Baksteen

Simple. Apples are black and triangular, hence oranges are white and rectangular. I'm sorry, you raise several good points, but that is not a question that can be answered except with what you see as the 'perfect answer'. It does nothing to reinforce your point. By the way, how does your wife feel about your opnion? "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

As i posted in another thread.. I saw this student with less than 20, possibly less than ten jumps walk back from the LZ after a boxer short jump even after I advised him to wear coveralls. I "LOL'd" allright and had a lot of fun mocking his road rash. Next jump he went up in a t-shirt and shorts.. so i rolled my eyes and patiently explained to him that his t-shirt could come untucked and interfere with pulling his reserve. He went anyway and two days later he was jumping in his boxxers again. At that poitn he went from 'uneducated' to 'bloody stupid' in my book. Personally, I always wear a jumpsuit and a helmet, no matter the temperature. Call me old fashioned, but at least I can say when I grow old that I used to be an extremely hot skydiver who used to hang out with the cool kids. "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

Oh I don't even think we're really disagreeing. I'm just trying to reinforce the point that the woman seeking the man's opinion in this matter is a "great if it happens" as opposed to a "should always happen" and that what's being offered is an opinion, not a vote. I know - the only difference between our opinions is that I would have written it as follows: Which is why I said we should drop it. It's a small point not worth arguing about, if you think about it "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

With me being supportive I meant supportive of her decision. And not everything is/should be settled in court... But you know what - Never mind. You can't convince me, I can't convince you. Let's just agree to disagree.

: 0 : 0 No jumps - but another big static line FJC at my DZ this Friday/saturday. The previous class of seventeen students was originally intending to jump on Friday but they were confronted by bad wind conditions. So on Saturday, we had a total of at least forty static-liners at our DZ. Again everyone came through. No jumping for me as I had to leave at three o clock, but I did countless pin checks, assisted at manifest and packed a few chutes. The instructor and deputy instructors were dropping static liners and returning with the plane in order to speed up the process, jumping only once every (I think) five or six loads and then switching over to duty on the ground for the next cycle. Videots were wearing out their arms hanging from the strut to shoot stills and video of every student at least once. Experienced jumpers and novices alike patiently waited until all student gear had been jumped open and had to be packed, meanwhile assisting where they could. Packers, well, packed their asses off. AFAIK all students of that first class obtained their military wing that saturday - before the new students came fresh from the classroom and all eager to jump. I quote ....Especially since our 206 is still down for maintenance and we only have our trusty old 182 to rely on at the moment. Go PCMN! "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

I'm not worried about the stupid ones It's the clever ones that you need to watch out for P.S we've just moved. [that 70's show] BURN [/that 70's show] "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

(B)Limey! Perhaps this should be a sticky in SC? "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

Suppose your ex-girlfriend calls you up: "apparently the condom we used that last time was damaged", she says. "My pregnancy test came back positive. No worries though, I had an abortion. But I thought you should know anyway." Or "apparently the condom we used that last time was damaged", she says. "My pregnancy test came back positive. I decided to keep the child and my lawyer will call your lawyer about the alimoney first thing on Monday." Absurd?* No more absurd than a black and white solution in a complex issue like this.

That's not the point, though very very true. This is. Would you willingly send the child into a life that's even tougher? What about the children who don't get adopted? What DO they have ahead opf them (I seriously don't know)? I'm pro-quality of life, not pro-life. Who determines what an 'acceptable quality of life' is, is admittedly an extremely nasty question. I can only hope I won't have to make such a decision - ever. Be it concerning abortion, or a comatose loved one or whatever else you'd like to name. "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

Exactly! Because once a man puts his sperm inside a woman, he owns her! [/sarcasm] WTF is up with the sarcasm? I think Dark was talking about pregnancies which are not the result of rape in the second half of their post. That means the father gets a say too - though the will of the woman outweighs the will of the man. Her body, her final decision. But to just disregard the father's feelings is just.. Whatever. "Once a man puts his sperm inside a woman, he shares the responsibility for any resulting pregnancy." "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

Same. It's not rocket science. If I'm visiting a woman's house, I put the seat down again - common courtesy. Given a situation like the OP's, with some woman complaining about it I've been known to just shrug and say, "well - at least I didn't forget to lift it.." That usually ends the discussion quite nicely. "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

When I went to Perris I didn't have any problems either way. Both when arriving and departing I carried my rig in a gearbag and checked everything (including altimeter, hook knife and dytter) except my papers and helmets. They didn't ask anything, so I didn't offer any information, though I had the TSA-letter from the USPA website in my pocket and the cypres card in my wallet. What I didn't have was a pull up cord, but I figured that I could close my main with a shoelace if necessary. Same for the reserve, though obviously I would have to have it repacked. "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

The following quote (though in the wrong context) from the 'rapid downsizing'-thread in Safety got me thinking: I often hear people argue that lighter people should jump smaller canopy's earlier in their skydiving career because else they'll be backing up on landing even with an (I don' know) 10 knots groundwind. What's preferable to you and why - * putting a light student under a larger canopy with several pounds of lead * putting that same student under a smaller canopy without lead * use the larger canopy but without lead *something else entirely (please explain) "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

Which reminds me; I had the green cutaway pillow that originally came with the (used) rig swapped for a red one, because the green pillow matched my gear a lot better than a red one would. I wish more people would have an attitude like yours. Keep up the good work, Minna! "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

'Cept that I've seen too many new jumpers write that 'they cannot afford an AAD' when they are looking for/have just bought their first rig. "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

I've said it before and probably will say it again - I hate statistics. They can easily show what is wanted to be seen rather than what needs to be seen.

It's not just newbs we should be concerned about... The other day i pointed out to a very experienced jumper that his cutaway and (soft) reserve handle were the same colour as his jumpsuit. He just looked at me as if I was an idiot. You make some valid points - however, I d not agree with the above quote. I'm worried that a soft handle for a FJC student would be confusing... Some of them persist in pulling in the wrong sequence even with the current system. Let alone when the handles would be similar - even if the handles were different colours. We frequently read/hear about or deal with students who get overwhelmed on their first jump.. let's not add to the confusion when a reserve procedure is needed on that first jump.

10) Jumping a 'boat' isn't cool - nobody is buying anything over 150 11) I was seriously underloading my student canopy 12) I got a great deal on it! "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

The kind of person I'm concerned about would just bitch about overregulation and keep lounging in the back of the aircraft, cheststrap undone, legstraps loose until they'd fulfilled the mandatory requirement.. or gear up properly, but jump in their boxers because the cool kids are doing it too It's 'uneducated' until someone talks to them. The kind of person who is simply uneducated will hopefully see sense when someone explains to them why that stuff is inadvisable. If not, I reclassify them as stupid..and while I can't stop them from getting on the airplane, I sure as hell can mock them when they return from the LZ sporting the very road rash I predicted. "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

Bigway, it's great to see that you take this and other issues so seriously. Simple. All the cool kids have them. I think most of them don't even consider the safety aspects of their new gear - looking cool is all that matters. Guys, we're jumping out of frickin' airplanes, for god's sake! How much cooler can you get? Yes, my gear matches too - but the matching colours were a coincidental bonus of being unable to find the main I chose second hand..I reasoned if I had to shell out fourteen hundred euros for a canopy, it could damn well have the colours I like. But that doesn't keep me from looking like an idiot when I botch a landing in my matching gear... In skydiving too much emphasis is placed on looking/being cool and too little on safety ("So-and-so has trouble standing up their landings, even at twelve jumps.." "Dude - you still using that POS analog altimeter?" "I don't need an AAD!") Buying gear custom and new, not for the perceived technology/safety but because 'everyone does it' and for the matching colours is plain stupid... so are soft reserve handles, a small main canopy (who'd want to fly a 190 sq ft 'boat'?) with an even smaller reserve....I think some people lose track of what it is we're actually doing. Sure, it's fun and maybe even relaxing. Let's go grab some wind! Just don't forget what the consequenses will be if you fuck up. Stupid hurts. "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

To those who vote "no" because of the right to live - what life does an unwanted child have ahead of them? The mother can be 'forced' to carry the baby to term - but she cannot be forced to love her kid... For the child that could mean adoption, not knowing who their parents are, growing up with the knowledge they were an 'accident'.....or a miserable childhood with their mother. Not slamming any belief/opinion, genuinely curious. For the sake of this arguement, let's consider a child that is raised by their loving mother who chose to bear the child not as 'unwanted'. "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

25-80%? Nice statistics... What could account for the 55% they are unsure of? (I don't make up the statistics... I let someone else do that) Anyway... Could there be an underlying reason for the amount of naughty threads started by certain people on DZ.com coughiluvtoflycough? Could there be a medical condition which would explain it? Seems to be contagious as well.. Contagious? You mean that if one person is doing something naughty... then another sees that... then that person starts doing something naughty as well? Then you have to get a third person to video said naughtiness? That kind of contagious? So are you saying that you are wanting to contract said condition or wanting to know how to avoid seeing others with said condition? I already did catch it - and whether I want to see naughtyness being committed would depend on the perpetrators. Now what does that make me? "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

wether he hasnt had a coffee yet, or he feels left out from being dd'ed yesterday.. He got D-squared yesterday? Do tell, please. I'm all ears! What do you mean he got me? Ohhh, I know of someone who would be pretty pissed if that was true Different emphasis.... I meant he got "d-squared" yesterday, as opposed to he "got" d-squared yesterday. "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

25-80%? Nice statistics... What could account for the 55% they are unsure of? Anyway... Could there be an underlying reason for the amount of naughty threads started by certain people on DZ.com coughiluvtoflycough? Could there be a medical condition which would explain it? Seems to be contagious as well.. "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom

wether he hasnt had a coffee yet, or he feels left out from being dd'ed yesterday.. He got D-squared yesterday? Do tell, please. I'm all ears! "That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport." ~mom