diverdriver

I'm going to guess Louisiana? Have not found a reference to anything in the FAA daily intake. More info would be appreciated. Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

This wasn't urged by the other DZOs. The city was questioned why they shut down Horizon in 1995 (I was there) for this reason if they were going to allow skydiving there now. I'm not sure if Dana ever sued the city or not or whether there was a statute of limitations but it just seemed odd that things would be different at this city now. Apparently the same rule applies now as it used to. I tried to say something about it back a couple of weeks ago when this all came up. Seems I was right that the same rule applies to commercial businesses in Harrisonville, MO. Can they find a legal work around? We'll see. Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

OMG!! When did Sullivan, MO (outside St. Louis) lose their turbine!??? No turbines? Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

Well, I have sent a PM to the new DZO and asked that he respond to these questions. He has chosen to keep the information about who he is leasing the aircraft from to himself for now. Obviously come April 1 everyone should know. He said that he was keeping it to himself for business reasons. Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

I'm well aware of their DZ.com account. I'm hoping they will comment here. It doesn't do any good if I'm the only one who knows the answers. However, as I have done for many years now, I try to ask the educated questions so that jumpers can educate themselves too. Thanks for personal attack. Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

I'm glad Ed Scott was there. I guess this is a sign that USPA IS working for the individual jumper and not just the GM DZOs. I would like to come back to the point that Chris did not go to that prior council meeting of his own initiation. He was _asked_to_go and bring up any concerns about a DZ opening up at Harrisonville. Rememeber, we all jumped there years ago. This new DZO is an unknown quantity and the city may have wanted a local perspective. As for Tom, I don't know why he was there. You'll have to ask him like I asked Chris. I don't think Chris is the demon people like to make him out to be on this board. But I have some questions of my own about this new DZ. I would like to know who is going to be the pilot? Who is the owner/operator of the caravan? Who is responsible for Mx oversight? Has this new DZO ever managed ANY aircraft before? I bring this up because this DZ is not starting with a 182 which is fairly straight forward in complexity. These Caravans can be valued from 800,000 to 1,000,000 used. That's a significant asset and when things break they don't cost a few bucks but a lot of bucks. You already know this. And we already know what can happen in the KC area when Mx goes to shit. Dave, I hope you are going to be a regular jumper at this new DZ as I know your aircraft experience. I hope that you can be a resource of information for them and an advocate for the local jumpers. Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

So, did Ed Scott show up at the board meeting like someone elluded to in an earlier post? (he's the USPA government relations guy) Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

Holy crimmeny John! What's up man! How's the carpet biz? You still shooting video? ....thread hi-jack in progress. Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

Man that would have been great! I'm really looking forward though to stuff from Psalm 69 and Houses of the Mole.... N.W.O. ROCKS.... and actually I'm really digging The Great Satan... hopefully they'll play some stuff from their upcoming CD. The thing I love about Ministry is that they may be the one band that has gotten progressively HARDER with every CD rather than wussing out like every other band. Really? I heard they were going back to only doing all songs from "With Sympathy". Sorry Zen but they sold out man. Stainless steal provider! ...oh wait... that's not them Supernaut!!! .... oh wait... that's not them either... No name.... no slogan.... dang! can't remember any "Ministry" lyrics. Hmmmmm.... ...oh yah!!.... I'M READY TO FIGHT!!! SO WHAT SO WHAT!!! I'M READY TO FIIIIIIIIIIIIGHGGHT!!!! FIIIIIIIIIIIIIGHT!!!! ...yah, I saw them in Orlando. Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

Dave Ternes.... .... now that's a name I haven't heard in awhile. S'up Dave! Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

Tried to tell everyone in the beginning. Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

Ok... as they say... "the other side of the story". I did happen to just chat with Chris as he and I go back to the days of Horizon Skydiving at Harrisonvile and also worked together at SDC. I doubt very much he wants to get mired down in this debate but one thing he said to me (and I asked if I could post) is that he did not go to the meeting of his own innitiation. He was ASKED to advise the city on things related to skydiving. He was contacted by pilots who know the city council people originally. The city then asked for information on dropzones which he supplied to the council as asked. He was asked what concerns he might have if he was setting up on that airport and it seems that's exactly what he did. As for Tom I have no idea if he received the same invitation. As I said before, I knew there was more to this story than was being posted here in the beginning. Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

Ummmm.... p.j.? You might not know this but this is a skydiving forum in where people come to discuss things related to skydiving. So, trying to tell people to go fly a kite instead of talking about things related to skydiving on a skydiving forum is like telling heroin addicts to shoot talcum powder when a big bag of the nasty sutff is sitting in front of them. ....not going to happen. And please take this as light hearted sarcasm as I don't know you and would probably enjoy drinking a beer or any other beverage you like together.

Well, I'm certainly not trying to be selective. And no, I wasn't at the meeting and you say you were. Skydive Chicago had an experience with a medivac chopper being based there. It didn't last long even though all seemed to get along fine. As a pilot I was MOST concerned with an on-demand medivac being based there. SDC cranks loads hard on the weekends. We dump out lots of jumpers all at once and lots of tandems that take time to come down. This will most DEFINITELY impact response time of the medivac team. Now a caravan is not a twin otter and there will be only one plane up at a time (one caravan) but I can definitely see how it can be a concern. Chris is also a commercial pilot and I would imagine he has the same concerns. However, I'll agree that maybe it's not his responsibility to make that call. It's between the LifeFlight company already there and the new DZ to figure out what they can tolerate and what they can't. The only issue before the city board seems to be whether to rent them space in the hangar. If I was on the city board my question would be "will they pay their rent and will they abide by the airport tenant covenants/lease agreement". Is there any other issue that the city board has control over? Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

To me, this sounds like Chris is actually defending the DZs existence at Harrisonville. This was the same arguement we used last time when they kicked Horizon off the airport. The city had said we were unsafe and we said only the FAA could determine if any FARs were broken. Also, we were not required to be inspected at any time by the FAA before operating like a charter Part 135 would. Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

Before I make that claim I would like to see the minutes from the council meetings. Seems the city doesn't put them up in a timely fashion. I know what some have paraphrased but I've seen differences in what was originally said about the meeting and how the article put it. Still reserving judgement on the other DZOs. Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

Ok, just checking. There were no wild parties at the DZ. The "DZ" was a little trailer with tarp packing areas. There was NO alchohol allowed at the airport (I'm sure a couple may have had some in the parking lot. We know how people are.) But I know that it was never flagerant (sp?). Most days we ended and then went out to a resteraunt to eat in the area. There was no camping on the airport. Don't remember anyone saying that neighbors were opposed to landing on farms. What I remember were other tenants at the airport making up stuff to make the operation look bad. Then the fatality happened (jumper tumbled through FXC firing and horseshoed with the free bag). Then suddenly the city required liability insurance that didn't exist (and still doesn't today) which is why I'm surprised at the turn of events at this airport. The city lawyer was saying that someone else could go through the roof of a passing mini-van on the highway next to the airport and the city could be sued for 3rd party liability since the DZ didn't have 1,000,000 dollars of 3rd party liability FOR SKYDIVING. It doesn't exist. It's all very interesting. And yes, the last DZ closed 11 years ago. If they are serious about making a good, SAFE operation then I say go for it. Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

Dave, have you read my posts at all? This airport was a DZ for YEARS. It closed in 1995 after the first fatality in seven years of operation. The residents are familiar with DZ ops. Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

I have been reading this stuff about the KC area for a week now and I still haven't figured out what is so bad about the existing KC DZs? What kind of silly rules are you talking about? It seems like most DZO people make rules for safety reasons And what kind of politics are we talking here? Stuff like the usual bad mouthing other jumpers or what? I guess Im glad I don't live in Kansas Basicly, KC has a cult like mentality. It all depends one where you "trained". Kind of like nationalities but much more serious. I haven't jumped in the KC area since 1997 but I predicted this thread right from the start. Fiefdom, cult, whatever... people can get pretty damn worked up by what another dz is doing in the KC area. Personally, I worked at Horizon Skydiving Harrisonville, MO (where I met Chris Hall) as a new jump pilot in 1995. When the DZ closed after their first fatality in 7 years of operating there the jumpers were scattered to the wind. Some went to MRVS. Many others of us went to Greater Kansas City Skydiving Club in Independence, MO. The bickering that went back and forth between GKCSC and MRVS was amazing. There were letters written to the FAA saying we didn't have seatbelts or restraints in ANY of our 5 Cessnas. Yah, drove up to the DZ one early weekday morning to find guys with ties walking through our open hangars looking in our planes. It only made the "whistle blowers" look like idiots. Then there was the whole thing with losing USPA Group Membership status. (Oh GARY PEEK! Remember those days!?) Yah, lots of fun in the KC area. Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

New Dz. Lots of hullaboloo about it opening. It's opening on April Fool's Day. You don't see the irony?

April first? Are you kidding? No... really. Are you kidding? Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125

So Chris said he was from the USPA? Does the uspa know about this and I wonder how they would feel about his actions? Joe Is he not an Safety and Training Advisor? If he is then he is allowed to "advise" on anything skydiving he sees that he needs to. It's part of his duty as a S&TA. S&TA's are not assigned to one DZ only. They have a duty at any DZ they happen to be at. Now, as a DZO, he has created a conflict for his statements and will be tainted as such. I really hope this is all blown out of proportion but as I know from the KC scene there is nothing easy about "just jumping".

IN THE NAVY!!

Dude, you have no idea how deep the politics go in KC skydiving. It all seemed like a cult like atmosphere. I wonder if "Rotorhead" is still running around there.

One question. Who is the DZO and chief pilot of this new DZ at Harissonville? This is the same Harrisonville, MO airport where I started flying skydivers in 1995. This is the same Harrisonville when after one fatality in 7 years the city shut down the DZ (Horizon Skydiving) for "lack of insurance". Now suddenly they are cool with it? This is the same Harrisonville airport that used the skydiving ops to gain a government grant for airport improvement and then kicked out the skydivers when it was to their convenience. They did it once. They will do it again. I would never set up a DZ at Harrisonville again. And I really find it hard to believe that Chris went around "disguised" as a local handing out fliers. I've know Chris a few years. Something doesn't add up there in this story. I also find it hard to believe the comments as paraphrased here of Tom Dolphin and Chris Hall. Something doesn't add up there either. Why would they say skydiving wouldn't be safe there if they are involved in skydiving ops already? Chris used to jump at Harrisonville too! Seemed safe then. So who is the new DZO again? Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125