Kennedy

I am fairly liberal on social issues. That means I believe in freedom, not the Democratic party. There's a distinct difference. In terms of the federal government, I want them out and uninvolved. States should be the ones making those decisions. As to what I think of each issue, well, I tend to be very Libertarian on domestic issues. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

And what exactly are you claiming I missed? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

No. Once someone has done something wrong (committing libel or slander) they should be punished. Do you support banning newspapers to prevent libel from happening? That would equate to baning guns to prevent deaths. Yes or no. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

You refute your own case in this post. The word fire is not illegal. People are not gagged when they go into a theater to prevent them from yelling fire. It's called prior restraint, and it's a bad thing. There are already laws against being irresponsible with your firearm. That's why the guys in her examples were arrested (and lost their license). Why punish all responsible people for the irresponsibility of a few? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

That is impossible. Gun owners and especially those with a CCW are all law abiding citizens and never commit a crime. This is just one of those pinko liberal conspiracies. Can you say "strawman?" I knew you could. The fact is CCW holders are, as a group, much more law abiding than the population at large. Look at the number of people who commit crimes, and then look at the nubmer of CCW holders who commit crimes. The second number has universally been shown to be significantly smaller. No one has claimed that all CCW holders are angels. It should be noted that the vast majority of licenses that are revoked for reasons that have nothing to do with misuse of the gun, so that one thousand number quoted for Florida means nothing. Also, that one thousand is out of how many again? Yeah, that's what I htought. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Right, let's punish everyone for the failure of the few. While we're at it, let's just ban everything that anyone has ever used when they were angry. People have to be protected from themselves, afterall. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Private property owners have the right to prevent anyone they choose from entering. Posting "no guns" signs is allowed. If someone doesn't leave, call the cops. It's not that hard. If lethal force is justified in defending yourself or another, then it is justified whether the instigator is drunk or not. Being drunk doesn't excuse you from teh consequences of attacking someone. It is up to the cober CCW holder to decide whether or not a gun is needed, just like in any other setting. Of course I would, that's part of being a friend. Doesn't mean I have to use a gun to do it. A gun is a last resort for me, just like it is for a cop. Having a gun does not immediately rule out other options. You don't think alerting the manager or leaving may have been more productive means of dealing with the asshat? You escalated the situation by confronting the drunk yourself. You have such inherent distrust of people that I believe you wouldn't trust anyone other than yourself with a gun. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

You don't have the two drinks. Anything else is unacceptable. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

That same logic can be applied to every potentially dangerous item. I could replace it with knives, metal pens, glass bottles, and more. Do you subscribe to the notion that all people must be restricted to prevent bad people from doing bad things? Where do you draw the line? This varies state to state (and some states do not have preemtion laws, so it can vary city to city in some states). I am in New Jersey at the moment, so I am not allowed to carry anywhere, but that's another discussion. In CCW states, some places that are off limits are churches, school buildings or school grounds, and private property (different posting requirements). Some have more, some less. Courtrooms are universally off limits. The only limits I support are courtrooms, school buildings during school hours (except school employees), and private property. Anything else seems foolish, and just creates anoter VDZ. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

I agree, that's why I would make it illegal to carry while drunk. You don't have to go toa bar to be drunk, right? But what's the problem with sober people who want to go to a bar and stay sober? Why shouldn't they be able to defend themselves from the violent people you described? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

I wouldn't say the system is screwed up, just this particular Victim Disarmament Zone section of the law. (my other gripe is CCW laws that create VDZs in parks and parking lots) witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Did you read councilman24's post? According to that, the disarmed CCW holder was five feet from the shooter. Not quite your "fighting half the crowd" scenario, is it? Either of us can create hypotheticals with the best- and worst-case scenarios. I just don't understand why some people want to base legal policy on only the worst case possibilities. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

This is an arrogant, uninformed claim. We didn't enter WWII until after most of the work had been done and most of the human sacrafice had already been made. We didn't save the world during WWII. There was a lot of effort put in, and a lot of deaths on all sides, but can you really say "most of the work was done" before the US began pouring troops into Britain? It's not like the Nazis were reeling on their heels when the allies invaded Normandy. (ps - the death count prior to US involvment is not very relevant because Russians thought the best way to take a machine gun nest was to get everyone shot until they ran out of bullets. During Nazi eastern movement, if ten Russians died for one Nazi, the Russians counted this as success because they outnumber the nazis by more than ten to one.) edit: I had a great time and got along fabulously with most continetals. The only times I had problems were dealing with Air France employees and some people in London. Oh yeah, and getting ripped off when exchanging currency sucks, but that happens to everybody. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Well, if better is a measure of effectiveness, then the NRA is doing much better than the DD groups. You should realize that the NRA is the largest and most comprehensive source of trianing on firearms today. Some people prove they can't be trusted with responsibility. Does that mean we all should suffer for their lack of discipline/ training/ respect/ reliability? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

So you support being able to carry in establishments that serve alcohol then? Afterall, you're not banned from flying with hours of leaving a bar, are you? Just within hours of drinking, right? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

You obviously haven't looked into this very deeply. There are countless documents to tell us exactly what the founding fathers thought about 2nd Amendment issues. There are letters, published papers, debates, and so on. (separation of church and state is for another thread, but you should recognize that this idea didn't even make it into the constitution, and firearms did) THey have. There are many SCUS decisions that interpret or reference the real meaning of the 2nd Amendment. None have ever come up with this "communal right" garbage. All have stated that it is an individual right. One, Miller, even stated that arms appropriate to military use are directly covered and meant for civilian ownership. Yes, that mean full-automatic firearms. The founding fathers were quite clear, if you have a clear mind and are willing to listen. And those are just the ones off the top of my head. Can you find even one quote by a founding father that says citizens have no right to arms? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Damn thats 2..... I'm 5'3" And you're all still short! Mwah hahahahahahahaha!!! Sorry, had to get that out after smacking my head on the (recently lowered) shower curtain rail. ps - I hate that swish swish swish, just see the Rain Gear thread. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

It's easy, because coconut is probably the second most nasty (common) food available today, right behind onions. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

They're putting Gore Tex right into fleece now? Oh, now that gets my attention... (gets me confused as well, but in a good way) witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

OK, so I'm going to get wet. Not "dunked in a lake" wet, or "caught in an asian monsoon" wet, but the next step down. Maybe "a few miles inland from hurricane landfall" wet. What I want is something small (not bulky) and something that doesn't make that "swish, swish" noise that all winter coats and ponchos seem to make. Tall sizes would be nice. Any suggestions? Bargains are good, function is better. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Now if only that were actually enforced... (inclusion via the 14th for the states would be nice, as well) ah, wishful thinking. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

That would be Boseephus, aka Hank Williams Junior. pronounced: BOH SEE fuss witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Sorry, I'm so used to hearing about "blood running in the streets" predictions that they have become laughable. I'll admit it, I smile when I hear it. Oh, those goofy gun banners. Mabye they should talk to Bill Engvall's people. ps - what time is it in Seattle? It's not even late here anymore, now it's early. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Does the phrase "polka-dot and striped shirt" mean anything to you? I'm still trying to decide whether the Ronco Knives will be a big hit or a big flop for my mom. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Well, since I define expert as the person who knows the most about any given topic in the room at that time, sure, I'm an expert. The exact phrase was added to US coins sometime around the civil war. ps - This might help. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*