georger

Quote Cooper is supposed to have said he had a grudge. If he worked in the weapons or aircraft industry (or special metals industry which supplies government related projects), a chronic health condition might have been his grudge. Maybe he had been diagnosed with cancer ? This was the era of personal-political expression of an extreme form. (Maybe he was from Madison Wisconsin!)

Quote If the gloves and other sources can be ruled out then that is a logical conclusion. Lets assume he used benzedrine. Nothing too special about that. The form might matter; maybe generic. Maybe he had a prescription for a condition? Btw Benzedrine was/is a trademark. I see the logic you're persuing.

Quote I know. I pointed the same thing out years ago however there were exceptions. Lots of exceptions. There wre guys who saw action in WWII, Korea, and Nam who definmately were in their late 40s or early to mid 50s by Nam. I could name a bunch of them ... I want his dna whoever he was. Who knows! Maybe he ran a surplus store somewhere...

Quote lycopodium, see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lycopodium_powder There are different formulations for different uses - medicines vs industrial. The stuff is a very fine dust and as the above states was used to 'dust for prints' at one time. I would look at the prints the FBi collected to test for the same spores. The obvious thing to look for also is C9 H13(N.1-phenylpropan -2-amine) associated with lycopodium spores, I would think. It is also worth noting the FBI uses latex gloves to handle their evidence. Im not sure what the powder on those gloves is but you might want cross check the gloves for spores. There are photos of SA Carr holding the tie with 'latex gloves' on. Numerous people have handled and examined the tie all wearing protective gloves, dusted with something - But again I would look for these spores and Amp in other evidence like prints, especially any prints taken from the Lav. Evidence of spores is one thing - evidence of Amp and a specific forumulation might lead somewhere. You saw the problem Tom had just tracing-identifying what started as pollen then turned to spores, as I understand the history. ?\ The leap from Amp to pilots might also include truck drivers, and food service workers? (I always include food service workers in deference to H ---) Thats a good question - keep em coming...

Quote Has lycopodium (vs other formulations) been confirmed? Do you know? No pills or other artifacts were found in the lavatory - so far as I know. Did Cooper go to the lav simply to take pills - he spent considerable time there and communicated through the door. Kaye is not a chemist and I seriously doubt he has the mass-spec work to document particular forumulations - do you know? I think you have to be a little careful in this regard ... do you know? Thanks for sticking to the topic! I believe there is a remark somewhere in Tosaw's book of Cooper telling Tina that he had some pills to help keep the pilots awake if they needed them. So Cooper apparently had at least one type of pill on his person. Robert99Quote Thats right - had forgotten about that. If one finds the coating of a pill what about the medication itself? One should find it also - Im just very cautious about jumping to conclusions, pending something analytical like mass spec work.

Quote Has lycopodium (vs other formulations) been confirmed? Do you know? No pills or other artifacts were found in the lavatory - so far as I know. Did Cooper go to the lav simply to take pills - he spent considerable time there and communicated through the door. Kaye is not a chemist and I seriously doubt he has the mass-spec work to document particular forumulations - do you know? I think you have to be a little careful in this regard ... do you know? Thanks for sticking to the topic!

Actually, I shredded the Palmer Report after everyone here gave me a shit time about it, and I was busy dealing with Regina Winkles and Matt Mullenberg. Didn't figure that to be a big deal since I assumed the Cooper experts already had a copy stashed somewhere. You have everything else and the Palmer Report was high-profile and the university backing that effort well-known. Are you saying you've never seen it, and that no one has a copy that's ever been scanned? LOL. Get off your lazy behind and go to the source. I made some inquiries long ago by email and by snail mail. No responses. Then this envelope shows up a long time later at AB. I took a quick look at it but it meant nothing to me. BORING. Do you know how much stuff people mail to us every day? Hint: A lot. If it WAS important, you should have SAID SOMETHING SERIOUS instead of drooling Alice in Wonderland stuff and making rather dumb jokes when I brought it up. If I had known it was really important, I probably would have kept it around, scanned it into my computer, and made it public. Now it's in the shitbox, the little grey shredder. No one expressed a serious interest. They were too busy thinking up cute jokes and barfing up filthy comments on Cooper articles. Maybe someone should have said: "No public copies have been made available..." If this is true, I had absolutely no idea this was the case. And if they did, I probably missed it wading through the crap comments. If it IS available and you HAVE seen it, or have a copy...then why are you whining about it now? If you don't have a copy and it's really that important to you, I suggest some polite inquiries about it as I did. The key word here is polite, Georger. You'd be surprised how well people respond to a well-constructed letter or email done in a civilized and polite fashion. Quote Post taylored to Lunatic Books of Seattle - and the Lunatics who dared to post. Hello Mudduh ... Hello Blevins ... Hows it going in Nome Alaska ...? Did you get my macaronni ...? Hows the diet of ice and blubbuh ...? Hello Mudduh Hello Fadduh Hows it going in Alaska? We had cutbacks here at Boeing So Im sending only one casket ...

I realize the error was immediate, but DB Cooper stood out more. the letters were sent to torment, poke the bee's nest as I like to call it. perhaps I'm different, but I would have signed it Dan Cooper and mentioned something about them getting the name wrong. just seems strange that the real Cooper would follow the media version by now using a double alias while trying to prove he is alive.... For the Record: My personal opinion on the letters is that none of them were sent by the hijacker. You should talk to a cop or two on this subject. They are used to this type of thing happening after a famous crime. The ones that are more likely real come from perps with deep-seated needs for unhealthy emotional gratification, making outright threats of more crimes of the same type, or as an attempt to justify their actions. This usually means serial killers, mad bombers, etc. Cooper may have been this or that, but I don't think he was a psycho. agreed, but these letters were sent to try and prove Cooper was alive. I would have also noted something that only Cooper would know. this seems to be the whole purpose of the letters. validating his survival.... the 'Aldi" guy who presented the Playboy connection seems to want to play hide and seek instead of coming forward. still not sure what his deal is, but it's interesting. all the letters are online ya know.....Quote Dont quite understand the fascination with the paste up letters. That's a very old common technique - cuttings from magazines and newspapers. Shakespearre is alleged to have sent a paste up to the Queen. I guess it was the best that was available to the perp who sent these letters from Reno. Someone with time on their hands. After losing on the slots. Cheap trick - not even a snip from an authenticating Elvis ad, which might have shown the sender was creative and sincere! Al Di. Code breaker. Playboy collector/reader. Knows the ads. Charmin and Cutty expert. Hide n Seek. Peek a Boo in a cheap room in Reno. Probably has the Maximum Epehmeris for Wage Earner Sheeple on loan from the library too! Undiscovered Playboy expert. He's the one who probably sent the Palmer report to Blevins! (Blevins cant find it to confirm so, send him another copy Al Di! Address it to Gayla under cover.) Hello Mudduh Hello Fadduh Here I am at ... Al Di Nada ... Send a lettuh ... To your mudduh ... And we'll send you a ten pound box of Macaroni.

No. Not a court record. Testimony from Margie Geestman, Dawn Andrusko, and Lyle Christiansen. And Lyle did not know these women, or even hear of them, until after the book came out. And even then, not really, since all had their names disguised. (Jones was in the Revised edition, but not the original.) ***'one of your witnesses states that KC stopped wearing the toupee shortly after the crime (*laughs*) she was able to pinpoint this 40 years later? give me a break Matlock (*giggles*) she states he didn't wear it to work, so I guess he was worried if he wore it to a movie theater someone would yell out "hey, look it's DB Cooper" (*eyes roll to back of head*)' Dawn Andrusko first met Christiansen about two years or so before the hijacking. This was when she moved she and her children into the Geestmans' home, coming out from Minnesota. She was Bernie Geestman's sister, as you know. Her testimony is what it is. She gave it in a straightforward manner, and after the hijacking, when she received the $5,000 from Christiansen, she saw him from time to time until he died in 1994. In the time period before the hijacking, Andrusko said that she, some of her friends, and sometimes Christiansen would hang out playing cards or go the beach occasionally. Sometimes, she said, he would wear the toupee, sometimes not. It didn't seem to embarrass him whether he wore it or didn't and no one said anything to him about it. She did notice he stopped wearing one after the hijacking, and from that time on, he changed his manner of dress. He went from a reletively nice dresser in his off-time to mostly wearing jean overalls. Some of his neighbors in Bonney Lake noticed the same thing, but just figured he was going for the Farmer John look. He also put on a fair amount of weight. No one really gave it much thought. Andrusko said in her interview that she and some of her friends suspected KC might be Cooper right after the hijacking occurred, but dismissed the thought because he was a 'nice guy' and they couldn't imagine him doing such a thing. She knows reletively little about the case, and it was the same thing with Helen Jones, who had no idea the hijacker smoked Raleigh cigarettes, even when she made the trip up the Bonney Lake Library to correct her previous statement that KC smoked Camels. She told Peter Berg (I was in Twisp at the time) that she mistakenly said Camels because that's the brand SHE smoked before she quit. She said it came to her later, after I interviewed her, that he smoked Raleighs because she remembered that he saved the coupons. Berg asked her if she knew the significance of the brand KC smoked. Jones said no. Berg told her about the butts the FBI found. He told me later she was truly surprised. Meanwhile...Berg tries to get her to go on Decoded and tell about Geestman and KC missing Thanksgiving dinner at her house, and about her encounter at the laundromat with KC six weeks after the hijacking. I hope you are getting all this. Trying to keep it simple. Jones refused to go on television. She told Berg she was afraid of Mr Geestman even today, calling him a liar and a crook. (She knew he was going to be filmed that same day and didn't want to see him) In fact, the filming was already going on in another place and Berg was not there. He was still doing shots at the Bonney Lake Library. Before he could get this information to the other crew, they had already wrapped and Geestman was on his way back to Port Angeles. This, in my opinion, is a real frickin' shame and was a big letdown for the show. Why? Because they could have waited until Geestman said on-camera that he believed KC could be the hijacker...and then brought on Jones to contradict that story, i.e. 'Why would you say that Kenny could be the hijacker when you were WITH Kenny, and MISSING, that entire week?' I think they could have used her testimony to push him a bit harder for the truth, instead of the pack of lies he has told from the beginning. After filming wrapped, I got a message from Pete Berg (associate producer) on the whole thing. I had to keep that a secret on his request until he was no longer working with Go Go Luckey and History Channel, so I did. (He has his own production company now) This is what he said about the end of the Decoded show, where the cast votes that KC was probably the hijacker, but that Geestman probably wasn't involved: In reality, he said, the director got a phone call from Go Go Luckey's legal department in Los Angeles. They told him that no one on the show could say they thought Geestman was lying, or that he was involved...UNLESS they could get him to 'crack' first on-air. Well, he didn't. So they didn't. (Yes, that's television) But after the show aired I contacted the cast, and I got this from them: Buddy Levy and Scott Rolle were convinced that Geestman was not only lying, but guilty as hell. Christine McKinley was not so sure. After I sent them the info on Helen Jones testimony and some other things, Buddy and Scott were more convinced than ever. McKinley decided not to give any more opinions on it. Ask them yourself if you wish. All at at Facebook. More recently, they all got the public version of the FBI report on KC. I understand that this negative vote by the cast was more or less set up by the director, and he was instructed by GGL's legal department. And...that it does call a bit of the show into question. I chalked it up to being TV, and the fear of a lawsuit. I think the remainder of the episode was done sincerely. This 'you can't vote for Geestman' thing happened on the very last day of filming and was a complete surprise to the cast, I'm sure. I never asked them about it, to save them embarrassment. More or less, the way the show worked was the cast didn't know what evidence was going to be presented to them to work with. It was dropped on them, they were given a very short time to examine it, and then the cameras started rolling.Quote Got any swamp land for sale near Misanthrope Books in Misanthrope, Mississippi ? They dont reed ner rite they'ur. Or just pass out the Grape Kool Aid and get it over with! How many personalities at AB Books post under the registration RobertMBlevins here? The quick in and out one, the nice one, the dumb one, etc etc etc . . .

Does it have wireless? Maybe she can hook a ride on her neighbor's network - get em back for all that nasty smoke. Ok....maybe not.... Seriously - Good offer Jo - take him up on it. You know if you don't this will just make us know that you like being a "woe-is-me-er". OMG! wont say more ... someone will have to teach her wifi ... Jo you need to take him up on this!

Quote You are a Saint! Makw sure it has win Office on it - Word. She will need that to write her memoirs.. I love it! The Good Guy Award 2013 goes to you hands down. Where do I send it?

Quote they are deluged by phone calls! any sane person wants this all to go away - Foodstamps in Washington will be cut just to pay for it! The Blevins-Geivette Bill.

Welcome aboard, btw. I don't know...I'm no handwriting expert, for sure, but, going with the premise that the hijacker filled out the ticket rather than the ticket agent, I briefly looked at DAN vs VAN without magnification and I'm just not seeing the likeness at first glance. Slants, size, rounding looks different to me. Hopefully you will go into more detail.

Because the truth is, I don't know. You don't listen. Maybe you're starting to believe the 900 comments. (*laughs*) I didn't really need a big explanation from you trying to explain the fact that the two are the same. the bottom line is you just told Jo without any evidence (matchbook) she has nothing. "I saw those matches" "anyone could claim the same thing" now, you are claiming KC wore a wig, but, you have zero proof other than someone telling you this correct? Testified and Testimony are court terms. was this a court record you are speaking of? one of your witnesses states that KC stopped wearing the toupee shortly after the crime (*laughs*) she was able to pinpoint this 40 years later? give me a break Matlock (*giggles*) she states he didn't wear it to work, so I guess he was worried if he wore it to a movie theater someone would yell out "hey, look it's DB Cooper" (*eyes roll to back of head*) why is it you can't accept Jo stating she had those matches, but, you can claim KC wore a rug because someone said so? "Anyone could claim the same thing" lets do a test shall we. I will replace the word matches with Toupee in your response to Jo. Now, if the ID on the toupee was public knowledge shortly after the hijacking, then this changes everything. Then you have to provide the toupee Duane had, otherwise there is no evidence here. Anyone could claim the same thing, i.e. 'I saw the toupee'." not the same (*laughs*) "You kinda forgot about that part. I'm not in the habit of presenting available evidence without a means of verification" what available evidence, someone telling you this? can you prove these statements, can you verify them with real evidence like a picture of KC with a toupee? otherwise there is no evidence here! ah yes, the famous 900 comments shows up to rescue you once again. must you tell this story 900 times to get the point across about those stupid comments? it's been about 3 pages since you last commented about them. keep the quota up (*giggles*)Quote Where is the news coverage of these great claims and revelations. I happen to know there are 4-5 crack reporters in News departments in Washington, all Cooper saavy, who aren't reporting any of the Blevins-Geivette revelations and claims. When is the story going to break from Eng, Fowler, etal since their names are being dropped daily. "Eng looked at it and agrees with hand writing analysis". We don't even have any public statements being issued by Lindsay Lohan or Thomas Jefferson! Sure the claimants have somebody willing to stand up and support them publically? I know if I had just discovered the wheel, or fire, I would definately want some support from the tribe! Has a press conference been scheduled. ? How come when 4-5 crack reporters are contacted at their stations, they and their producers quip "Blevins who?"... "Geivette who?..." I fail to understand how or why the Cooper Case having been solved is being greeted with such little acclaim, support, or even free Kool Aide at Shoppco!? Or at Ace Rubberbands Inc!? Where are these alleged photos of Bigfoot? In the meantime here's a prize winning pig! That is real! Isnt she pretty ?

Quote the matchbook ?

Quote If the tie is Cooper's he obviously failed to understand the power of forensics, or the rapid growth in forensic science ... If he had a technical background why would he not understand the clues he was leaving, or maybe he did not care, or expect to survive, or be found ... ?

It appears from the interview that the chain of evidence concerning the tie is pretty much a certainty, therefore one would have to conclude that either the tie was labeled as his, or he was seen by witnesses with the tie / tie clip and the exact description of the one he wore matches the description of the tie left on the plane, or he was seen by witnesses with a non-descript black tie, then seen without a tie, and subsequently a non-descript tie is found on the plane. These are all plausible scenarios that lean to the side of certainty that yes the tie belonged to Cooper. I could live with any of them. All I'm asking is does anyone know for sure, even if only based on witness statement as above, that the tie left belonged to or was worn by Cooper? If not, then that deserves to be said before conclusions are offered. In the scheme of things, yeah -- what is the difference whether 1991 or 2011? Maybe none...Just saying that there are way too many myths involved with this case to begin with.......Quote Tom looked into the certainty of the tie being Cooper's. I think there are a few comments about that on his website. The cocktail on that tie is rather special. That cocktail did not just walk on to the tie, then just walk on to the plane, by itself. Its a one in millions proposition.

Quote Where has Blevins published the entire closed thread? I thought he was forced to take that down? How did it become Blevins' property to publish? This wasn't very long after Blevins joined this thread. He downloaded and massaged the closed thread and then had a link to where he had the massaged thread online. My use of the word "publish" was intended to convey that he had, as I remember it, a public link that led to an entire DZ thread (even though it was closed on DZ) that he had removed from DZ and that he had posted at a non-DZ site. Perhaps he later removed it. But my question to Blevins is the same as the one you ask above. How did it become Blevins "property" to do that to a DZ thread? And was he doing the same thing under the table with the present thread? A few years ago, a legal dispute arose between the now late J. D. Salinger, of "Catcher in the Rye" fame, about the ownership of letters he had written to his former 18 year old mistress. His former girlfriend wanted to sell the letters to pay for her children's college education. As I remember it, after quite a bit of litigation it was ruled that the former girlfriend owned the letters but Salinger owned the words. Also, if I remember correctly, a wealthy admirer of Salinger's bought the letters and returned them to him. Consequently, they were not publicly released and the former girlfriend got the money she needed for her children's education. Robert99Quote what goes around comes around - funny.

Quote I basically agree with these remarks. Especially: "Tom Kaye talks as if it is a certainty." That's just Tom's personality. I learned that trying to work with him. On the other hand, the Carr-Kaye team produced some worhthwhile results and set a baseline which was lacking prior to the effort. Who, for example, would have ever guessed that the tie would produce the "strange cocktail" it produced !? That tie is almost a lottery ticket in terms of the general population of people and ties on the planet, in 1971! Without Tom's effort we wouldn't know that. Then contrast that with a nearly mundane report for the money. The contrast is striking. So, my judgement call to get Tom or somebody like Tom involved in a basic analysis, may not have been that far fetched to begin with, visi-a-vis SA Carr. Especially if the FBI had not done any prior analysis, or wasn't going to. I would rather have that information than not, at this point. As far as this misanthrope RobertMBlevins esq is concerned! Petty critics and opinionists like him are a dime a dozen. Blevins is no winning lottery ticket - that's for sure! His daily pronouncements of what people should be thinking and doing never tell us anything new, but are a rehash of what people are already doing and thinking, or already have thought or done, before Blevins arrived to 'take charge'! Now for the good news: Tom and his team represent a level of effort, a fairly common level of effort and expertise as these things go. Can you imagine what a higher level of effort(s) could achieve? This is what I mean by: "Tom etal have set a baseline" that did not exist in the same tangible way, prior to their effort in the public domain. They took on a lot of responsibility which few others were willing to do, or could do. That leaves a lot for the future to work with. Was it worth the effort? Only history will judge. Then when you add Tom's team's work to the work of others (Robert99, Sluggo, Snowmman, 377, Ckret, Shutter, Hominid, Gray etal), we may be living through a kind of golden era where some progress was made in the Cooper case. The system that replaces the system ?

You have already downloaded and "published" the entire closed Cooper thread. And I imagine that you are doing, or going to do, the same thing for this present Cooper thread. And you probably have other "modifications" in mind for this thread as well. Again, you might want to talk to your lawyer about that. Robert99Quote Where has Blevins published the entire closed thread? I thought he was forced to take that down? How did it become Blevins' property to publish?

Quote Blevins appears to want to be: the Court Jester. We already had one! That is why Blevins has failed. Blevins should move on to find another orchard to pillage, while the owner is away!

Quote I did. So just read the pdf.

Thanks. Read the pdf. Its a pretty good interview and his description of the titanium chase is interesting. The discovery of the Ti and Na, then finding one plant that specialised in a sodium process, and the FBi getting involved - is interesting. That could still yield something... Tom's citation of Palmer is wrong. Quote: "The other thing was that the claim by Doctor Palmer, when he excavated the site on Tena Bar, was that the dredge had pulled the bills up off the bottom of the river and deposited them on the shore, and that’s how they got buried." - Palmer never made such a claim. He specifically did not think the money had come from the 1974 dredging. Palmer's two claims were (a) the money arrived at the earliest in 1979 or even 1980, but very recently, because the money was found in the "upper active layer" of sand at Tina Bar, and (b) that a possible source was the Washougal, during the high water period of 1979. Secondly, Tom does straighten out the 'container' story with his description: " You know, as far as the parachute training is concerned, we did examine the one parachute that was left on the plane. And we noted that he cut through about 30 knots to release the parachute from its container, the canvas container. And he was attempting to use the container to hold the money, and then he ended up giving up on that. He ended up using the satchel the money came in. He cut some of the ropes from the parachute and he used that to tie the bag of money to himself." That is a good concise description. Tom should transfer those exact words to his Parachute Galley section of his website. Lastly, the following passage comes as news to me! Quote: "So we don’t think the dredging had anything to do with the money coming up. The dredging description put the dredge pile two miles away from where the money was actually found, to be part of the dredging operation." I have no idea what dredging description he's referring to. There aren't any "two miles separation" between the dredging pile(s) (plural) and the money site, in the data I have. Tom keeps stretching and separating (further and further) the distance between the money location and the dredging spoil piles shown clearly in the USGS photos Carr provided. Does this mean Tom has a brand NEW location for the money find? Fact is, Tom is not the only source for 'the location of the Ingram find'. The new 2-miles separartion Tom refers to is news to me, and I amsure to others likewise. Otherwise it's a pretty good interview and the Titanium story is downright intriguing. Thats my reaction.

Jo, Just read Tom Kaye's interview that is online at the new Cooper museum and then tell me what he said. My understanding of his interview does not support your claims. Robert99Quote what is the link to Kaye's talk? Have looked for it but cant find it. Is the talk just a rehash or something new? All I find are promotional ads -

I had two links. Neither works tonight. One was a pdf the other an asci file list. I guess they have taken down the links or the site or something. I will try and rebuild this somehow and get back. Do you have data for '73? Was it included on the old USGS site when you were there? I think it was because my file of water level data for 74-85 which came from the old site iincludes '73. Its pre 1970, 70, 71, and 72 that were removed and archived where I emailed you about - If necessary I can do two things: go to the supposed new USGS site and make an inquiry there, or, go back to my original source and ask there. But I wont be able to do that until Monday. Also: I went through a number of back doors to approach the problem. Checking several of old bookmarks tonight I find a number have been reformated and the information (content) is no longer there, which is a shame. Maybe another Sequester cut. Try this for example: http://www.fema.gov/el/disasters/grid/state-tribal-government/89 Scroll down to 1970, 1971 ...