. But that's a pretty remote possibility. Most of the comments I've seen on media are sympathy messages from people who knew Cossey when he was teaching middle school, or knew him when he was parachute-active. Let's not go overboard here. Chances are much greater it was something else. There have also been a rash of burglaries in the area. I was thinking maybe Cossey would like this song. I don't know why exactly. Just a thought. I hope the cops get to the bottom of this soon, and my sincerest sympathies to the family. As far as Georger and some of his comments on Cossey and his family, I think he might relate to this song instead... My cat Hobo and I agree. You should offer an apology. Why!? I find this ridiculous and speculative/drama.

I stand by every word I wrote about your post on another site. I'm not gonna repeat what I said and I'm not going to discuss this anymore with you, but suffice to say, at best, it was tasteless, and.....as I said before....rationalize it all you want....but if you can't see that - I don't know what to tell you. As for Georger's remarks, you're right, they were also tasteless. As for not mentioning anything about it, to be be honest, I didn't even read it the first go round. I tend to slide over any comments between you and Georger on this site. They are usually 3rd grade, tit for tat, absolute and utter nonsense that is not worth the time or the effort to read. Yeah, Georger and some others need to chill out with their Blevins derangement syndrome, but also consider this: One day, maybe you ought to read your posts. Since you've said, more than once, that you consider yourself a nice guy, no doubt you would be amazed at the way you come across on this forum. But on this too...I figure that will be when hell freezes over cause guys like you just don't get it. I'm done with this. Carry on. Well I dont see that 'this; is the place or the time to discuss this! Sorry. My remarks re-Blevins on Cossey were meant as humor to try and skate around the fact of Blevins' tasteless opportunistic trolling, which he does on all subjects ... If Blevins had been pounding you for the last several years you would be tired of it and raw too ... no further comments needed.

You might just be right ??? Time will tell . . . It may come down to what Cossey meant by "his". Maybe 'originally his', in reference to the back packs. ???

I too was a student of Cossey at Leota Jr high, and I always thought that his Airsports class was the best elective of my primary education. He must have been around 25 then and funny genuine guy. He told the DB cooper story but I don't recall if he said it was him or one of two guys. What I do know is that he and his wife were both involved in education, if I remember correctly she was a counselor at the high school. I ended up becoming a pilot and just last year made my first jump.. He was actually the first guy I thought about after I landed because he just loved jumping. He offered any of the students to come down to the old Issaquah airfield (long gone) and watch jumping on the weekends.. I'm now retired from King County Sheriffs Office and I know that my friends there will find out who did this, cooper nut or just a scumbag.. Either way Coss did not deserve this nor did his family. In closing who really gives a s*it how many chutes who packed them or what color they were.. if DB cooper were alive, he would have come out and sold the rights to his book and movie when the statue of limitations was up.. Just like government cover ups, someone will always talk when there is money on the table RIP Coss, you were a good guy.. That's a wonderful post Jim! Thanks! I hope things go well with this -- take care. G.

Yes. Now if we could only get Jo and Blevins to write with such clarity. But sci-fi and fiction buffs apparently only believe their own writings. Robert99 Im going to take a shower - Im all sweaty! Actually got the kitchen floor scrubbed and waxed during all of this...

How true. He was just a fun guy to be around. I cannot begin to number the contests that Earl & I competed in back in the 60's - 70's. He was always upbeat, whether he was winning or not. I have not seen him in ~20+ years but we would occasionally talk on the phone. Blues skies, Coss. JerryBaumchen Well I think I appreciate his humor (and the arduous reasons for it) if nobody else does. The man had the patience of Job, imho. Can you clarify anything about all of these chutes and where and who they came from, that were collected by somebody to be given to DB Cooper? If I understand this: we have 4 chutes from Coss (2 front + 2 back packs). Then 2 chutes from Hayden ? (Of Hayden's 2 chutes someone says one of those belonged to Hayden's brother!)... Thanks. G.

Regardless of what was in the dummy chute, Cossey apparently did all the packing for the emergency back pack parachutes, and for the reserve chest packs that were required to be packed by a certified rigger, in that locality. It would seem logical that if a chest pack was only going to be used for ground training, the canopy would be removed and replaced by a beach towel or some such thing and the contained marked "dummy" or words to that effect. The training container could be something straight out of the trash barrel. No point in using $40 bucks worth of airworthy equipment for a dummy trainer. Robert99 After many attempts to decipher and render order from Bruce's article, I gave up! See it here: http://themountainnewswa.net/2011/10/25/db-cooper-case-heats-up-again-with-controversy-over-parachute The controversy (if there is one!) starts here: "But author Geoffrey Gray states that the two back parachutes were owned by a Kent, Washington businessman named Norman George Hayden, and that Mr. Cossey only inspected and packed the parachutes for Mr. Hayden.This parachute owned by Norman Hayden is now the center of a DB Cooper controversy. In addition, Gray cites a FBI document that specifically identifies Hayden as the owner of the back parachutes." [Note* says back packs .... not front reserves...]? I snipped the rest of what I had written to try and uncomplicate things ...

good find! It's important little details like this that cut through the MKULTRA Hoboism! 1. One Chute was returned to the owner (Cossey or Hayden - that is a toss up) but presumably Cossey but then Hayden claimed it was his. Did Cossey just pack the chutes and Hayden owned them? That is what I understood from Cossey and Hayden yrs ago, but hell - I didn't know a front pac from a back pac. 2. The chute the FBI has is a front pack with the cords cut as this is how Cooper secured his 'package' per my understanding. This would be the chute in evidence. 3. The dummy pac - did Cooper use that or did he devise a container out of it. Is that why he cut the cords and what chute did Cooper cut the cords from. The dummy pac was missing and why they thought Cooper died - because of an unworkable front chute. 4. Would someone do this and account for each Chute using 1-4 numbers and title (back chute or front chute). DUMB ole me can't seem to make it add up. According to the sources over the yrs. Cossey packed the two back-pacs and presumably Hayden owned them. That is still a scrambled. One day I will dig up my notes and figure this one out. I have notes I made during and after phone conversations with each both Hayden and Cossey. The front packs - the emergency chutes came to the airport by courier and from another locations - refresh my mind - what was that LOCATION? McChord? Was this not what caused the delay? - The front chutes? Who packed the front chutes? Frankly, it's not important that you know or understand anything! Why? It avoids endless complications now and later -

Unless I'm reading posts wrong, this is a total contradiction by ckret of what he posted 6 months before. (Bold added by me) Jeez....this from someone on the INSIDE. No wonder reporters just go with what they have... And just scanning quickly, so far have found nothing to show that anyone on this thread challenged the inconsistent statement. Will keep reading and if I find differently, will post it. Keep in mind Ckret keeps saying he is getting his info from reading 'the files'. So the contradictions are in the files, presumably. Ckret then resorts to calling Cossey personally - and posted back here ... Im sorry but Im not going to look all of this up right now. Im just kind of tired of all the personal bs one has to put up with here ... Smokin99's remarks above include the statement that Ckret said the two back parachutes came from Cossey's house. That is probably CORRECT. Most of the emergency parachute riggers I have known over the years DID operate from their houses. The last rigger I knew before retiring from flying had a large house with a really nice finished semi-basement (this is an Arizona thing and not a complete basement as people in other parts of the country would call them) that included his repacking tables and equipment plus sewing machines for doing specialized work related to parachuting and aircraft emergency equipment. He took great care of my Butler emergency parachute for several years and bought it from me the day after I retired from flying. So my reading of all of the above is that the chest packs were owned by and provided by the sports parachute center. And it is probably the source of the instruction sheet. Also, Cossey owned one of the backpacks, the one that Cooper used, and that Hayden owned the other one, which was returned to Hayden. It was probably in Cossey's possession for him to repack it. So in view of the urgency of the FBI request, Cossey sent them both to SEATAC by a Sheriff's deputy or a Washington State Policeman. Finally, Cossey packed all four of the parachutes. I see no problem with Cossey's connection with the parachutes. In fact, I see no problem with the FBI's parachute story at all. The parachute "problems" seem to originate from people who have never seen one up close. And yes, I am referring to Blevins. In other news, the sun came up on schedule this morning, it is still shinning, no clouds in the sky, etc.. Robert99 Agree. In addition the kid who took Cossey's class is very specific in saying what Cossey told the class, quote: "He was one of two men who supplied parachutes for the FBI to give to Cooper at Sea-Tac airport during the Thanksgiving Eve skyjacking. " Keywords: "one of two men...". I think that reference is to Cossey and Hayden. So no contradiction or MKULTRA conspiracy there. Actually I could ask the informant and get a clear answer ... I will try. What I'm suggesting based on common sense with out some ulterior conspiracy theory involved: is that when all of the different facts and versions are combined it does lead to a consistent cohesive account of what parachutes were acquired from who, when and in what order, Hayden got his unused chute back, and chutes being given at Isssaqua (sp?) and from Cossey personally, all fit what actually happened - given that the Air Force failed to provide chutes for whatever reason. That Hayden had to go to Court to get his chute back is a separate matter, just as the Ingram's went to Court (Tosaw their attorney), to get some part of the Tena Bar money. Brian's mother was always insistent that Brian (or the Ingrams) were going to get a reward one way or another! (The full story of that has never been published so far as I know). The Ingrams persisted and get Brian his "reward". And the rest is all so-called journalist gobblewobble.

The news Bruce and Blevins didn't give you: http://q13fox.com/2013/04/27/homicide-leads-to-warning-for-nearby-residents/#axzz2RmG3jPoY http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-northwest-news/index.ssf/2013/04/body_found_in_washington_home.html http://www.sfgate.com/news/crime/article/Body-found-at-home-of-DB-Cooper-parachute-packer-4468172.php http://www.thenewstribune.com/2013/04/26/2574781/king-county-detectives-investigate.html http://www.zoominfo.com/p/D.B.-Cooper/1277861813 Personal accounts: I can't believe this. Earl Cossey, a former junior high school teacher of mine in my hometown of Woodinville, Washington (an east side suburb outside Seattle) was found dead by his daughter last night in his garage. Police found head trauma and have declared as of today that the case is officially a homicide. Mr. Cossey was also a professional parachute jumper and was involved in the 1971 DB Cooper case. He was one of two men who supplied parachutes for the FBI to give to Cooper at Sea-Tac airport during the Thanksgiving Eve skyjacking. I had him in 7th grade for my Airsports class... where he taught us about the history and engineering of planes and rockets, and we built them as models. And he was so passionate when he told us his story about be being involved in the Cooper case. He also showed us the old 70's DB Cooper episode of "In Search Of" with Leonard Nimoy that also featured Cossey explaining the parachutes and Cooper's jump. He was a very friendly man and had a great sense of humor. He always had us laughing. My sisters and I are shocked by the news of this tragedy. My thoughts and prayers are with his family and friends. He will be truly missed. And I hope his killer is brought to justice soon! ------------------------------------------------------

Unless I'm reading posts wrong, this is a total contradiction by ckret of what he posted 6 months before. (Bold added by me) Jeez....this from someone on the INSIDE. No wonder reporters just go with what they have... And just scanning quickly, so far have found nothing to show that anyone on this thread challenged the inconsistent statement. Will keep reading and if I find differently, will post it. Keep in mind Ckret keeps saying he is getting his info from reading 'the files'. So the contradictions are in the files, presumably. Ckret then resorts to calling Cossey personally - and posted back here ... Im sorry but Im not going to look all of this up right now. Im just kind of tired of all the personal bs one has to put up with here ...

good find! It's important little details like this that cut through the MKULTRA Hoboism!

Did Cossey maintain all this or did it come from news reports? Just pulling up some archived news articles, I see a report that two of the chutes came from McChord AFB. My point being..... was it Cossey or inaccurate AP reports that just never got corrected? Or was he giving them the inaccurate info? I wonder if his assertion that he PACKED all four chutes just somehow got translated to he owned/delivered all of them or two of them and he just never called back to correct the matter. Not saying you're wrong -- maybe you've looked at all the articles that he's been quoted in to form your opinion. I will have to look at what he is actually attributed to having said versus what was "reported". According to CKRET, "Cossey actually packed all four chutes, the two back pack chutes were sold or given to the individual who sent them in the cab to Boeing field. Cossey also packed the reserve chutes, but they were provided not by Cossey but the owner of Issaquah Sky Sports. Cossey discovered the mistake later on." Note from Smokin...From memory...I think the mistake referred to is the dummy chute, but I didn't read further at present time to confirm this. Well there are various accounts, now, especially after (documents of) the other gentleman surfaced claiming ownership ... its very clear to me key facts of the case have been botched by all kinds of self- confirming people right from the beginning - 30 years later Imposters/Opportunists start to surface to to fill the void ... Ckret talked personally with Cossey a number of times. Maybe Blevins has the Ckret Report in addition to the Palmer Report, too!

Well first of all, I can't find anywhere that is definitively saying it's him, but I agree with Shutter that it looks more likely than not. That said...... You know I have stayed away from your posts because at times it looks like people are piling on, but I really can't believe that you posted this on another website... "This is extremely sad. And although there could be any number of reasons why Cossey was killed, there are a few things you should know. First, I'm the guy who wrote a recent book on DB Cooper titled 'Into The Blast'. And during my research on this book, I discovered two things. First, Cossey's address and phone have been unlisted and publicly available at Dex Knows for years. Second, there are a lot of 'Cooper Nuts' out there. I know, I have met many of them either personally or on the internet. Cossey often spoke to people on the phone about Cooper, depending on his mood, but he was generally known as a nice guy. I would first check his phone records, see if any calls come from people known to be working on the Cooper case. My sincerest sympathies to the family. If you want to see what Cooperland is all about, see my article at Newsvine here:" http://adventurebooks.newsvine.com/_news/2013/01/16/16519136-skyjacker-db-cooper-part-1-of-3-welcome-to-cooperland Really Blevins? I'm sorry, but sometimes I seriously wonder about some of you guys.. As I said, Blevins should sit in the front row at the funeral, and hold the ex wife's gloves for her, ... Am I surprised Blevins wrote the above? No. We were foretold of his coming. It's in Blevilations. You can read that at Newsvine! Lets have a moment of silence for Cossey - and forget the opportunista guy no matter how he milks this for personal advertizing and gain for himself and Adventure Books! For it is written: 'The Low shall be made High, the Small shall be made Great, and the Trivial Obtuse shall be Supersized at Bookmart - buy your copy today!

Unless family, friends, or neighbors talk, looks like police will not be releasing identity until Monday......Another article.. http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/Body-found-at-home-of-DB-Cooper-parachute-packer-4468dropzone172.php sadly I think we can say with a 99.9% chance it's him...... Didnt we know that this morning? Old man dead in house. Daughter calls to see if her (old) father is ok,. no answer. Daughter goes over to house and finds (an old man) dead. Only one old man living at 44 Perkins Road. 1+1+1= or is this trollscience?