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Jo has stated her conclusion (Duane Weber was Dan Cooper) promised proof and predictably failed to deliver it. What conclusion has Tom put forward? He teases, but I dont think he has done what Jo has done. If Tom has a conclusion I don't know what it is. I think it is unfair to stick him with that looney propeller snag theory. He was careless in his speech but I don't think he really believes that explanation for upriver transport. You know I really can see why Snow is pissed off about Tom getting Cooper currency samples from the FBI. Snow should get some too, but he never ever will. Kissing butt does pay Snow, in blackened twenties. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Jo, I wish just once you would deliver the evidence you promise. Just once. You always come up with excuses. Now you are protecting the victims of "unspeakable crimes". How noble of you. Why protect the perpetrator? You can keep the victims names confidential. Looks like you are back on the "Duane had possession of the rifle used to kill Martin Luther King" story. For a petty crook Duane sure got around is all I can say. As for the idea that you can dictate the terms under which the FBI can examine allegedly key NORJACK evidence who do you think you are to expect such favored treatment? I used to wonder why Jerry seemed so mean to you. Now I am less baffled. I still believe you are sincere but you are also obsessed with control. It allows you to maintain belief in an obsession that would never withstand the scrutiny of the public. You said unequivocally that Duane Weber was Dan Cooper. You promised to share your evidence. Now you equivocate and backtrack coming up with noble excuses for your failure to keep your promise. OK, I get it. It is always going to be this way. You won't change. If you did you couldn't hold on to the illusion that a lying petty crook conned you into thinking he was a big shot A list mastermind criminal, a folk hero and yes, actually an admired person in the eyes of many. Duane never parachuted from anything let alone a 727 on a dark and stormy night. If it comforts you to think otherwise that's OK, but stop teasing us with false claims of proof. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

You got lucky with Shelly Jerry. My joke was based on reality. Didn't take any creativity. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Speaking of tats, if Carr were serious he'd get one of the Cooper sketch with "born to lose" under it. None of his talk really commits him to anything. He can always claim that finding Cooper isnt his real job. A visible tattoo would commit him. It would also help recruiting from a population of bright young people who see the FBI as impossibly square. Your thoughts Snow? 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Jerry, I never ate money, just harvested it. My ex could eat it at a pretty good clip. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

I've got something zanier than the propeller theory for upstream transport: freighter wakes. DEAD MAN SURFING. Who said you had to be alive to catch a perfect wave? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5PsF7y1Jdk 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

And does anyone wonder why Snow needs such a perfectly level datum? Otherwise the fire control solution for his custom designed AA cannons won't work properly. Those OV 10s had better steer clear of his NO FLY ZONE. Pneumatically fired water balloons leave almost no trace but have a lot of kinetic energy. You just need a long lead angle. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

And can you tell the forum why that interests you? 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

It's interesting Jo says she's waiting on verification. She never worried about verification before...why bother now? Jo, Let Snow take a crack at "verification." He is pretty good at it in my opinion. Remember when I got all excited about Duane's inexplicable prison pardon? Snow iced that one fast. He has even found a map of Billy Waughs landing area in a rainy night HALO jump over VERY hostile territory. He was the only person who really dug deep on NB 6 NB 8, outboard pull mods, Dan Poynter and USAF pull force studies. All that and he has never even jumped. I'm not saying he can solve every mystery, but his track record here is very impresive. His talent is supplemented by others here, most of whom you know. By withholding info you are wasting valuable resources that are right under your nose. Hurry, before Snow gets tired of all this, digs in and goes silent in his secret mountain fortress. Time for teases is over. Time for proof has arrived. Air it out Jo. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Looks to me like the proof Jo promised is mutating into another string of ambiguous coincidences from which one could speculate that Duane was Cooper. Mouse, Roach, lost or hidden prison and SS records, and sentimental journeys to the suspected area of the jump do not put Duane under a chute. At least Billy Waugh and Sheridan Peterson can be put under canopies over hostile terrain (Nam and fire areas respectively) and both made night jumps. Both have plausible grudges, Peterson's being more explicit than Waugh's. Duane's tenous connection to parachuting is: 1. an unidentified piece of suspected parachute hardware sold at a garage sale and not found in any old or new catalogs of parachute hardware. 2. an oral expression of knowledge about how paragliders work with no further details. 3. an unverified and highly doubtful claim that convicts from San Quentin and or Folsom state prisons served as smoke jumpers. 4. a claim that Duane knew an aircraft mechanic who may have had some skydiving connections. 5. a relative of Duane's who worked at Boeing in the pre 727 era and may have had access to "schematics". 6. a "night clerk" who says he remembers Duane checking into a local hotel right before the jump flight under the name of Collins. 7. employment by a corporate affiliate of JM Wave (which admittedly has some Spook connections) as an insurance salesman. 8. a "sentimental journey" to the NORJACK jump area where he pointed out a location where Cooper allegedly came out of the woods. 9. a deathbed confession that he was Dan Cooper. Need I go further? Time to stop teasing and start producing evidence Jo. Until you do I will be relentless, but still cordial. After all, I still believe you are sincere in your beliefs. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

OK Jo, here is your clue: PUBLISH THE STUFF HERE! NOW. Let others opine on the probative value and what to do with the information. Otherwise it cannot be taken seriously and will be regarded as a tease. What bad thing can happen from airing it out? You said the "authorities" are not interested. Until you share the info the only voice you will hear is your own. If there is something Cooper-connected in Duane's past tell the world about it. Duane is dead, the case is cold and the FBI will ignore any Duane is Cooper claims. What is stopping you from revealing all your "WOW" stuff Jo? 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

I think Ckret is lucky he is assigned to bank robberies. Can you imagine going through all that FBI training, having visions of being a James Bond type of guy, and then spending years sitting in front of a computer pretending to be an 11 year old girl interested in a "relationship" with an adult? If you can't fight crime effectively, manufacture it and catch it. Better UCR stats that way. You control the whole process. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

typo? Or do you mean "believe" when you write "think" and it is not a typo with a missing word? It could certainly be more cordial or collegial. We waste a LOT of time fighting/insulting/disparaging here. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Good one Snow. Did you decipher that Post It which has his FBI password so crudely encrypted? You probably designed the processor for the FBIs servers and are already running in and out of a "back door" known only to you. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Those tape measures were so yesterday. Laser rangefinders would have made a much better impression with regards to the "scientific" task at hand. I am interested in the pollen found on the tie. Lots of uncertainty regarding post flight contamination, but maybe it was pollen unique to Cooper's home area and stuck to the tie preflight. Palmer's work really seems to be taking a beating in light of what the Fazios and others have reported about Tena Bar. Could he have been that far off the mark? Can someone explain to me how big bundles and very small particles of Cooper bills would BOTH arrive at the same general location at Tena Bar if they came from a distant location? Snow? Jerry? Sluggo and hey, how about Safe? Did the particles come from the found bundles after they landed at Tena bar? That seems unlikely to me. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Where is Orange these days? 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

It's odd how the Internet chat brings out different aspects of people's personalities. Is it the anonymity? Who knows. I have met Snow and I have corresponded quite a bit with Sluggo. They both are nice guys in the real world away from this forum. Put them on adjoining stools in the same bar and I'd bet they'd get along fine. They'd probably both be buying shots for Bruce hoping to see more of what we got a brief glimpse of on the National Geographic show. I do think Tom ought to post his comments on the propeller theory. If he was the innocent victim of creative splicing just tell us. Ground control to Major Tom. Didn't the Ingrams try to clean up the money themselves hoping they could cash it in at face value? I wonder what their cleaning process might have done to coloration. Maybe nothing but it is worth thinking about. Is it possible that they found much more than they turned over but are now in a Catch 22 situation where they can't admit it and can't do anything with the money? I do think Jerry has a good point about shrinking wildlands and dense development making the discovery of a Cooper jump artifact likely given enough time. Remember, his rig is out there somewhere. VERY unlikely that he packed it out with him. If he didnt land in the water it will probably be found someday, maybe with a skelton, maybe not. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

You sure didn't pull any trickery Snow, but let's see what Tom says. I have a real hard time believing he would actually support the propeller theory. While you are at it, would you please apply Snow scrutiny to the Zapgruder JFK hit film? I am sure the Warren Commission missed some key points. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Hey, saw the show thanks to Snow who beamed it down to me on a spread spectrum UHF link at blinding speed. Gotta say that I loved Bruce's moment on the silver screen. Great presence in that bar scene Bruce. "Captain, we are losing cabin pressure!" Sheesh. Can't they do a tech sanity check before they put the project in final form? Has anyone been on Main Street near the border between Venice and Santa Monica CA? There is a shop chock full of "science" props for Hollywood movies. It used to be free but now the guy charges admission. Tons of lab glass, high voltage arc stuff, scopes, test gear, meters, gauges, etc. None of Tom's gear or methods is explained. With that omission, his lab might as well be a version of this prop shop. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Hmmm, I'd say Tom K got PONED by Snow who is never complacent. I had already accepted the story that it was National Geo's theory. How could Tom be serious? He is always saying he can't discuss stuff because of pending publications, but he has put this out in the public eye so no hiding now. Tom, come on the forum and explain your propeller snag upriver transport thesis. Defend it. Was it out of context splicing by the show's production editors? 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Thanks Jerry! Very interesting info. You will never find me promoting a conspiracy theory by the way. To me conspiracy theories are almost always wrong and a waste of time. Surely someone must have collected some Cooper bill particles. When can I buy one on eBay? The large pieces of bills were too pricey for me. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

What I am wondering is whether there was evidence at Tena Bar of a LOT more Cooper money than the semi intact bills? The fact that nobody but Fazio mentions this surface $20 bill particle debris field makes me wonder about the accuracy of his memory, but I wasn't there and he was. Could it have been seen by him and removed by others before the FBI completed a through scene investigation? 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

True Snow, I can always depend on you for a reality check, a reminder that entropy rules the universe and people are weak. but... what if the currency particle field was really there exactly as described by Fazio? It is one of the "N" possibilities, right? Or am I missing something basic here? 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Were you benevolent enough not to upload commands to the station keeping thrusters Snow? Maybe you just reoriented the main antenna to favor your QTH. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Jerry, We agree that the ship prop theory is absurd. How do you explain Fazio's description of a large $20 bill particle debris field, not buried, all on top and apparently deposited by a very recent high tide? Do you think Fazio's memory is accurate? If so, what do you conclude from the data? 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.