Robert99

Blevins writes: The FBI keeps it on their website...you should be asking them. R99 replies: The FBI probably keeps several hundred pages of information on their public Cooper web site. It appears to be mostly newspaper clippings and such. I doubt if the FBI would be willing to swear to the accuracy of much, or any, of it. Blevins writes: BTW...I just tried to PM you Bill Rataczak's address and phone. Didn't realize you felt so threatened by me, or that I had sent you SO many messages (like about zero, I think) that you had me blocked. R99 replies: Sorry, but I DON'T feel threatened by you. I have just checked the PMs that we exchanged on July 17th and 18th, 2011, and the number does not compute as zero. I don't remember exactly when the PM block was put it, but it was probably about that time. Blevins writes: You know, it's traditional to WAIT until someone sends you a bad message before blocking them. R99 replies: I apparently didn't get that memo. Robert99

Bruce, I suggest that you have the right "notion" above. I have to take get an extremely important matter off the pad tomorrow morning. Then when time permits, I'll post an analysis of George Harrison's 23 pages of information that are available on the Washington State Museum's Cooper site. But don't get your hopes up. While all is not lost, no ready answers are forthcoming either. Even the sacred 8:22PM location will get the rug pulled out from under it. It appears that it was actually 8:18PM when the airliner was at that location. And that location is a long way from where "Blevins' map" (formerly "so-called FBI map") indicates the airliner was at 8:18PM. Robert99

Blevins, Where is your proof about who prepared that map? The simple answer is you don't have any. Your claims are just YOUR own speculations. Where's the beef? Robert99

Blevins, If you have read the Seattle ATC radio transcripts for the flight while it was in their area of responsibility, you would know that there is absolutely nothing in those transcripts to locate the actual flight path. So instead of "creating" another map out of speculations, I'll wait for some actual information on the flight path to surface. Any map based on speculations is worthless. And again, you could benefit from the ION navigation course mentioned previously. Don't be so dismissive about 13 year olds. Robert99

Blevins, Within the past couple of years Rataczak stated at a public function something to this effect: "I'm the only one [alive?] who knows the airliner's flight path around Portland." Could you please explain your interpretation of that remark? Did Rataczak say that the flight path was common knowledge? Did he support the flight path shown on that map? And for the record, others have stated on this thread that the FBI does not know where that map came from. And Himmelsbach himself has reportedly stated within the recent past that he had never seen that map before. Dream on! Robert99

Blevins, Why don't you check the referenced ION course before making such statements? The fact that three bundles of money were found together means that they didn't travel very far to get there. They were covered by sand after traveling a very short distance. Where is the rest of the money and Cooper remains? Here is a suggestion based on the fact that Tina Bar has been flooded any number of times since the hijacking. For starters, check the western Pacific as I mentioned yesterday. I don't remember the exact height of the highest water level since the hijacking, but a long time Tina Bar fisherman (who apparently had been there just about ever day for the last 50 years) showed Meyer Louie and myself a marker for that height. My guess is that the highest water level was not more than about 20 feet above sea level. Something seems to be getting lost in translation from my remarks about the flight path. So let me put it as plainly as I can. THE FLIGHT PATH SHOWN ON THAT MAP IS BULLSHIT! PERIOD! Robert99

Blevins, You actually need to read posts before replying to them. I have NEVER said that Cooper impacted into the Columbia River itself! And that is NOT how I explain the Tina Bar money! Again, read the posts and get your memory fixed. Robert99 Well...if Cooper had impacted into the ground anywhere around Tina Bar...they would have found some remains of him by now. Probably within days after the hijacking. It isn't exactly a remote wilderness in that area. And if 305 passed through Portland on the SW side, that turn probably wasn't done until about the time they were reaching Vancouver, not further north. The current radar map presented on the FBI's website shows this. I have attached a copy with some notes. Blevins, You need some training in navigation and map reading. For starters, the Institute of Navigation has a link on their web page (which you can Goggle) to a free course they offer on navigation to 7th grade students (who are usually 13 years old). You don't even have to sign in to view this course. On the map you attached, you have Tina Bar sitting on the railroad between Vancouver and Woodland. Tina Bar is actually about four miles south and two miles west of the location you indicated. It is important for you to remember that Tina Bar is actually on the Columbia River itself. Also on the map you attached are four red "X"s on the southwest side of Portland. Do you know what they mean? This has been discussed at extreme lengths on this thread. For those reading this for the first time, those red marks indicate that someone was plotting aircraft positions. And if you get a map with those marks and the Mayfield (now Malay) Intersection showing, you will note that sets of two marks line up EXACTLY with the Mayfield Intersection. That is, there are three points on a line (a straight edge) for each case. Both of the lines mentioned above pass either directly over Tena Bar or within about 1000 feet of Tena Bar. The airline crew had expressed concern about flying over populated areas even before they took off from Seattle. They were given Carte Blanche to do what ever they felt necessary. Consequently, there is no reason whatsoever to believe that they would fly over Portland in the manner indicated on those maps. In fact, the logical thing to do would be to set a new course to pass southwest of Portland at the time they were making the left turn at the Mayfield Intersection. And they apparently did so. Where the so-called flight path information on that map came from is not known. But as has been discussed here repeatedly, the times and distances shown for that flight path are completely meaningless. Flying at a constant speed, the airliner would NOT cover three nautical miles in one minute and then six nautical miles in the very next minute. That is fairy tale navigation. It just doesn't happen. Whoever drew that flight path and put those times and locations on it DID NOT know what they were doing. There is still another map, which Blevins apparently neglected to consider, showing a flight path that is a segmented circle around the west side of Portland. No airline crew would have flown such a thing under these circumstances! So you think "someone" would have found something related to Cooper by now if he had impacted on or very close to Tina Bar? Maybe they have. Have you heard of the "Tina Bar Money"? Robert99

Jo, The T-33 took off from Portland International Airport and was shortly thereafter directed to intercept the airliner on the southwest side of Portland. When Himmelsbach took off in the National Guard helicopter, it also headed to the southwest side of Portland. This means that the airliner was NOT on V-23 at that point and was bypassing Portland on the west side. There is additional information to support this. Just read the thread. Since the airliner was maintaining 170 Knots Indicated Air Speed, there was no need for the T-33 to slow to 135 Knots. The T-33 did NOT abort due to icing, but rather because the fighter planes were arriving. The T-33 just got out of their way. The airliner had VHF radio equipment and the T-33 had UHF radio equipment. The only way they could communicate directly would be on the emergency frequency [121.5] on which both the airliner and T-33 could transmit/receive. However, they did not use that frequency. It is very unlikely that the T-33 had radar equipment. However, the fighter aircraft did. All of the above is in Himmelsbach's book which I suggest you read again and slowly. Robert99

Blevins, You actually need to read posts before replying to them. I have NEVER said that Cooper impacted into the Columbia River itself! And that is NOT how I explain the Tina Bar money! Again, read the posts and get your memory fixed. Robert99

Someone probably has, but I haven't seen it on this thread. Unfortunately, I'm serious. Robert99 Funny! I have extensive posts on Cooper zombies! HE NEEDS TO READ THE THREAD. (Then have several stiff drinks).. Except for the very occasional beer or two, I don't drink. Coffee is my beverage of choice. Living in the Seattle area, this is a natural thing. Blevins, your paranoia is showing. I don't think that remark was addressed to you.

Someone probably has, but I haven't seen it on this thread. Unfortunately, I'm serious. Robert99 Funny! I have extensive posts on Cooper zombies! HE NEEDS TO READ THE THREAD. (Then have several stiff drinks).. He should have the drinks BEFORE he reads the thread.

Someone probably has, but I haven't seen it on this thread. Unfortunately, I'm serious. Robert99

Jo Writes: Robert99 stated: [Actually Jo is quoting Georger for this remark.] "If Cooper or someone was going to plant money, in the PDX-VCR vicinity, for someone to find or be directed to, why would they pick Tina Bar of all places. Why not a public beach much closer in to Portland and or Vancouver? Why clear up at Tina Bar?" Jo Replies: [Jo ignores Georger's question and replies to one from Robert99.] It is Tena'a bar and not Tina's bar and that fact has been established for some time. Maybe Tena's bar was chosen because it meant something to the person planting the money. Your statements about the money being 10 to 12 ft above sea level seems a little high to me, but I was up in the parking lot in 1979 so my judgement of elevations would not be very perseptive from the large oaks at the parking area in 1979. Perhaps there had been rain fall. I know the sea level varies with the tides and the rain and the snow melts. It was between 10 & 12 when we am when we made that stop. Robert 99 stated: "Based on photographs taken during the time the FBI was digging at Tena Bar, the money was apparently found about 10 or 12 feet above sea level. The point where the money was found has now been severely eroded and is now under water." Jo Replies: Dead on from my visual memory in 1979 and the pictures in 1980. R99 Replies: Jo, the erosion took place AFTER the money was found in 1980. Robt99 stated: "The money (and Cooper) had to land in the narrow strip of land between the NW Lower River Road and the Columbia River if it had any east to west movement." Jo Replies: Not if it was planted....and ALL indications are the money was PLANTED. There are the 2 other locations - 1.one across from the PDX where he carried the shovel down to the water. 2. when he threw a paper bag in to the river at the Red Lion at the base of the OLD VANCOUVER iron bridge. There was nothing in Kayes report that indicated the money came from above the site....just that the money did NOT get there by NATURAL means. You seem to be stuck on this even though you have been corrected before. YOU push the ideal the money moved - it did NOT move - no way that money got to that point by natural means. AS for your stating the water level at the time of the money being buried had to be about 12 ft about sea level - and no more than 14 ft. YOU incidentally stated - "buried". You know Kayee states the money did NOT get there by natural means! There have been mulitple interpretations of what Kayee meant by that statement. R99 Replies: Jo, YOU and Blevins have been corrected any number of times about the "planting" of the money. Both you and Blevins require that the money be "planted" to suggest that each of your Cooper candidates lived through the jump. Jo Continues: "Impacted on the land" - do YOU have any idea what the packet would have done had it impacted on dry land. Evidently not. Why don't you go to the altitude that plane was at and drop a bag and some banded monies (fake). See where it goes....the bag would probably bust open and there would have been money all over the place. If it was in a satchel and Cooper had bound it to himself and went into the river...the test results would be way off. R99 Replies: Jo, As an aeronautical engineer, general aviation and sports aircraft pilot, and parachutist, I have a hell of a lot better idea what happens in a 10,000 feet drop than you. The money bag would NOT necessarily have burst even if Cooper landed on top of it while doing a terminal velocity of 180 MPH. But it would certainly have been flattened. Jo Continues: Perhaps you need for newbies to make a more accurate statement: It was basically found very close to where it impacted or was planted on dry land from the jump. R99 Replies: Here is the accurate version of your statement above: "The money was found very close to where it (and Cooper) impacted at the end of a fatal no-pull parachute jump. The money was NOT planted at Tena Bar by anyone. People with law enforcement experience, such as 377, state that the last thing a crook would do willingly is be separated from his loot. Finally, neither Duane Weber or Ken Christianson had anything to do with the hijacking, a point that is radioactive to both Jo Weber and RobertMBlevins." Jo Continues:

That's a fast way to check someone. But the 113 only works if they are already past their birthday in 2013. Otherwise, it is 112. For instance, if someone was born on January 20, 1960, they would have turned 53 years old on January 20, 2013. Prior to January 20th, the numbers would have been 60 plus 52 or 112. On and after January 20th, the numbers would be 60 plus 53 or 113. So if the suspect says 112 or 113, he could be telling the truth. But no other numbers would be acceptable. It will be 112 or 113 or the jail house. speaking of the money ... If Cooper or someone was going to plant money, in the PDX-VCR vicinity, for someone to find or be directed to, why would they pick Tina Bar of all places. Why not a public beach much closer in to Portland and or Vancouver? Why clear up at Tina Bar? Or, if it wasn't a plant but a flow event, again why clear up at Tina Bar versus closer in toward PDX or Vancouver? In order to put something up on Tina Bar, presumably far away from the Dropzone closer to V23, some particular facts of hydrology have to apply just as particular facts of flow and water levels must apply before "anything" can wind up on Tina Bar from further upstream. Think about it - Hmmm. I wonder what it is ??? This post being the result of discussions going on through PMs off the board ... The nominal water level at Tena Bar is about 5 to 7 feet above sea level. Based on photographs taken during the time the FBI was digging at Tena Bar, the money was apparently found about 10 or 12 feet above sea level. The point where the money was found has now been severely eroded and is now under water. At Tena Bar, the Columbia River runs south (upstream) to north (downstream). Arrival of the money from the east is blocked by Vancouver Lake, which is drained by Lake River, which in turn drains into the Columbia River several miles downstream (north) of Tena Bar. The above basically means that the money (and Cooper) had to land in the narrow strip of land between the NW Lower River Road and the Columbia River if it had any east to west movement. My interpretation of Tom Kaye's tests and remarks is that Tom rules out a downstream movement of the money for any appreciable distance (not miles). The absence of contamination on the money, especially since it was found only 50 to 75 feet down a slight hill from a containment pool for run-off from the Fazio's diary farm, suggests that the money may have moved a few hundred feet along the river's edge before being buried in the sand. So IMHO, the water level at the time of the money being buried had to be about 12 feet above sea level or maybe slightly higher. But no more than about 14 feet above sea level. This means the river level was slightly above normal. Also, the money didn't move far along the river (south to north) or east to west either. It was basically found very close to where it impacted on dry land from the jump. Robert99

That's a fast way to check someone. But the 113 only works if they are already past their birthday in 2013. Otherwise, it is 112. For instance, if someone was born on January 20, 1960, they would have turned 53 years old on January 20, 2013. Prior to January 20th, the numbers would have been 60 plus 52 or 112. On and after January 20th, the numbers would be 60 plus 53 or 113. So if the suspect says 112 or 113, he could be telling the truth. But no other numbers would be acceptable. It will be 112 or 113 or the jail house. Funny! I'm thinking of a number. I wonder what it is? Okay. Here is how the 112/113 works and it only works for 2013. Each of the numbers increase by one in each subsequent year. Thus the numbers would be 113/114 in 2014, etc. Also, it assumes that Gray Cop asks for the YEAR of birth and that the age of his alley mate is stated in YEARS. Assuming that the suspect was born in the 1900s, dropping the 19 subtracts 1900 from the year of birth. If the suspect states that he was born in 1999, then his true age cannot be more than 14 years on his 2013 birthday. And his age would be greater for earlier birth years. If the suspect was born in the 2000s, the 20 is dropped and that subtracts 2000 from the year of birth and means that GC has a 13 year old, or younger, suspect during the year 2013. Leap years don't figure into this. Your number please. Robert99

That's a fast way to check someone. But the 113 only works if they are already past their birthday in 2013. Otherwise, it is 112. For instance, if someone was born on January 20, 1960, they would have turned 53 years old on January 20, 2013. Prior to January 20th, the numbers would have been 60 plus 52 or 112. On and after January 20th, the numbers would be 60 plus 53 or 113. So if the suspect says 112 or 113, he could be telling the truth. But no other numbers would be acceptable. It will be 112 or 113 or the jail house.

It's a simple MATH thing. All you are doing is adding your age to the year you were born in the 1900s (ignoring the 19) and that gives you the 113. Or, if you don't want to ignore the 19, just add your age to the year in the 1900s that you were born and that gives you 2013. Doesn't that sound logical? No voodoo involved.

Blevins, Is Andy Poppens related to Mary Poppins? Robert99 Yeah. That was a REALLY intelligent question. Why don't you email him yourself and ask. well ... in order to send a PM here you have to be enrolled here, ie be a registered subscriber, and there is no Andy Poppens registered here at Dropzone that anyone can find ? But you know how things work (here) so why kid around? Could you possibly have PM confused with BM, BS, or AM ? You must have been up all night covering this forum 24/7 ? You must be tired holding-protecting the fortress alone ? Are you persecuting Bernard Geestman? So Danielle is a 14 year old girl with autism and she wants Geestman's address? Has Blevins tried to sell the Tacoma Narrows bridges to anyone?

I prefer to think of myself as being in the SECOND group I listed: 'Unbiased civilian investigators or writers with an interest in the case...'. Hmm. Just saw this by Robert99: ***'The estate of the guy who was actually DB Cooper is going to lose out. But of course he died in the jump and nobody knows who he was.' Blevins, Calling yourself "unbiased" and an "investigator" is laughable and a contradiction of terms. Are you going to correct the information on KC in your "book"? Or do you just hope it all blows over? Based on your own definition, you are a perfect fit for Group 3 above. By the way, how many times have you been banned from this thread? And how times have you said that you were leaving this thread only to be back the next day? Is five a good number for both those actions? For the record, I have indeed stated that Cooper died in the jump and I stand by that statement. I also told you that several years ago in a reply to a PM from you. That was just before I put you on my banned PM list. Robert99

Blevins, Is Andy Poppens related to Mary Poppins? Robert99

Vicki, this is going to get worse. Maybe you should get your application to AA in right now. I'll be there myself before long. Robert99 You have to apply to AA? I thought it was supposed to be anonymous! I guess that just shows how out of touch I am with the real world. Can I bring my shrink along? Sure, it's anonymous. Bring your dog, if you like. Okay, fine. I have another question which 377 should be able to answer. Can we file a class action lawsuit against NBC? Audra McDonald's singing of "Climb Ev'ry Mountain" last week blew my socks off and I haven't been able to find them. Does NBC have insurance to cover this? As a minimum, NBC should have posted a warning to: "Tape your socks on, tighten your shoe laces, and fasten your seat belt." before the lady sang that song. Robert99

Vicki, this is going to get worse. Maybe you should get your application to AA in right now. I'll be there myself before long. Robert99 You have to apply to AA? I thought it was supposed to be anonymous! I guess that just shows how out of touch I am with the real world. Can I bring my shrink along?

Vicki, this is going to get worse. Maybe you should get your application to AA in right now. I'll be there myself before long. Robert99

And in other news..... http://variety.com/2013/film/news/will-ferrells-daddys-home-gets-california-film-tax-credit-exclusive-1200946262/ Interesting...who are the three? Geoff's book covers four --Kenny Christensen, Barb Dayton, Duane Weber and Richard McCoy. Somebody's estate is going to get stiffed! The estate of the guy who was actually DB Cooper is going to lose out. But of course he died in the jump and nobody knows who he was. In the meantime, every one who can possibly do so is getting a book out on their candidate. It's called ca$hing in. And they don't have to know anything about their candidate or even the Cooper hijacking. Whether fact or fiction, the only thing that matters is the color of the money. Robert99

Shutter and Georger have it right!