FLYJACK

What is your point? It was near the Aft Door on the 727.. that includes that optional access door and tells us zero about a 737. I covered all this is my post.. We need to determine exactly which plane models and 727 variants that decal was on, exact location and whether NORJAK even had that decal/system. You seem to have a problem with that?

Clearly, you are confused and did not read my post. I stated what many of the parts lists indicate for the Hick's placard part number. Until we have the facts we can't eliminate those as possibilities. You are assuming that the companies just added those models. They might have, you don't know. I don't 100% eliminate possibilities (myth busted) based on assumptions, you seem to have a history of it. It is not rational. If we get the facts, we can eliminate it.

I don't have problem but you seem to be confused. They said inside the AFT door on the 727. That panel is inside the AFT door. Boeing never said anything about a 737... if it is used or not. I guess you never read my post on the matter.

I am not suggesting this... If NORJAK did have the Hick's decal "type" and it did have the optional emergency release system it would have to be behind the removable emergency door with the two finger holes. There is another break away panel behind it. Clearly, the Hick's placard does not match the outer decal. Point is, this isn't settled. We need more work here. I have found at least three different emergency release decals/part numbers for 727's, there may be more. We still don't even know which one the NORJAK plane had.

The 737 Aft Airstair is different. Electric but can freefall..

You don't know that, you are assuming. It may be true or not. You don't bust a myth with assumptions..

Wow,, lots of assumptions there, I thought you were a facts only guy. The 737 combi did have optional aft airstairs, the side rear door. They were called "Aft Airstairs".. the "overwing exit" you refer to is not related to the 737 optional "Aft Airstairs".. misfire,, It isn't myth busted,, not yet. We need more work here. The "normal" emergency exit was in the main box on many 727's but it wasn't a "pull on red handle", it was a push the main lever "outward".. all documentation indicates it is integrated into the main handle and is pushed out. It had a different decal/text and different part number from Hick's. The part number is actually one digit different. ..-182 not 152..

The hand pump is irrelevant, they all had that. How is the myth busted that it could be from another aircraft?? I have to give credit to Eric Ulis for contacting Boeing.. "He just called back after about two hours of research and stated it is an interior placard affixed on the inside by the aft door.” Unfortunately, I have to take it back for his abuse of critical thinking.. We still don’t have enough info to claim the Hick’s placard came from Cooper. The 727 series has an aft entry and aft exit door (rear side)… which one.. we’ll assume the rear but this needs clarification. There are still some issues that need to be sorted. The new info from FBI files.. The Hick’s placard part number is Boeing BAC27DPA152 … listed for (707, 727, 737) A NWA crew took the plane up for testing 2 days after the hijacking and claimed they lost decal(s). A second decal was found which according to NWA employees is 99% the same type from a NWA 727, we don’t know which decal this one is. The facts: The FBI claimed the Hick’s decal could have fallen from any passing 727 or from the test two days later. They have more info than we do, why make that claim?? The 727 passenger variant has two different emergency airstair systems and at least three different decals. The normal system doesn’t match the Hick’s placard text and that decal is a different part number, you push the main lever outward. The other is an optional separate emergency release mechanism. This one has an outer door with finger holes which is completely removed, that decal does not match the Hick’s placard. Behind that door is a flange which is broken off to access a red handle which is pulled inward. That almost matches the Hick’s placard but not exactly. the Hick’s placard says "open access door” all documentation says “Pull door inward. To release stairs, break plastic flange and pull red handle." We don’t know which system the NORJAK plane had and we don’t know which 727 variant had the Hick’s placard type. It does not match the normal system and isn’t a perfect match for the optional system. These are the only two systems documented for commercial passenger 727’s. There were many other 727 variants. The Hick’s placard has tear holes in the corners. No internal decals found have those holes.. including the other emergency release decals. First, we need to determine which plane variants had that decal, where exactly they were located and how they were mounted. 707?, 737? and whether the Norjak plane had that decal type and exactly where it was mounted.. Second, the FBI comments are odd and inconsistent. If the plane was tested two days later and some decals came off, for them to come off during NORJAK they had to be replaced and that would be noted. They claim the decal may have come from that test? It is a light decal, vinyl/plastic. (Why the tear holes?) Conclusions.. There are several possibilities, The Hick’s placard type was never used on the NORJAK 727 variant and came from another 727 variant or perhaps a 737. (had an optional side aft airstair) If NORJAK did have that decal type.. The Hick’s placard came off during the test two days later. or The FBI is lying to protect confidential info that only Cooper would know. The FBI docs do not indicate any missing decals or access panels in Reno after inspections. If NORJAK had that decal the only place it would be is behind the outer optional emergency access panel.. it would be attached to a flange inside which is completely removed to access the “red handle”. Perhaps, Cooper did pull the optional emergency system and the FBI is hiding that info. If he did then the placard would have been attached to a plastic break away panel slightly larger than the decal. That would mean the decal came out of the plane attached to a "heavy" plastic panel. This was my first “guess” regarding the Hick’s placard. However, the FBI would have to be lying here as they would know if the emergency handle cover was pulled or accessed. and as I previously pointed out,, Eric and Robert’s placard drift calculations were self serving garbage.. My calcs were a drop at 2-3 ft/sec, that is for the decal only, no plastic panel and the range accounting for the decal possibly missing 1/3rd from altitude.. the wind direction and speed at that location is not known contrary to Eric and Robert’s assertions. It is a guess and the variable assumptions involved make a drift calculation meaningless. If it were still attached to the panel then descent rate changes dramatically. Eric and Robert will continue to spin this into an alternate flight path narrative, none of the placard evidence indicates that, NONE.

Well, he probably chose an empty row as far back as possible when he entered. After the hijacking was initiated the stews moved the passengers forward, if he didn't happen to have the rear row initially he could have moved back then.

Huh, a large part from a 727 was found, it was from directly above the rear stairs door... not from NORJAK..

The plane was fairly empty so he had lots of seats to choose from. Later, the stews moved everybody further up toward the front. Hahneman first flew from NY to PA to hijack another plane he thought had a light passenger load and less chance of Air Marshals. Cooper may have selected 305 for the same reasons.. light passenger load and less likely to have Air Marshals.

Additional info.. The Hick's placard text "OPEN ACCESS DOOR",, the 727 internal emergency release instructions is to remove access door. It detaches completely. The exterior has an access door. Further, Northwest employees took the plane out 2 days after the hijacking to check out the pressure bump. They noticed decals had come off and speculated that they may have come off in a similar fashion with NORJAK. This doesn't make sense, if the decals came off during NORJAK they would have to be replaced in the two days to fall off again. That would have been noted and known. The plane was inspected in Reno and nobody noticed any missing decal.

He didn't have airstair knowledge, Tina showed him how to operate them. The FBI files note that exit instructions were sent to the plane.. Cooper had aviation knowledge, not 727 knowledge. The plane loaded in Portland via the rear airstairs, Cooper was the second to last to board. No indication who closed them but they are usually closed from outside by ground crew. Exit instructions were sent to the plane. Cooper opened the rear airstair and the plane landed with the door partially open and dragging.

Yes, there was a second emergency release on the exterior. NO, I haven't found the matching decal. 727, later version.

Warner needs to do his own homework... and stop cheating off others. Hick's "Marker" part number from FBI,, BAC27DPA152 (707, 727, 737), new number 1397VRW Dec 6 1978 FBI had the location of the "Marker" on a blueprint. January 19, 1979, "The FBI, however, said the placard, posted on the outside of the jetliner, could have dropped off almost any 727 that flew over southwest Washington during the past eight years." The FBI had the blueprint location of the placard.. They would not make that statement if they knew the "placard" came from inside the stairway. The 727 rear airstair panel decals without the earlier separate emergency system. This emergency system was built into the main lever. Hick's marker does not match the earlier interior 727 emergency system decals or the later ones.

Also, nothing was noted missing after inspecting the plane in Reno. But, the FBI files state that the plane was taken out two days after the hijacking to test the pressure bump and "decal(s)" went missing.. this appears to be a different event from the drop test in January. However, it could be another FBI reporting error...

Some early 727's had a separate optional emergency release system, that system was accessed via a removable access door with the two holes in the pic I posted, that marker does not match the Hicks placard, wrong shape, wrong text.. There was also an emergency release system on the outside of the 727.. The problem is these optional emergency release systems were removed from North American Commercial jets so it is extremely difficult to find an image of one.. to confirm. Later 727's and retrofitted early ones had the emergency release integrated into the main control handle. The newer emergency release does not match the Hick's placard type or text instructions.. I posted an image of the main control panel and it does not match either. There is nothing to indicate that Hick's placard "type" came from inside a 727. The FBI claimed it matched one located on the outside the aircraft and it could have come from any 727, they wouldn't say that if it came from inside. The ground crew also stated that they fall off in normal operating conditions.. why say that if from inside. While I can't confirm it came from outside (still looking), all the evidence indicates it was not located inside on the 727 unless we find some new evidence. Further, the Hick's placard may have come from a 737 with AFT AIRSTAIRS.. we don't know.

It isn't thick plastic, Hicks folded it and put it in his pocket.. the FBI refers to it as a decal,,, it was a thin plastic decal. The holes are strange though they couldn't have been to secure it. at 18.14 in video

It is not heavy plastic,, that is a media exaggeration. Those "holes" do not match any interior marker's either, they may have nothing to do with fastening the marker but are fasteners for something under it. You make a logical error. The part number lists a 707, 727 and 737.. if it was on another plane it may have been placed differently, the 737 had optional aft airstairs (side). Assuming that the Hicks placard only came from a 727 is an error which forces a false conclusion.

Not so fast. There is an exterior emergency release system on the 727.. The FBI docs and FBI media report say it came from outside of the aircraft.. FBI,, it could have come off any 727 plane. and the part number BAC27DPA152 is shown for a 707, 727 and 737... Anybody want to explain that? Remember, it states "AFT AIRSTAIRS" the 737 had an optional "AFT AIRSTAIR" the rear port side. Further, it doesn't match the interior "marker" for the 727 optional emergency release. They did use similar markers on the outside. It is consistent with the type on the outside of aircraft. Airline ground crew noted that they fall off all the time in normal conditions. 727 emergency release access door and marker. Has two finger holes in it. FBI walks back Cowlitz Sheriff claim. Example of exterior marker. Hicks Marker/727 panel/NORJAK panel open (STAIR CONTROL marker).. note the font is different on the Hicks marker. It is a later Boeing font. Example of an exterior marker 727

It is officially called a marker.. it does not match the internal 727 one on the emergency door. PMA Details BOEING BAC27DPA152 Part Number: 1397VRW Part Name: Marker-”Emergency Exit Handle” Replaced Part Number: Boeing BAC27DPA152 Approval basis: Identicality per FAR § 21.303(c)(4) Models: Boeing (707, 727, 737 series)

With the new placard information in the FBI docs, Eric Ulis is using pretzel logic to make it fit his sketchy alternative flightpath narrative. Background... the Cowlitz Sheriff claimed (assumed) the Hicks Placard was from the NORJAK plane, however the FBI soon walked that back, it came from the outside and could have come from another plane. They fall off all the time. Eric Ulis falsely claimed as a fact, the Hicks placard was from NORJAK. The new FBI doc confirmed that two placards were found. A second placard from behind the grassy knoll is in play. The Hicks placard found in Novemeber 1978 was part number BAC27DPA152 which came from the outside of the plane. BAC27DPA152 is listed for a 707, 727 and 737. The part number was updated to 1397VRW in 2001. NOTE, the placard states “AFT AIRSTAIRS” not ventral. aft airstairs can refer to either ventral or rear side built in airstairs. The 737 had an aft airstairs option (side rear). That “Hicks" placard could have come off any 727 or 737 on V-23… The font used for the Hicks placard is a later Boeing font, the part number may be the same but it is likely a later printing with the slightly updated Boeing font. That suggests it came off a plane after NORJAK. The other Placard was found May 2 1979 by a logger in North Skamania County which is far East of the flight path. There is no part number or ID given for this placard. July 31, 1979 ( Two Employees ) Northwest Orient Airlines, Minneapolis International Airport, was shown an airplane decal recovered in the State of Washington advised that there is a ninety-nine per cent chance that this decal came from the same aircraft hijacked by D. D. Cooper. _____ noted that the decals placed on the aircraft are red in lettering and that the one recovered in Washington and displayed to him appears to be more maroon. When the employees claimed a 99% chance they do not mean 305, they mean a 727.. (same aircraft). This is the nature of 302’s they aren’t facts they are summaries of interviews. Eric Ulis is spinning this to claim the Hick’s placard is 99% from NORJAK, the FBI files don’t say this, NOT EVEN CLOSE. First, they are referring to the second placard not Hicks and they have no way to determine which plane it came from. They are claiming that the placard shown is 99% consistent with the NWA 727 but we don't even have a description of that second placard. These placards fall off in normal operation according to NWA employees, there is no evidence that either one is confirmed from NORJAK. It is possible, but extremely unlikely. Takeaway.. FBI 302's are NOT facts, they are summaries of opinions. The Hick's placard part number matches a 707, 727 and 737. Placards fall off these planes in normal operation and there is no way to confirm which plane (or model) it came from.

Hahneman requested chutes, I can confirm the equipment came from Andrews AF base, but haven't confirmed the model. He was an air crewman in the US military. He landed in the Honduran jungle at night jumping from 9000 ft out the rear stairs of a 727. He sustained slight injuries and walked 10 miles to a road into a small town. He officially got $303,000. Four weeks later, he turned himself in after his identity was publicly revealed and being hunted by military and others in Honduras looking for the $25,000 reward. He consulted with friends and family before turning himself in, he requested to be brought back to the US. He could have stayed in Honduras as there was no extradition process at that time.

Of course, we as "amateur sleuths" aren't in a position to put somebody on the plane, the FBI couldn't even do it. But, there are two standards to this case, the "legal" standard and the "public" standard. The FBI's role was to bring a case to the Prosecutor not to publicly solve it. We don't even know if they ever did or not. IMO, there is only one way for a 100% solve and that is a real long shot.. Present a suspect so compelling that the FBI does a NEW modern DNA test on the tie and compares to relatives. Hahneman died before the DNA stuff and it currently isn't good enough for familial analysis.. I said it before, the case for Hahneman is by far the best I have ever seen by a long shot, a perfect match, short of the forensics which we have no control over. The fact that he was erroneously branded a copycat, he was investigated for years, his name is unnecessarily redacted in FBI files, he is a perfect match for Cooper, my FOIA battle and nobody (besides me) knows really anything about him suggest that he was a serious suspect who was never eliminated and the FBI wants to hide him from public scrutiny. We have lots of info on McCoy and Rackstraw, nothing on Hahneman yet he is a far better fit for Cooper. How can we have somebody who matches the Cooper description and profile near perfectly, committed a virtually identical hijacking and know nothing about him from the FBI or media?? and, if you read the FBI files it is noted in the 70's that witness memories were already fading...

The FBI investigated Hahneman for years (at least) after he was caught for his hijacking. That indicates his whereabouts Nov 25/71 could not be determined and the FBI was not entirely convinced the prints were from Cooper. McCoy's prints did not match and they continued to investigate him, Calame and Rhodes still think he was Cooper. Rackstraw's fingerprints did not match and they continued to investigate and pursue his palm prints. Logically, matching the prints would include but not matching does not exclude. The eight unidentified partial prints are not confirmed to be Cooper's.