smokin99

And the number one reason why I need to quit reading DropZone is...... Posts that get me interested in finding out more about historical stuff, Today, for example, has carried me to smoke jumper's experiences, the CIA's secret war in Tibet, Intermountain Aviation, Air America. All of which I've been reading since Jo and Sluggo's posts....when I really need to be doing other things... ..I even got out a magnifying glass to see if I could make out if that's a person sitting in the chair by the pool on Jo's picture.... and I feel strangely drawn to emoticons. I think I'm in serious need of an intervention

I don't know if Bob K is delusional or not, but the basic premise about smokejumpers / CIA, seems to be pretty well documented. Troy Reeves, (Oral History, Wisconsin, Idaho) did an oral history project on smokejumpers and some of them go into the CIA missions. http://nwda-db.wsulibs.wsu.edu/nwda-search/fstyle.aspx?doc=oihohsmoke.xml&t http://www.history.idaho.gov/smokejumper.html Fascinating stuff. Thanks, Sluggo

Something else that I've wondered about...what is the the guy at 1:06 carrying.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VY6jzgWJ7c And in case you worry about the myths and the legend dying out....DB....the next generation.... Brunette Tina and a downright nasty DB (he punches Tina once.....what a cad).... These made me laugh..... Golden Parachute Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWyPYdn030s Golden Parachute part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SQaJZQMcyo&feature=related Golden Parachute Part 3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0oQbWa0Xlg&feature=related Happy Saturday

From everything i've read, Cooper left 1 intact back chute, and one cut up chest reserve, some cig butts, and a tie and tie tac on the plane. He jumped with, or otherwise disposed of, 1 back chute, one dummy chest reserve, 1 briefcase with (fake?) bomb contents, 1 pair of sunglasses, 1 overcoat, 1 pair slide-on shoes, 1 suit (shirt, pants, coat), 1 paper bag with unknown contents, possibly some box lunches, and 200,000 in a bag tied up with cord. Is that pretty accurate? Now the folks that think he met his maker that night surmise that he and all of his stuff (except for the money found at tena's bar) is either at the bottom of a river, in the ocean, succumbed to the elements and got eaten by bears, or he tunnelled into the ground. I kind of get the water thing - I guess it's possible for someone to go under with all that stuff and none of it is ever found. And I guess I can picture wild animals munching on cooper and the box lunches, though seems like the parachutes would be a hard swallow. The tunnelling part though I just don't get. I guess I just can't picture it in my mind. Seems like if someone fell with all that stuff and went into the ground, there would, at the very least, have been evidence of the hole he made or stuff scattered around. I don't doubt it necessarily, I'm just asking someone that knows to explain the tunneling thing to me. Just something that has always bugged me and I know I should just search for it myself but i'm tired and I just broke the lens out of my last pair of readers. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Yeah, the way it reads, to me, is Zell was passing the bills in Denver, Co., got caught and turned on Wilson so they started observation operation on Wilson. Apparently Wilson counterfeited the money in Los Angeles and also had run printing shops in several places in Minn and Las Vegas. Looks like they were watching Wilson and found a counterfeit 20 in the bartender's till after he had been in the lounge. After he was arrested they got a warrant to search his car and found more bills hidden. One article said that he dumped the barrelll because the plates and bills had imperfections. Do you think he thought it would sink? but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Done. I sent to your email address in your profile. Attachments were too large to pm. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

This car post made two questions come to mind re Cooper....I think this has been addressed before but I can't remember .... 1. Did they check for abandoned cars in the parking lot of the airport? 2. Is there anyway they could know for sure that Cooper did not arrive to Portland via another flight? Or do they just assume that he didn't since he bought the ticket there and seemed to know the area? but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

I looked up some articles after you first came on Dropzone. If I remember correctly, he was arrested after passing bad bills to a bartender, and seems like the barrel of counterfeit was found after his arrest. He told authorities he dumped it a couple weeks before because of imperfections. I could look the articles up again and pm them to you if you want. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Classic

I thought you might have since it was Wikipedia stuff, but since you seemed unsure obout the name of the town in the 40's, I figured I'd post it anyway. Maybe if you could be more specific about what you are looking for from 1945 - 49 I could do some looking in my down time....do you want history or maps or what? but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Excerpts from Jo's post: Nose: I'll defer to you on the bump disappearing. I don't really see it but I'm not able to go back and look at all of his pictures that are available on the net right now. I was mainly referring to the size of the nose. Like I said... very distinctive feature - it's the first thing I notice when I look at Duane and I would think that it would be an entry in a description of him. Hair: Like I said, the description just doesn't do it for me and nothing in your post really changes that. But you don't need my vote, you just need more proof. I say if it makes you get up in the morning, go for it!

Didn't the city of San Francisco own the former State Belt Line for a while after they bought the Port of SF in 1969? The Belt Line RR was running until the early 90s. I like planes AND trains, same as when I was two years old. 377 Me too. Trains more than planes in my case, though. They have a shortline railroad in south Ga that goes from a town off of Interstate 75 called Cordele, GA and stops from East to West 1. City of Cordele, Georgia 2. Georgia Veterans State Park 3. City of Leslie, Georgia 4. City of Americus, Georgia 5. City of Plains, Georgia 6. City of Archery, Georgia (J.Carter's boyhood home) I like to ride on the weekends sometimes. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Jo said: Prineville history: Prineville was founded in 1868, when Barney Prine settled on the banks of Crooked River, where he built a blacksmith shop and a store-saloon. Prineville was the first and, for many years, the only town in the 10,000 square miles, bounded by the Dalles on the north, Linkville (Klamath Falls) on the South, Eugene City on the west and Canyon City on the east. Before 1902, when the first high school was organized, anyone wanting an education beyond the 8th grade had to go to the Dalles or Eugene City. In March of 1877, Monroe Hodges rode horseback to The Dalles to file the first plat of Prineville. Prineville maintained its place as the trade center of Central Oregon until 1911, when the Union Pacific and Oregon Trunk Railways were extended South from the Columbia River to Bend. In 1917,Recognizing that Prineville would fade unless adequate transportation was available, the citizens of the city voted to build their own railroad to join the OT and UP north of Redmond. Through years of low revenues and high costs, the City operated the railway. Finally, in the late 1930s and early 1940s, sawmills began to reap the harvest of the vast stands of Ponderosa Pine from the Ochoco Mountains. The lumber was shipped over the City of Prineville Railway, resulting in the title of, "The Largest Ponderosa Pine Shipping Center in the World". So the C of P Railway became an asset to the city, and further gained the distinction of being the only city-owned and operated railroad in the U.S. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prineville,_Oregon http://www.centraloregonian.com/archives/story.aspx/11657/local-stories-told-on-tattered-yellow-pages but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Jo said: One of the reasons, beyond background, that I have always leaned towards it not being Duane is precisely because of his nose and his hair. I find it doubtful that any of the witnesses who described the hijacker would have missed saying something about the nose if it had been Duane. It is a very distinguishing feature in Duane's pictures --both as a younger and older man. Also his hair just looks very tightly curly (or wavy may be a better word) in virtually all of the pictures. I also don't remember seeing a definite part in the hair as described by witnesses - Duane's hair always looks more combed backed with no definite part. Almost looks too thick / wavy to keep a good part. I know pictures can be deceving and many variables can change a person's appearance in any given photo - era, styles, profile vs head on, lighting, background, active or passive pose, etc. But photos of Duane seem to be pretty consistent in the way the nose and hair are pictured (for the most part)........So are you saying that somehow Duane might have received a nose job in prison in 60 or 61, took an alias, and then had another nose job after the 71 hijacking and reverted back to Weber? I'm not trying to be facetious -- I get the aliases - obviously he was not above using other names - but seems like he would have kept the nose job intact. Is it just me - Maybe I'm not remembering his photos correctly...or am I not understanding your post? but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Jo, if you are interested in the missing stuff about Duane, maybe if you timelined everything you have learned (meaning factual events that you have documentation on or witnessed) about Duane --from DOB/parents to marriages to prisons to death in a clear, concise manner -- some of us might be able to research more and help you feel in gaps. Maybe a timeline in the following format: 19XX - Born in City, State to parents: A and B 19XX - Graduated such and such 19XX - Entered Army 19XX - Left Army 19XX - Married X 19XX - Arrested in X. Went to prison X 19XX - released from prison X 19XX - Went to X for covert meeting with X 19XX - Divorced X 19XX - Married X 19XX - Arrested in X. Went to prison X etc, etc, A timelined history of actual places and events does not have to involve he saids/she saids or include things that you have guessed at. If someone was in the service, married, put in prison, or seen with a known criminal it's just a historical fact - not something that is going to hurt anyone at this late date. Not family, not friends. It's just history now. Jimmy Hoffa's dead cause a friend he trusted painted houses. Someone wrote a book about it naming names and places. No one cares. The Warren commission has spoken. There was no one shooting from the grassy knoll...even if we all know there was.. now it's just a Conspiracy Theory. I, for one, would be more than willing to help you with research on geneaology, dates and places - but it's kind of confusing to follow your narratives. No one wants to hijack or steal your story, pardon the pun. They can't anyway - you've copywrited it and we're all witnesses.

I do a lot of searching. For newspapers sometimes it's hit or miss because of the tiny print and OCR limitations, and sometimes pages are scanned in horizontally. I've found sometimes it works better to use more generic search words rather than names and lots of times I just browse. (And a bad neck to show for it) If you know a date range, geographic area, and know the layout of newpapers (where do they put their obits, crime reports, etc) browsing can be productive. I also search the scholar, book and archive sections a lot. I love the book section for old magazines. An aside -- I was researching some stuff on this KKK guy who apparently crashed MLK's funeral as an usher, and I found the most amazing pictures of this guy taking dignitaries to their seats. He's pictured with Jackie kennedy and supposedly told Robert Kennedy something to the effect of ..not to worry, they had good security, as he led him to his seat. This was in two 1968 issues of JET magazine. I get lost in the old stories. I also use the Wayback time machine for old web pages a lot - it's called something different now i think but the searching there is kind of frustrating - the last time I used it you had to be specific about the web page. THAT SAID.....the Duane article was pure dumb luck...I routinely search on some of my favs, like Duane lorin Weber, Sheridan peterson, II, or whats-his-name that Bruce Smith interviewed- can't think of his name right now..... to name but a few. Usually the only new stuff I find is an article about Jo or some of Sheridan's posts on different forums - though i've been able to find quite a bit on him in the past. Anyway, this article just popped up on Google news. Like someone said....just sitting out there waiting to happen. I will say this also ...after Jo's comment wondering whether it might be fake I went back and made sure that i could pull up that newpaper and article by date, and I searched a few names that were mentioned in a city directory search just to make sure someone wasn't playing games. I've seen the stuff folks can do with photoshop. ... esp on dork...I mean....dropzone.com

Hope everything goes well for you tomorrow, Jo. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

I have never seen this article before and is it real or one of those things someone has printed up for fun? July 29, 1957 - if he really was arrested at Treasure Island - why wasn't he sent to prison in Florida? How did he end up in Canon City in 1960. 1960 he is sent to Canon City and I have the picture of that incarceration - both before and after. The after didn't look much like the guy who was released. I also have the records from Canon. No place does it mention an arrest in FL nor an incarceration in FL. He was released from Folsom on March 18, 1957 and on paroled until May 5 1959 in the state of CA Then he is convicted in Colorado on Sept 9, 1960 and paroled on June 16 1962 - he had passed to them from El Paso County. So what happened? He is released on parole on March 18, 1957 from Folsum and then in July of the same yr he is in FL. He would have been in violation of parole in CA. which did not expire until May of 1959. The records I have do not show any FL arrests or convictions.... other than a DUI when he was arrested in Jacksonville, Fl around 1977 - he was also in possession of pistol on that arrest. If it's fake certainly not by me. Regardless the authenticity would be easy enough to check either through the paper or police. In the second article it states that he is in violation of parole in CA and Ohio. Petty larceny is what he is booked on and lodged in the county jail for. Would one would go to prison for that - or county jail / fine? Not sure what they would have done about the parole violations from other states. Today seems like they would send him back but maybe they didn't have the resources or motivation to do this in the late 50s. Edited to defer to 377 on this.... Of 1957 I have no authority with which to speak. In Georger word's I was still an undecidable then.

Well one thing you can say about Duane is that he got around. Here he is in St. Petersburg, Fl in 1957. Haven't seen this pic before (above article). Interesting article too. http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=h9ENAAAAIBAJ&sjid=OXYDAAAAIBAJ&pg=4453%2C5772131 but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

In 1975, a guy named Jerrry Cooper was apparently investigated for his Cooper Caper 15 mins of fame. Beyond physical description being similar, he also had a history of sky diving and worked at Washington National Airport as fueler. It was subsequently determmined that he wasn't DB. Anyway....he made this comment about reason DB might have been interested in a 727: "He picked the right plane. In the 727, your engines are setting up on the tail section high, not on the wings, so he wouldn't have to worry about the blast from the jets." but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Hi Vicki, Very interesting story. Thanks for sharing this. I can guarantee that many are looking at the video trying to see if he's wearing a pearl tie clasp in any of the pictures

Off-topic though marginally connected in a round about way :).... but I came across an interesting story today about Carl Gugasian aka the friday night bank Robber. You guys probably already know all about him but I'd not heard of him before. His profile and background, plus the fact that the FBI SA on his case was named Ray CARR got me intrigued. Thought some of you might like an interesting read..This is just one site I skimmed but it had a pretty good synopsis of his story and touches on the subsequent bond he developed with SA Ray Carr. http://forum.hyeclub.com/archive/index.php/t-4359.html but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

You're killing me. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

LMAO......Thanks...I can see it all so clearly now... Honestly.. out of 4.....you were my number one suspect for the video and I still wonder.... Regardless,,,,I love your posts. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

Wow at the odds of those two meeting like that,... Awesome story. Thanks for sharing it. but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill