Ron

Most states that don't consider another states professional licenses have a way to be recongnized in that state. You can take a test, a class, or appeal a board...In this case you can't do anything and a marriage would be invalid. So a same sex domestic couple that moved to MO will not be allowed to have the smae benefits as an opposite sex couple from the same state. And yes a National certification would be good in MANY cases for professional training. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

The DZ said they would have organizers for all skill levels..they didn't. While they may have lost the organizer to "life" they still did not have one. People gave suggestions on how they could have made that happen..: a. they could have had a FF organizer do some belly jumps. b. They could have given a free slot to someone like yourself, or Kallend, or Bo, or any number of other jumpers and made them the LO for the day. The fact is they didn't have one...And it seems from the posts that no one cared about that. Yep, so whats wrong with him bringing it up? If no one ever complains then no one knows there is a problem. I like to hear both good and bad about an event I run...In fact at my last tunnel camp I would not release them till they had both a positive and are of improvment comment about both themselves AND the camp. I have no doubt that next year the LO situation will be better handled. It also seems to me that the focus of this event was free flying....Good information to have if you don't like freeflying. He went to an event that had LO's so he would not HAVE to do all that. If he wanted to do all the work himself he could have stayed at this home DZ. He didn't have fun because he went to an event that had somehtings that were promissed that they didn't deliver. I am sure there are REASONS and I am also sure that Missy and Rook will fix it now that they know about it. But the fact is they didn't deliver this time. Now I would be interested to see if this was his first boogie and maybe he had higher than realistic expectations... "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

From what I was told...By Kermit himself (he lives near Lakeland) he didn't have the degree when he designed it... "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

YOU are not an organizer. He went to a boogie that said it had organizers...He seems not to have gotten what he wanted or what he thought he was told he would get. If you go to a boogie and your buddies start jumping together..thats not an organizer you could do that at home. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Thats what THEY said...I know you liberals well enough that even the laziest will not go hungry "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Weeks special "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Im for HELPING those that HELP themselves... In this case they wanted to live off our dimes and not do shit for it. The SYSTEM made it so they could play it and live and do as they please. The system is fucked up, and they are wrong for taking advantage of it. For the record I don't even have cable or satelitte. I don't watch but news on my local stations. So, I don't need a plasma TV. I think these two serve as a good example.. Are you telling me that ALL people on welfare can't get a job? They CHOOSE to live in poverty...They could get a job and WORK to get out..but the choose not to. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

There is a BIG difference between the two...He killed in cold blood. The women killed after being ATTACKED and by some reports seriously hurt. She killed while defending herself against a CRIMINAL...This jackass just killed. Now if the woman let the the guy leave and then the next day hunted her attacker down..then it would be the same. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Massachusetts allows gay marriage. Missouri just outlawed it (Well it was already against the law, but the now have a public voted on Amendment that says the same). Per NPR morning edition. So now what? Mo. does not have to recognize a marriage from Ma.? It WILL take the Feds to work this out. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

No what I am saying is that they decided to play the system so they can live off of it instead of getting a job and helping themselves. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You didn't seem to say anything about KERRY (Who this thread is about). "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

He commited the crime...He should die. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You got more info on this? I heard that Kerry had a faked war movie...But I have not seen it. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Most battles are 3-7 meters. Long range is not needed. More bullets is good since most spray and pray anyway. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I plan on buying real estate...But I need to learn more first..right now I am sitting duck. BTW ALL of my insurance costs me about 30 bucks a mth. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Yep cool huh? It was not excluded, since its a group policy in a fortune 500 company. Same with the disability and health. I checked. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

We have guys on here that do that kind of shit all the time. Some of the best planes were designed that way. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Its the same reason that people will jump even when they have several grand on Credit Cards. People only live in the NOW and they don't plan for the future. They would rather go to the WFFC than put the money they will spend there and pay off a Credit Card. And for the most part they are encouraged to do it. There was a post on here afew mths ago http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=593197#593197 Where a jumper asked that question....Look at the responces... 71% said to go to the WFFC and live off the Credit cards...And she would not even be able to jump. We as a collective are telling her to blow off the worries about the debt and go party...Man is that ever stupid. The same thing goes on with medical insurance. If you ask everyone on here if they think they are going to get hurt...Most will say never. If you ask on here how many have gotten hurt..Most will say they have. But EGO will not let a good number of people realize that they WILL at some point fuck up and get hurt. We have already shown that skydivers as a whole are NOT responsible with money... So what are the odds that a person that does not think they will get hurt will spend money on something they don't think they will need when they could spend that money on jumps and beer? Stupid really. When I got divorced I was let in some DEEP Credit Card debt...I quit jumping, ate Ramen and PP&J's till it was paid off. More than 5 grand gone in 3 mths. I continue to live beneath my means....I save over 25-30% of my salary (15% into a 401k, and the rest into a savings account to buy a house). I still make 300 jumps a year and drive a 2001 Mustang GT (Bought used). And not one cent on Credit Cards. I also have heath insurance (2 policies), a quarter of a million in life insurance (I have no kids so my parents are told to help my sisters kid with school and party like hell if I die), and long and short term disability insurance. I however am anal when it comes to money and my checking account is balanced to the penny...I don't expect anyone else to live by my standards...But I do think its stupid as hell to continue to sell your future to live now and not plan for the future. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

They were given money to live off of. They were given money for child care. They were getting food stamps. They got free bus passes. They were living free in Government housing. School was being paid for. They (Two of them) told me that they could not afford all of that if the took a job they were offered. They would lose the money given to them. They would lose the free child care. They would lose the food stamps. They would of had to pay for the bus passes. They would of had to pay to live in the government housing, or move out of the housing. They would of had to pay for school. So they and I were NOT wrong. Its just the were using more than ONE source to compare. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Then they would not have to do it... Then you help pay for childcare and make them go get a job. Then you help them with food stamps and public houseing...But the had better be working. I would rather pay for that than pay lazy people to sit on their asses. I don't agree...I have had students in school with me on welfare..the tell me all the good it does them and that they are not going to get a job cause its better for them not to work. Remove the "small" (as you say) percent that could work...And I don't mind helping those that can't. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Well if he didn't attack her than it would be a different story... But Criminals in the act don't have the same rights as someone defending themselves. If he did it...I am glad he is dead. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You can if you don't know who he is... And he did say he asked Rook and Missy about RW organizing...You would think they would have pointed him out then. If I went to a boogie that advertised LO's for ALL levels and I could not find one at the level I wanted...I would be upset. If I asked and was offered to jump with a World Champ in a disapline that I don't like/don't do I would not find that much of a comfort or concession. They advertised LOs for all levels and it SEEMS they did not provide that. If they DID provide it it SEEMs like it was not well known...Maybe even by the DZO's. The CASA not flying...Well I can totally understand that. It did fly, just not as much as he may like...Oh well. What was the 30.00 registration for? Points to improve: If you say you will have LO's for all levels....Have them. And make them EASY to see/find. Booths like at the WFFC and hats, or really UGLY shirts like at Zhills. BTW having a bunch of locals willing to jump with a guy if he makes it happen is NOT having an LO. An LO should be EASY to find. I was a LO at the WFFC in 96. We had anouncements of when to meet at the tent. Andat Zhills we used to make announcements at the 20 min call to meet in front of manifest. Today we collect tickets and EVERYONE knows who the LO's are and if you ask you get taken to one. Sounds like they didn't have a good plan....Knowing the Nelsons..I would bet that changes next year. I love to hear people bitching...I would rather they bring a problem up so it can be solved rather than stew about it, and talk bad about the incident for years. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

really good stuff. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Make it a flat percentage tax with no deductions. Then it's fair. Also reduce public support so those that are living on the system have to do WORK to get it...Pay them to pick up trash on the highway as opposed to just collecting a check every mth. Make them cut grass, paint buildings, mop floors..ect. Quit handing out money for nothing. and I firmly believe that most of those "poor" could do better if they were not LAZY. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Still more fair than just sticking it to the rich guy. 1,000 - 0 = 1,000. Thats a big difference. 9,000 - 5,000 = 4,000 Thats a big difference. 22,000 - 20,000 = 2,000 I consider 2 grand to be a big difference...Maybe not compared to 100,000. But 2 grand is still alot. In this case it is the middle guy getting hurt the most while the low guy gets it free. I'm not so cold as to take the last nickel form a broke guy. I also know you can't take what they don't have. I DO think that there are a large number of lazy folks that just live off the system...But if they don't want to quit being lazy there is not much I can do to change their life out look..And liberals will not let them starve.....So I HAVE to support them. I would rather let them keep what little they earn than pay to provide services to them. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334