maadmax

Sounds like you got a pretty good taste of religion. Luckily, God is a lot bigger than that.

Why respond to his post? You're only giving him fuel so he can continue to blasephmy Jesus. Hell needs people too...let him be... we can only pray that one day he will find the truth.... 1st Commandment: You shall not have any other gods before me*** Well, just curious about what makes people tick. How they say something, can sometimes be more informative than what they say. I believe the life of every person has some truth to communicate. _____________________________________

QuoteFor me - Common sense. Based upon real world experiences (mine and people that I learn from) - certainly not from mytholgy*** If that is indeed true, you should write it down so it can be discussed and studied. What may be common sense to you may not be available to someone else unless you provide it to them.

[Cough splutter bullshit] ..that may be the crutch you use for yourself, which is fine, but don't profess that your way is the ONLY way. That's just ignorant*** What have you found that gives your life direction and meaning, allowing you to perfect the good things and minimize the bad? _______________________________________

Ok i am not by any means going to get into a debate over this BUT this is a little odd. FAITH by definition is based on a lack of understanding, a lack of empirical evidence. so anyone discussing the faith or attributions of it are working from a point of not understanding how/what/why etc... that's why it is called FAITH, and not science.*** Faith simply provides a means of acquiring knowledge. We all use it every day to construct our realities. Faith by itself is worthless. If the object of faith is true, it will produce beneficial results. If the object is false the exercise will produce harmful consequences. As the Bible says the proof of a mans faith is in the fruit it produces. _______________________________________

I truly hope that other people who are sure of Jesus will one day understand there's even more to get Mighty Love from, and open themselves to Zeus, Rakot, Odin, Merlin, Krishna and several thousand other gods*** If you actually have something to say that will illuminate & elucidate Gods Love and Wisdom, please do. You have my undivided attention. ______________________________________

Everyone does. The only thing which is different what kind of evidence you need. You would probably have hard time to believe in Jesus if there were no Bible, for example - so even you need evidence to believe. And for you the Bible is part of the evidence*** The evidence that convinced me was how the Wisdom of God allowed me to overcome my self destructive thoughts and behaviors. It has permitted me to live a productive life instead of wasting it. If you are perfect , in no need of God's help, you are very fortunate. I would think that you would reach out a compassionate hand with your perfected wisdom and help the rest of us that are not so blessed, instead of attacking the only life line that works. _______________________________________

Ha ha, I just thought ...? I am by no means certain there is no "god". What I'm profoundly confident in is the incredible odds against any of the human religions being correct. Please go back and read the text of the attachment in the original post and then tell me again that I'm ignorant to find it *highly* unlikely. Blues, Dave*** Since you are obviously ignorant about what you are attacking, based on the text of your attachment. Wouldn't it be a much more productive use of your "wisdom" to discuss issues you understand rather than vent your rage on issues you are clueless about. ____________________________________

Well said!!! A personal relationship with Jesus is truly a wonderful experience. His wisdom is gold.

QuoteHa ha, I just thought this was hilarious. *** Why do you find it hilarious?

I would think the only spiritual wisdom that a parent could pass on to their kids would be limited to that which they possess. If you try to fake it by forcing them to go to Church to learn something that you haven't, they will see the hypocrisy and disrespect not only the Church but your forcing them as well. If you indeed see the face of God in nature, then that is your Church. I also worship in that Church.

Several of us from N Georgia meet up on Saturday or Sunday morning and car pool to SDA in Thomaston. One guy in our group is from Dahlonega. If you would like to ride with us send me a PM. A new drop zone is in the works to re-open in Monroe Ga. That will be a lot closer to you. ______________________________________

And my point stands. We are not talking about anything remotely the same. You can believe in a supernatural being if you want to. For me, personally, I don't, since there is no credible evidence to support the existence of such a being.*** How can you seriously keep using that excuse/explanation for rejecting the presence of God. Surely, along with your obvious education you must have a slight inkling of the vast amount of evidence we have yet to collect. What do you think Isaac Newton would have said if someone in his time suggested the standard model of particle physics? Would he have immediately rejected it saying Why, that can't be true, there is just no evidence to support it. The acquisition of evidence is not an exclusive property, limited only to the scientific method. The healing, restorative power of God that fills the soul/mind of the believer, is evidence enough for anyone who has experienced it. ____________________________________

Point being? "All have sinned and fallen short of the Glory of God", "Our righteousness are as filthy rags" We need help in being restored to our rightful place in the universe. There is no higher honor than unimpeded communion with God. ________________________________________

Absolutely, there is still more for physicists to understand. That does not mean that there is any likelihood of finding evidence of a supernatural creator. You're creating a false dichotomy, much like the one creationists created (no pun intended) with their false evolution/ID dichotomy. If evolution were to be absolutely disproved tomorrow, that would not mean that ID is suddenly a scientifically valid explanation. The same concept applies to cosmology. Just because cosmologists don't know with any certainty about critical points in the universe's past or future does not imply evidence for a supernatural creator.*** If my concerns centered only around the origins of the universe then yes you would be correct. But as it is, I have experienced a supernatural Wisdom from a supernatural source. My mind and emotions were trapped in the typical worldly rat race leading to a self-destructive nowhere. By the Grace of God my thoughts and priorities were profoundly redirected to a higher perspective, setting me free in the process. After experiencing this spiritual rejuvenation, connecting the dots that this same God is also responsible for the universe is a no brainer. _______________________________________

Yet, amazingly, no one has ever been able to produce any in support of a supernatural god. One would think that if so much evidence for such a thing surrounds us, then someone would make the effort to point it out.*** It is quite easy when you embrace the concept that reality may not be exactly as you have envisioned it. I have read numerous personal opinions from physicists regarding quantum mechanics and general relativity that the universe is put together in a very unexpected way and that forth coming discoveries will probably exceed our wildest imagination. Seeing how 94% of the matter and energy that make up the universe is still unknown, and that there is the possibility of 7 more undiscovered dimensions. ______________________________________

You seem to misunderstand what I wrote. I asked, "Are you defining God as the universe (i.e. God = universe = God)?" In other words, God is the universe, no more, no less (i.e. a natural god). That is significantly different than defining god as the creator of the universe (i.e. a supernatural god), an idea for which there is absolutely no supporting evidence. By the defining god as the universe, No creature could be any closer to god than any other creature, including Jesus Christ, if he actually existed.*** My personal view is that the universe with all of its physical laws is a visible manifestation of God. The universe is self aware, because God is self aware. It is the Physical part of God that gives the Spiritual a means of contact and expression. Like our bodies being the vehicle of our spiritual being. The perfect Nature of God is reflected in His manifested universal creation. The freedom He bestowed on us has been repaid by our corruption of His perfect creation. As far as evidence, it surrounds us and speaks for itself. _______________________________________

Are you defining God as the universe (i.e. God = universe = God)? A self aware universe is a scientifically observable phenomenon. Defining God as that universe is certainly not unheard of. However, by that definition, God's laws are the laws of physics, etc., immutable natural laws, impossible to violate. Such a God would have no capacity to meddle with the affairs of man, except by those natural laws . I would not argue against such a definition of God. But I would point out that such a god would not be supernatural or have supernatural power. Nor could any person be any more the "son of god" than any other person.*** Yes, my personal view of God encompasses the laws of physics and the creation of the universe as an expression of His creativity. Self awareness is another of Gods traits that He passes along to us. I see the Spiritual Laws of God just as immutable and inviolable as the natural laws. Which is why the wages of sin is alienation from God, no exceptions. A restoring force was necessary to satisfy the immutable Spiritual Laws of God regarding the consequences of sin. That force came through the work of Christ during His life on the earth. ______________________________________

Of course I admit there is something greater than myself, the self-aware universe. (Actually, more than just the universe is greater than me, but I'll stick with the greatest.)*** Interesting. Since this is one of God's attributes, it appears that you are simply exchanging personal viewpoints of what God is or isn't. _____________________________________

Can something be right intrinsically or is it only right as long as you are not caught doing it? Again, it depends on the value system. If you look at the law as one of value systems, it's "right" as long as you're not caught, and even in this case you might be found not guilty. Unfortunately there is no known better system around. So with this system of values or lack of them, what are the ideals you strive for on a daily basis? Are there decisions or actions involving others that are OK for you to do, but are not OK when others do them to you? __________________________________________

You know Bill, I think you might actually be someone who would be interesting to talk to if we could ever talk about the same topic at the same time. I don't see the Christian religion as any better or worse than any other of the world religions. I am not a religious Christian.I have taped into the power of Biblical Truths and made them mine. Let us talk about the life changing spiritual Truths in the Bible . And save how people corrupted those teaching for the next conversation. _______________________________________

You need to compare apples to apples. Now you compare personal theoretical things with the /forceful/ implementation. I guess you wouldn't be happy if I compare free healthcare, guaranteed job and pension with Jonardo Bruno, burning people on stakes and multiple attemtps to start teaching creationism in public schools (that's what your "saving relationship with God" ends with). No, we will not agree even on that there is some Truth. We will not agree that even if there is Truth, it is possible to find it, and confirm that you found it. And obviously we will not agree that it is our duty. Well thank goodness we can at least agree on a language to communicate in. Just out of curiosity how do you prioritize your value system. Do you think anything is ever right or wrong. Can something be right intrinsically or is it only right as long as you are not caught doing it? _______________________________________

On this we agree completely! ________________________________________

On personal level a lot of people would agree that communism/KKK/third reich was a good idea, that it actually worked for them, and they talk to other communists/KKKs/reich members who share the same opinion. It doesn't mean, though, that this idea should now definitely be shared with others, or even worth something.*** I know this won't come as any surprise , but I don't agree with you on this. A saving relationship with God has nothing in common with fascist human regimes. Maybe we can agree that what ever Truth is , it is our duty to seek it out. I will pray that God assists you in your search for the Truth, where ever that may take you. _______________________________________

Sure. The fact someone came with an idea which looks great, and the fact the idea in theory is very good does not really mean it is doable, or even a good idea at all. So like with Christianity (which according to you started with the individual first coming to grips with the desperate condition of their soul), it does not mean that it is good, it is possible or even there is a soul at all.*** On a theoretical basis, I would agree with you. But I am talking on a personal level. What I mentioned in my previous post was how I became aware of Christianity. And from talking with other Christians, they had a similar introduction. ________________________________________