FLYJACK

I have a family emergency so no time right now.. I might be gone for a while.. You guys can look it up.. double check it Off the top of my head Rataczak said SF/LA/San Diego Cooper rejected as too big Files also mentioned Sacramento Cooper suggested Phoenix,, rejected as too far Cooper suggested Yuma and Reno, preferred Reno.. (Yuma is 100 miles closer to Seattle than Phoenix) Settled on Reno. They could have taken V23 to those California cities or V27 down the coast.. V27 is actually better as it is less populated. Cooper rejected those larger cities because he was still thinking he would be on the plane..

You aren't wrong just incomplete.

No, not accurate.

Not true,, coastal V27 is West of V23 and could have been taken without actually going out over the Ocean.. GC suggested V23.. I never heard that Soderlind rejected going over the Ocean.. where did that come from,, could be true I just don't remember it. But, V23 came from GC.. but the point is being missed... Cooper rejected large airports for refuelling,, that indicates he was still thinking he was going to be on the plane when it landed. This was before Reno was agreed to. The counter argument is that he didn't want to fly over the Ocean which makes sense in general but doesn't work in this case. Cooper never gave any path, the plane could have flown any route and even over the Ocean and Cooper wouldn't know... It could have flown V27 or even V23 to those cities.. Cooper rejecting large airports adds to other evidence that Cooper initially was going to jump further south. The argument that Cooper preplanned or targeted his LZ just doesn't fit the evidence.. He didn't know or direct a path and a pilot emergency bailout rig would give him a 113 sq mi LZ... Conclusion, he initially wanted to jump further south and when Reno was in play for some reason he decided to jump early and it was not a targeted LZ. He probably had a rough idea where he was... southern Washington but that was about it..

Cooper had zero input on V23...

Yes, and so what... not the point. Point is Cooper never gave any directions or path... other than South and the plane could been almost anywhere... Cooper did not predetermine his LZ.. Why is this so difficult for you.

Completely false,, and you of all people should know better,, you are not a newbie. If you actually read the transcripts the crew wanted to fly coastal and were given open airspace to fly where they wanted to,, they settled on V23... But that isn't the point,, the point is Cooper had no for-knowledge for a path and gave no directions other than than south... that indicates he did not target an LZ.. add to that the chute had a 113 sq mile LZ itself.

How would he know if they took a coastal route.. he wouldn't.. dark and cloudy.. seems like a huge risk if you had a specific PNW LZ in mind.. and if initially he wasn't jumping until South of the US border he wouldn't care what path they took... Cooper would have given a specific path if he had a specific PNW LZ... he didn't and for god's sake SOUTH is not a path..

What the...

FBI used 5-8" lower bound for suspects... Elsinore cards..

Flight tracked by Air Force and Seattle ATC... No alternate FP...

Crew indicated that they wanted to take the coast. later decided V23 Crew was not clear on flight configuration.. Wind Seattle from the South... Cooper didn't know the wind where he jumped.. Poor visibility,,, can't assume Cooper could identify his location from the air.

Main parachutes are "premeditated",, indented to be used Emergency chutes (Cooper's pilot bailout rigs) are "unpremeditated" (typo) not intended to be used

Of course it was an insult... I don't have a false view of emergency rigs,, I repeatedly said there are two options... You said anybody would know the difference which is provably false. They gave Cooper the wrong chutes so they didn't know.. Ryan didn't understand, I didn't understand until recently,,, nobody in the case understood it and brought up the issue. Jumping with the mains/reserve Cooper requested is not the same as with old pilot bailout rigs.. I was trying to establish the psychological delta.. you made assumptions and insulted me.. Then you double down on insults confirming your attitude... pretty funny you insult me repeatedly then claim you aren't.. I don't have any interest in anything you have say.. about anything. You are completely irrelevant to this case. Just put me on ignore.. we are done, I will do my own research on this elsewhere.

update,, I spoke with a friend who is a current commercial pilot,, I asked him about the 727 stairs affecting the speed, I gave him the stair angle, dimensions and speed of 170 knots.. He said it is very difficult to calculate a number.. but he estimated at least 15-20 knots slowdown..

Sure, it can... it can roll along the bottom to its spot if the river is higher than that spot.. also theorized by Palmer/FBI... it happened during a high water event. Wait, I am not talking to you..

Uh, no, it is valid theory. I think it is more likely that erosion in situ.. Palmer is a geologist, he specifically acknowledged the rounded erosion as indicative of rolling.. That doesn't prove it, but it is a legit theory.

Johnny Kirkley,,, Air America kicker discussion.. https://youtu.be/RPV-PNY2BHE

Dudeman17,, you are wrong on several things. You initially insulted me instead of defending your position... you now follow up with more insults. You need to look in the mirror. So, I am not interested in anything you have to say. FYI, Palmer and the FBI concluded the money rounded off by rolling along the bottom of the River... I believe this is more likely.. so you got that wrong as well.

What did Cooper do that was not rational?? Other hijackers did some crazy stuff,,, most had psychological issues,, but I don't see anything Cooper did being "irrational".. He had a goal and carried it out... His hijacking was very measured and rational other than perhaps jumping with a bailout rig...

I was focused, you took the discussion sideways.. Regardless,, I am not claiming Cooper did or didn't know he had bailout rigs,, I lean towards he didn't know but want more evidence.. and either way there are ramifications. I still really have trouble accepting a jumper would make Cooper's jump intentionally in those conditions with a pilot bailout rig.. not a main/reserve he asked for or modified sport rig.

Ok, so now you make no claim that Cooper either knew or didn't.. then your "show on the road" "evidence" is irrelevant to deciding. That is exactly where we started,, I said it is irrelevant... because it is, it does NOT tell us one way or the other.

A money bag is not as crucial as a parachute.. false comparison.. Let me ask again.. because your conclusion is that he knew it was a bailout rig. How do you know Cooper knew they were bailout rigs,,, what evidence?

Well, I don't know if Tosaw is accurate or exaggerating,, if he is accurate that indicates Cooper didn't understand they were bailout rigs because he didn't say hey these are the wrong type, these aren't what I asked for, these aren't mains these are bailout rigs,, no, he only complained about the D rings.. He never indicated he knew they were bailout rigs. But, Tosaw may not be accurate. Cooper's show on the road comment is irrelevant to this subject.. not only is it out of context, it is a given that a hijacker wouldn't want to waste time unnecessary.. It is being used by proxy to claim Cooper knew the rigs were pilot bailouts,, it is not relevant, there is no cause effect here.. flawed logic. There are differences between using mains/reserves VS a pilot bailout rig.. beyond D rings.. If you don't understand that then you can't grasp this issue. There were some fuelling delays on the ground but that doesn't preclude Cooper from demanding the chutes he asked for. He knew how far away McChord was.. Cooper demanded the best rigs for a successful jump,, he didn't get those.. Over the years many jumpers have claimed it was a easily survivable jump,, I have never heard one say they would do it in those conditions in an old bailout rig.. they are different from a jumpers perspective. You don't think that is valid question... can't help you there.. and Dudeman insulted me from a position of ignorance.. he was wrong claiming everyone knows the difference between those rigs.. Ryan didn't know, I didn't really know, most of the Cooper world didn't know,, the people who secured Cooper's rigs didn't know.. He is wrong about those older pilot bailout rigs.. they are not steerable, they have a higher injury rate, he was wrong about packing cards in military mains... He was silent on military manual main/reserves.... they did exist. and he never actually answered my question. Jumping with a main/reserve is not the same as with a pilot bailout rig.

I made the leap you made to make a point.. The "show on the road" argument requires the conclusion that Cooper knew they were bailout rigs.. The "good enough" theory is similar, it assumes the conclusion that Cooper knew they were bailout rigs.. it isn't an argument.. it like saying he knew they were bailout rigs but used them anyway... You present an opinion as a conclusion with no argument.