LongWayToFall

I searched and found these, priceless. One hell of a roach! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z08zZ1xW9Yw&feature=related Hey Pendejos!!!!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q7KRVA6_0U4&feature=related

No, it shows where the kangaroos are at!

What kind of truck do you have? You should consider a dodge cummins, they get good mileage (20ish) and can tow anything. I would say any turbodiesel, but the v-8s don't get quite as good mileage. I'm betting your v-8 gas truck gets 10-12mpg........

Hahahaha! Wonder if the upper connectors on a tandem instructors harness could be attached to a keg? http://i.ehow.com/images/GlobalPhoto/Articles/2184799/keg-main_Full.jpg

In certain states (definitely california) it is very hard to get a concealed permit, if you are unable, I would suggest a canister of bear mace. 30ft range and large area make it almost as affective as a pistol, especially in panic situations. However, I would caution you considering the fact that your possible offender is reading these words, and say that they might take any possible means to deter your method of defending yourself. Along those lines, I would suggest not mentioning your planned method of defending.......

I was renting a mirage that had a sabre2 210, and put quite a few jumps on it. I really like that canopy, and will for sure buy one some day. However, when it came time to buy my own gear, I opted for a PD210 9cell because of the very reasonable price, and it was in good condition. I was worried, because I had read some people had a very hard time with flaring, especially at higher wing loading (I am at 1.2, you aren't recommended to go over 1.0) but I had no problem flaring. The flare just gets done quickly, where on the sabre2 the flare just keeps lasting and lasting (while you are only inches off the ground). I also found the PD to be quite responsive, impressively so, compared to what I thought it would be. So I can say that I am very happy with buying the PD, it was only $300, less than 100 jumps, and I really like it. So personally, I would stick with the PD as long as possible, it won't be long before you need new lines and at that time maybe you should consider upgrading. To make sure you are getting the most out of your flare, take a look at your brake lines under canopy. When you pull the toggle down, it should only move a couple inches before you see the tail of the canopy start to move, but when it is all the way up, the tail should not be distorted at all. If you do go with the sabre2, remember that it will pack a size larger.

I have heard that 50mpg is possible on the freeway at reasonable speeds. Also, you can find used diesels for quite cheap, under 10k no problem. The diesels should have a longer life expectancy as well.

Nice work man. Lets jump soon! Micah

Thanks for the first hand account. A couple questions. After opening, how far did you fly before spiraling down? Where were you in the exit order? What were the wing loadings of both of your canopies? Thanks, maybe you can share the video

The people saying this have not seen me under canopy. Therefore, they are only basing their opinion on what I have said on an internet forum, which has a value of zero. To All: I have overstated my opinion on spiraling, and exaggerated my views on it as well. It is NOT my right to spiral. It is however, my right to be provided the opportunity to safely land my parachute, and I must provide it to all others in the sky as well. Personally, I don't spiral very much at all. It just bugs me when someone says that I am expected to sit in brakes all day, because my wingloading is X. I realize that in my limited experience, I may not be able to determine when a situation would be unsafe. I will certainly heed the advice given on here, it has been insightful and brought up things I had not considered. So, I am sorry for stressing all of you out. I would implore you to allow people who are actually watching me pilot my canopy to be the judge of my safety.

The downwind leg is usually designated by points on the ground, such as "the entry point for the downwind is over this road" granted, different canopies will require different altitudes, but everyone should be in about the same area, and merged before they are on the downwind. Problems arise when people are only joining the pattern on final, such as getting out of the plane too early and barely making it back. I certainly don't count on everyone doing the right thing, and keep my head on a swivel all the time. However, to be absolutely certain nobody is going to hit your canopy from above/behind you would need to do a circle to check your airspace. This is unsafe when you have a group of canopies, and it is better to assume that nobody is there than to increase your visibility by turning, and causing clutter/swerving to avoid you. This is why we need an area that is considered the start of the pattern, regardless of the altitude required, with a clear marker for the downwind entry. You can reasonably expect people to be heading into this region at a certain altitude. The place for canopy maneuvers would not be in this area. The landing pattern starts at the entry to the downwind leg, base leg, or final. From the point of opening to entry of the pattern, is your approach to the pattern. If your entire canopy ride was called the pattern, it would sure defeat the purpose of calling it as such. "Hey, that guy was spiraling in the pattern!" or "He cut away the moment he entered the pattern!" these both are misleading. If I decide to open 1000ft early, and after a control check, decide to spiral that extra 1000ft, I am compressing the landing pattern less, becoming more visible to others, and increasing my own visibility.

If the pattern entry point is the same for everyone, then the altitude at which you enter it is determined only by the glide angle of your canopy. No turns in the pattern, right? If most people are entering the pattern at 2000, and you are entering at 3000, then your canopy has a 50% steeper glide angle. You should not be bothered by people in the pattern, because you will be well above them, until you reach the landing area. The pattern has an area where people enter it, so that the landing order can be sorted out. If I am outside of this area, and not in the downwind, base, or final legs, then I am not in the pattern. The pattern isn't a wall that begins at 2600ft. But, to answer your original question, I would not consider spiraling below 2500ft because doing radical maneuvers as you approach the hard deck is not a smart idea.

I am very willing to share some brews with the locals, I am positive that would be an enjoyable experience. However, I believe that my reputation might precede me. But, I am certainly willing to sit through a lecture resembling ground school in order to progress to thought provoking conversation.

Lots of assumptions being made here, yes sir. I am willing to bet you don't know a damn thing about me, or my canopy practices. Where do you jump at, that has the downwind entry point at 800ft directly above the landing area???

I'm the drunk dude, remember???????

Whats up Krisanne? My apologies for putting you in the position of defending me, it is not necessary. I believe this forum is in place for people to debate in order to gain knowledge, and weather the conversation invoking question/statement is a truth, or hypothetical, is of no matter. I believe that if people are generally concerned with my canopy flying, they should simply observe my performance in the air, and decide for themselves. Just because I take the position of being the reckless, unpredictable spiral monkey does not mean that is how I fly. This is simply to combat those who believe that people above a certain wing loading should be opening high and sitting in breaks, to allow a pattern separation that is far more than adequate, all in the name of them have all the space they want. Sometimes you have to overstate yourself in order to get the middle ground to be acknowledged. So, again, my apologies, and I would hope that my attitude and safe practices be determined in the air and not through a circuit board.

I don't think this is the case at all. When you are spinning, your visibility is limited above the horizon, but unlimited below it. This means that if someone has a lower altitude than you, you WILL see them, if you are looking. If someone is at an intersect course with you, they are going to be well below you, not off to the side where you can't see them. This is very true, however because of the fact he is below the other traffic, he has the right of way as far as they are concerned, and should not waste his time looking above, his time is better spent looking where he will be flying, and to his sides to ensure he is not going to collide with another jumper.

This is a legitimate reason for not spiraling down into the groups below you. If you are exiting first, opening low, and then flying slowly in the pattern, you become an obstacle for faster canopies to get around. Obviously this is not a good thing, and does not allow a nice single row of people in the pattern. At no point did I advocate cutting people off. Personally, I am one of the last people to reach the ground before the tandems. I enjoy opening a bit on the higher side, and that combined with a slow canopy means it takes a long time for me to get down. Here is an example: I am under canopy and done with controllability checks by 3500-3000ft. If my airspace is clear and I am feeling like it, I might spiral down to 2500ft. Even though spiraling has a considerably increased decent, it sure isn't near freefall speeds. I could have opened at 3000k, and been under canopy by 2,500-2,000ft. This would put me at the entry to the pattern MUCH sooner, and I would be mixing with even more highly loaded canopies. Where is the limit? Should we start making students pull at 8k, A license jumpers 6k, B at 4k, etc. ???? I understand the need to have adequate separation, and am not advocating cutting in front of some guy at a 2.5 wing loading. The whole reason I made the original post, is because I feel that if you start segregating what people can do according to their wing loading, than lightly loaded people get screwed. They should be able to spiral if they want to, as long as they know where other canopies are, what position they should be in come time to enter the pattern, and keep their eyes open.

Where did I say that I am passing people? If the airspace is clear, then it is safe to spiral. If I am on a 10 lane freeway converting to a single lane, I have gotta be in some fucked up country. I get your point though. However, if there is an endless line of ferraris and 18 wheelers, and they have no breaks, how do you expect the 18 wheelers to sit there? They are going to merge with everyone else. Its all a matter of who gets to the merge point at what time (entering the pattern) If you don't want to be bombarded from above, don't drop down on top of other people, and expect the same from everyone else you jump with. YOU are responsible for the airspace you fly into

You are making some gross assumptions here. I would say that what you suggest is absolutely not the case. I am very proficient with flat turns, and this is all I use when in the pattern and making minor corrections on final. Sort of like a pilot using rudder, ya know?

Wow, lots of hate directed towards me today. I think it is worth noting the post I responded to, to understand my reasoning behind taking the opposite position as far as who is allowed to descend at what speeds. My attitude may seem cocky, to the point of ignoring safe advice, however this is not the case. I am all ears, and have formed my opinion not because I am only interested in doing something fun (spiraling) but because I truly believe it is not an unsafe thing to do. Let me explain myself. What do you look for in someone who is flying a canopy in your vicinity? You are looking for someone to fly predictably. My previous post may have sounded as if I would be flying all over the sky, however I only meant "predictable" in the sense that you would know the exact direction they would be flying (the down wind leg) once you entered the pattern. Above that, you still want someone to fly predictably, but only as it pertains to avoiding getting too close to them. I think that one of the most predictable things you can do, is hold a spiral, going straight down. If you look at another jumper and try to calculate both of your trajectories, it is very easy to see the other jumper is only going down, and will not interfere with where you are trying to go. But, what about the jumper above you? He might spiral down right in front of you and cause a collision. THEN HE SHOULD HAVE WATCHED OUT. Think about someone in a hard spiral, and the range of view they have. The leading edge of the canopy is about at the horizon, and your feet are pointed about in the opposite direction. This means your 180 degree vertical view, and your better than 180 degree horizontal view (you check your blind spots when you change lanes in your car, don't you?) is directed straight down. You can see everything below the horizon in all directions as you rotate!!!!! This gives you an outstanding ability to see traffic anywhere below you. Considering your higher than normal decent speed, and your direction of straight down, this makes it impossible for someone to hit you, and as long as you identify other traffic, makes it impossible for you to run into someone else. The only area you can't see is above you, and if someone runs into you from behind, then it is not your fault anyways. If you are spinning, and see a canopy that is going to be traveling into the airspace below you, simply stop spinning! You are on top, and its your job to not fly down onto someone. Maybe you will see as I do, spinning is highly predictable, and for the pilot, has great visibility. So sure, don't jump with me, I don't really mind at all. I will tell you though, that I have never been told that my canopy practices are unsafe, and I keep my head moving much more so than many people I see.

So, that is about 100% of the time...... If I am in the designated playground, I'm gunna spiral until my eyes pop out of my head. Come time to enter the pattern, thats when I'll straighten out and fly predictably. It's everyones own responsibility to watch for other canopies. You being under a highly loaded canopy are the one who is going to be cutting through traffic, with a higher decent rate. Why is it that the square footage should designate your allowed decent speed? Fuck that. If I am on top and coming down on you, I will watch out. If you are on top coming down on me (the more likely scenario) then you had better watch out for me. If you want to assure that you wont be bombarded by 300sq ft canopies from above, how bout upping the wing loading a few more points, and pulling at say, 1500ft?

I've never seen an eagle on a carrier

I....Must.....Be.....OPTIMATED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Bwahahahahahaha