Belgian_Draft

Yet you say that Ellsberg got off easy? Which is it? The government bungled the case from start to finish. He could have been convicted and served a lengthy sentence. Clear enough? Clear as mud. you first say that he got off easy for what he did. Then you say that the people should know when their government is lying to them. His action was to reveal 20+ years of lying. So why is it that you feel he got off easy, rather than being locked away? The fact that the government was clumsy in prosecution is irrelevant to this. Maybe if you realized that my, or your, personal views are not neccessarily the same as the law you would not be so confused. Just because you, or I, feel something is just and right doesn't men it is legal. Was what he did right? Yep. Was it legal? Nope. Once again i will try to explain so you can understand: He had proof of lies. He gave proof to print. He broke the law to do this. He could have served a lot of time in jail, but the feds fucked up the case and he got off. There it is in a nutshell. I even made sure to use single syllable words so you would not get confused. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

We've already seen that time. Most recently both Clinton and Bush tried to keep illegal activities secret. Unfortunately it happens all the time. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

Yet you say that Ellsberg got off easy? Which is it? The government bungled the case from start to finish. He could have been convicted and served a lengthy sentence. Clear enough? HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

Yes, a country has a right to know when its government is lying to the citizens. Every war is decisive, some more than others. Citizens do not have the right, or the need, to know the details of every negotiation made by the government as long as those negotiations arelegal and in the best interest of the people. In many cases the effectiveness of those negotiations is dependent upon secrecy. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

Wasting bandwidth? Who is the one that asks questions that have already been answered? That would be YOU. Do you really think I care if you think I have no credibility? You think too highly of your own opinion. And I am not backtracking. I have been consistent in my stance. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

Ahhhh...French bashing! I have a friend who lives in Monaco. He was explaining how Monaco has an agreement with France for military services. I asked him, "So, if Monaco is ever attacked, the French will surrender for you?" He just laughed and said, 'Exactly!". HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

And i humbly apologize for anything i said without understaning your condition. Yeah, kinda the same boat. But with my condition it is just a matter of parts replacement. Your is different. I smoked pot a couple times in high school just to see what it was like. Like being drunk only without the nausea or the hangover. Funny thing was, my friends said i walked normal while high. Go figure that one out. Can't say i like riding choppers. Never sat one that handled worth a damn, rode even worse. I've had two HD Road King cop bikes. Great bargains and that 103 makes loads of torque. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

Hard to say what would have happened had the government not FUBAR'ed the case. that wasn't the question. Yes, he got off easy. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

Holy fuck, here i go having to repeat myself because somebody was TOO FUCKING LAZY to read the entire thread. I have already stated in this thread...at least TWICE...that i have nothing against illegal activities being brought out and made public. NOTHING! IS THAT EASY ENOUGH FOR YOU TO UNDERSTAND? Holy fucking Jesus shit some people can't fucking pay attention. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

so...Daniel Ellsberg got off easy, then, right? Hard to say what would have happened had the government not FUBAR'ed the case. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

When you said it was good news I thought maybe Palin had decided to run as a Democrat. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

It is called espionage and people have been executed for it. Assange knew the documents were classified and that they were illegally obtained. At the very least he knowingly recieved stolen property, a crime in itself. Why is he in a class with Bin Laden? Both are doing what they can to damage the US. The only difference is that Bin Laden's method is more visible and bloodier...for now. Only time will tell how much, if any, damage results from Assange being, as you said, an "enabler". HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

Spina bifida occulta. Almost got by without any symptoms but not quite. I have, for lack of a better term, a "lazy step" with my left leg. Not a limp or shuffle, just weak. It puts uneven stress on my lower back and hips and cause problems in those areas. I used to jog and bike to try to keep some balance in muscle tone, and it helped for a while until x-rays started to show deteriation of my right hip socket. Doctors said it was from using the right leg to do most of the work. I'll turn 50 this year and am looking at a hip replacement before 55. Since you know somebody with SB then you know i have gotten off easy. A young lady i met in the hoisptial is being cut up piece by piece due to poor circulation. First a toe on one foot, then the other. Then one foot...then the other. Just last year they took a leg at the knee. Contrary to what you may think I don't hate people who smoke pot. I really don't hate anybody. Well, ok, Assange and Bin Laden. I just see it as a waste of money and time just like excessive drinking. The world is too wonderful and beautiful of a place to miss one second of because of being stoned. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

Shouldn't you be busy convincing yourself that you really did threaten to grind out a weld, unless the Dr. paid you the fee that a physician charges? Maybe, you're just to busy convincing yourself that you could not join the military due to a severe, crippling birth defect (yet you skydive?) Waaaaaaaaaa, Get the fuck over it your fucking self. I served while you were still doing the back stroke in your daddy's nut sack. So nice of you to want others to go to war while you cower beneath your mommy's skirt. You do realize that you are not completely male until the ovaries drop and become testicles, do you not? Maybe you should give those ovaries a little nudge. Oh... and there is nothing wrong with rolling the U.S. on a motorcycle for awhile. I've been through near every state on my bike. You have no idea what true freedom is. Of course, it is against the law to entice a riot, much like it is illegal to start an illegal war that killed more than 100k and still killing people everyday. Yup, Iraq is such a paradise that it is major destination for terrorist wishing to soak up some sun. I did get over it...I got even. You served. So? I know a lot of people who served. None feel it makes their side of a discussion any more right than the other guys. Yep, I have a BD. It has kept me from doing a lot of things. Most things I do in spite of it. You should be thankful you don't have to deal with it. I can tell by your attitude that you would not be able to emotionally handle being physically challenged even a little bit. I don't know what freedom is? Dude, I have enjoyed more freedom than you will ever know exists. Travel the country by bike? That's not freedom. You still depend on "the man" for the road, gas, etc. That isn't freedom, that's just traveling. Since you like quotes form movies and such, remember this line from a song? "Freedoms just another word for nothing left to lose." That is a hell of a lot closer to the truth than anything you can quote from Easy Rider. Now, go back to admiring yourself in the mirror. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

More childishness? My goodness! Who woulda thunk it? Childish? Not hardly. Childish is ignoring all that has been posted. Everything you brought up in your post has already been addressed. Do not expect people to continuously repeat themselves just so you don't have to read. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

Freedom with restrictions is not freedom at all. It is merely a leash with a few more inches to roam. Quote from the movie Easy Rider: "Oh, yeah, that's right. That's what's it's all about, all right. But talkin' about it and bein' it, that's two different things. I mean, it's real hard to be free when you are bought and sold in the marketplace. Of course, don't ever tell anybody that they're not free, 'cause then they're gonna get real busy killin' and maimin' to prove to you that they are. Oh, yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom. But they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em." Sorry to bust your bubble, but all freedoms you have are restricted. Ever hear that you don't have the right to yell fire in a crowded theater..unless there actually is a fire? Don't like it? Waaaa....get the fuck over it. As far as quoting Easy Rider....you do realize they were two homeless guys spending most of their time stoned out of their heads, right? Just because a line is used in a movie doesn't make it fact. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

Try to follow the conversation, ok? HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

It has nothing to do with freeedom of speach. But I guess your one of those who think freedom comes with no restrictions. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

Thankfully we don't have to go to either extreme. I believe people have a right to know when their government is behaving badly, and I also believe that for a government to provide adequate security for it's interests a certain amount of secrecy is neccessary. I don't believe there will ever be a concensus on the grey area in between. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

Difference being MLK stayed within the law. All his speaches were above board and legal. All his rallies were legal and had permits. His marches had take the steps to be legal. He stayed within the law because he knew going outside the law would only give ammunition to those that opposed him. ASSange makes his way by breaking the law without regard to consequence for anyone accept himself. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

Who do you think should be responsible for releasing secret info? Obviously the government isn't going to release any if they can help it, and people like ASSange want to release everything. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

I've already said...maybe you missed it...that i am not opposed to exposing illegal activity on part of the government. What I am opposed to is the indiscriminate release of documents by somebody who should not have them to begin with. It is not up to ASSange what secrets of the US should be made public and which ones shouldn't. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

It is scary to think there are people who believe all of that. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

I know that he did not know the contents of the documents because he did not read them. Pretty simple. MLK was a traitor? How? In what way? I guess we can all be grateful that you are not entrusted with sensitive information that can affect national security. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.

I have stated the 'difference' as I see it. MANY times: No one has yet named a single incident of someone, something being put in danger nor a life that has been jeopardized, nor a foreign relationship that has been damaged by what Wikileaks has done. And I have stated already that ASSange did not know the contents of the documents he released. You are claiming to differentiate between things you have not even seen....unless, of course, you have actually read each and every document, which I doubt. Not all damage from leaked secrets is immediate. Not all damage from leaked secrets is apparent. HAMMER: Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the object we are trying to hit.