Ron

You claimed: Nukes have been used and the world did not come to a stop. You are over reacting using emotion instead of logic. You could not use a Nuke to retailiate against a terrorist organization. Nukes are only good against a Country. The major (and in most cases only) use of a Nuke is as a deterant. As a weapon they are not nearly as good of a choice as traditional weapons. This shows your lack of tactical thinking. The fact that a Nuke is best as a deterant is the reason that we should put effort into preventing other countries from getting them...And at all cost prevent terrorist groups from getting one...They do not fear retaliation. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Well the idea is to not allow someone who will use the weapon to get them. I think Nukes are very bad, stupid weapons. But just because I think they are stupid does not mean I want to give them up and let others have them...The only dumber thing that having a Nuke, is to not have them when evryone else has them. The plan should be to prevent others from getting them while reducing our stockpile. Well some say the same thing about guns, or even condoms. It would be stupid to have the weapon, or not have it, and never plan on using it if certain conditions were met. MAD prevented the world from being destroyed. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

OK,,, I must admit you made me laugh with that one "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

So what? Judy is an AFF "I". That trumps your "Coach" Even a bigger so what? Maybe you should check to see who HER husband is huh? And maybe see at which DZ she works at and for whom she works. I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess that she has more access to the USPA than you, or your wife. Hell I'll give you a hint...She does AFF at a National Director's DZ, and is married to a Regional Director. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I don't care if a guy is gay or not. However, I will say that having been in the Infantry that some of the soldiers would try to beat the hell out of the guy if they found out. Not smart, not even nice, but a very real fact. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

My take? He had the right to draw to protect himself, but not the right to detain them. He could have let them leave. I think he played cop. He just came back from a place where guns are a needed part of your daily life. His job is to capture bad guys...He did the same thing here. He should have not stopped them. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

What part of this were you not able to read?: Besides a smart boy like you I bet can find it if you bothered to look. But I don't want to confuse newer jumpers with a complicated process. I'd bet on doing nothing would doing more harm, than just pulling the reserve. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

No, I was PLANNING on cutting away at 1600, but was unable. 700 feet was the first I could get the handle. After and altitude check and knowing that I was dead if I did nothing the only choice was to cutaway. I didn't think "If I had an RSL I would be fine...So I'll just pull the cutaway handle" Who said I was off the hook? I did some stupid shit and lived. You seem to think that a device will allow you to do dummber stuff. That is device dependency and is dangerous and not safe. Love how you left off that I think you are sustituting smart choices for toys. I have a stepped E-Procedure system that I am not going to share in an open forum...If you want PM me and I will tell you about it. Its a PERSONAL choice and not somehting I would teach of encourage others to use. If you think you can factor all that in and still have time to save your life I think you are saddly mistaken. The number one comment in all accidents is "It was just happening so fast". And even if you do have it, it may not work. Ask Egon. I hope oyu nevre find yourself in that situation...But really do you htink you will be so calm as to be able to rationaly think out the choices you have in the very limited time you have left? I'm not sure I will be able to, and I have plenty of mals....I pack like shit "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Damn fine question. I have not put much thought into a Skyhook equipt system E-procedures yet...I don't have a hook. What I would do right now is pull the reserve and monitor the opening to see if I can cutaway the main cleanly. I have performed my cutaway live from around 700 feet once already. A skyhook will reduce the altitude that you will get a reserve...However both Egon and Bill have said that there are times when any RSL could not work due to being disconnected. With that in mind I would most likey perform the same procedures. Just use Egons story of the RSL not being hooked up at Quincy. I know several stories of people having RSL's that wer enot hooked up when they needed them. The111 had a story about a year ago. I agree that when the shit hits the fan you will react and not have the time to think it out as some on here claim they will. I have 6 cutaways. The last one was kinda "normal". But thats after 3500 jumps and 6 mals. It was the first one that was not exciting. The only cool part was my main landed in the swoop pond at Zhills...Hows that for a spot? Other than that I tend to doubt that in a wrap at 400 feet I will be calm and able to think rationaly. Call me cynical, but I doubt anyone with less cutaways or none will be able to either. So its best to have a plan and stick with it. The BEST plan is to stop the skydive and the best way to do that is the reserve. Depending on the Skyhook to be connected and work, even though I have very little doubt it will, is putting too much reliance on the device...Its kinda like going stable and waiting for the CYPRES to fire. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I have cutaway from 700 feet before. Well for starters he does not jump anymore. Possible, but more likley I see a person who is going to trust a device to allow them to make more dangerous choices. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Its in the SIM...And instructor should know that "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Nice to see you being mature...as normal Oh and 5-1 section E point 4. of your SIM...Might want to read it once in a while. 4. You should decide upon and take the appropriate actions by a predetermined altitude: a. Students and A-license holders: 2,500 feet. b. B-D license holders: 1,800 feet. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Nope, but then again I can spell it. Not even close, my ancestors made them learn english....I'd call that smart. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Some estimate that the use of the two nukes SAVED 350-400 thousand people that would have died in a land invasion. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

BS, one bomb is not going to end the world. It is reasoning like this that makes it so you will never be a leader. This I agree with. This kind of thinking is what teh terrorists want to hear. "See I can attack them and nothing will happen". I guess you would rather only the US die? The only wining move is not to play....But if the ball is in play, then play ball, don't sit on the bench. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You can't do that. Thats why you must prevent them from getting one. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

If everyone got rid of them I'd gladly do it...But as soon as we got rid of them, someone would use theirs. Thats the cold hard facts of the matter...Anything else is living in a daydream. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Really? Gee I wonder what a Hard deck is? You had better train those "Plans" Arbitrary altitude pulled from thin air? You clearly have no idea how the BSR's were written. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

If they have been in the sport 10 years but don't have a bunch of jumps...Say a rigger, packer..ect. Or maybe they live in a state with a small DZ up north and can't make a bunch of jumps, but have been making 50-100 a year, but have been doing it for years. I have seen both of these situations. They still have spent plenty of time on the DZ. Have you been skydiving for 10 years, or did you do your first jump 10 years ago..That is a BIG difference. Very true...You have to be active...But I know people who consider 100 jumps a year "a lot"...Its not here in FL, but it might be in North Dakota. But if the person has been active for 10 years, but does not get to jump much due to the DZ being under snow 6 mths out of the year,a nd being at a small Cessna DZ...100 jumps a year is pretty good. Well its kinda both. I don't think a person who shows up and makes 1,000 jumps his first year is in any position to be an instructor. Of course I don't think the guy with 25 years and 500 jumps is either. I had a hot shot come out to the DZ all proud he was gonna buy a ZP 150 canopy with very few jumps for only a few hundered bucks...The canopy? A Nova. All his buddies thought it was a good deal. I have been in the sport long enough to know it was not a good deal. Jump numbers did not help make that choice...Time in sport did. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Then why did you not vote "yes"? And the question was not would you cut away lower then normal if the shit hit the fan... The question was would you LOWER your planned hard deck. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Easy, I was born here, I didn't move here. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

No, the idea of additional saftey devices is to make things safer, not allow dumber things. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Hence the *about* "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Mike fought to keep her wishes. We were missing part of our country already. If you like giving up feel free. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Yeah, imagine if Mike had given up. Imagine if Washington had given up. Quitters never win, and the best you can do at times is go down with a fight. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334