maadmax

Congratulations, and best wishes! Marriage is great, I am sure you all will have a blast!

So what is the point of this thread? A bunch of atheists ruminating about events they think didn't happen, but in case they did, are presenting theories on how they could have occurred, while missing the message why the event was even reiterated in the first place. Why don't you spend your intellectual prowess on how the primordial goo first formed DNA strands from organic hydrocarbons etc.

Good idea. But I try to keep my inspections more on a daily basis.

Sorry to hear she is to old for a TPO. The left side looks like it would be functional with minimal pain. The position of the left femur on the radiograph is not adequate for proper evaluation of the hip joint though. I would certainly try a Femoral Head Osteoectomy before amputation. FHO can produce very good results, and the operation is not near as expensive. Total hip replacement is the best choice in older dogs. ...

Insurance policy sales commissions Insurance company admin costs Insurance company profit margins Healthcare price inflation due to non-payment Unnecessary admin fees due to so many different rules/policy coverages Pharmaceutical marketing fees There's a few reasons why our current privatized system costs Americans more than necessary. _______________________________________________ Good point, but don't forget: -$300,000-$500,000/ year in malpractice premiums -Cost of defensive medicine, so you can stay out of the court room. -Time wasted sitting in a court room defending your- self in front of people who don't have the first clue what and why something happened. -Time wasted do to the preparation and stress of being sued. ...

-- Came out of the Have no fear. Tort Reform ® will prevent his family from filing a frivolous lawsuit. It is amazing how many parasitical service providers make their living off the hard , self sacrificing work of the medical profession. Health care providers do not wish to harm people, if they did, it would be much easier for them to get a gun and shoot people at random. How much money and TIME do we spend on this joke of a legal system we have in the US. I have a vague idea of what they are protecting us from, but GOD help us with what they have given us instead. The most amazing thing about traveling to a "less developed country " is that I don't have to spend and hour filling out disclaimer forms and another hour reading every imaginalbe sign telling me that I might get hurt. Medical professionals are definitely one of the unsung heroes of our society. ...

You are not making any sense. If you have any intelligent ideas lets hear them. Otherwise, please GET SOME HELP. ...

The answer seems obvious to me. People like you who think health care should be an entitled right should spend the next 12 years training and hopefully passing the licensing boards to become doctors, so you can provide a better service. ...

Not so. Until it is time to live pain free, it is perfectly OK to live with pain. Faith in God moves mountains. You can release all of your cares to Him, because He cares for you. Frustration can obscure this fact, but it is very real.

Like I mentioned before, you will need a definite diagnosis before you precede with decisions about treatment. Several conditions can mimic hip dysplasia and are treated differently. Best treatment in young dogs for hip dysplasia is a surgery called Triple Pelvic Osteotomy. Tibial Plate Leveling Osteomy is the best for cruciate ligament injuries. These both require specialty training and are as you say, expensive. Here in the US about $2000 each. There are other less expensive surgical options that can be provided by a regular Vet. The result can be almost as good as the specialist in some cases, but in bigger dogs there is a potential for less than desirable outcomes. As far as pain medication you can start with Rimadyl, Dermaxx, or any of the other good non-steroidal anti-inflammatories that your Vet should have on hand. If these are not enough then you can add a narcotic. Fentanyl patches are easy to use and are very effective. Good luck, and I know how difficult and painful this situation is. I am sure you will make the best decisions necessary to resolve the problems. __________________________________________ Can you give me any reccomendations on pain care that i should request? Also TPLO, can you tell me more about this? I would really appreciate any comments from you.

As a Vet, when ever I see this condition it is always heartbreaking. If you have a specialist in your area capable of performing a TPLO, it is usually the best choice for young dogs. X-rays are necessary for a definitive diagnosis, otherwise you can only make assumptions. There are plenty of very effective pain medications, your puppy should not have to suffer while you decide what to do.

Sorry to hear about your bad luck. What is wrong with her?

---Makes me wonder....why are dogs considered a man's best friend if we can't trust these "animals" to have certain "moral" traits of loyalty and protection toward the owner? In my observation of the human/animal bond, dogs are only man's best friend when they assume a submissive acceptance to the humans alpha position. When they don't they are usually euthanized. Animals appear to be free from our dilemma of worrying about right from wrong. They constantly live in the moment and for them might usually makes right. _____________________________________________ ---Do any of you have any pets? 10 dogs, 7 cats, parrots, snakes, fish, other assorted reptiles (most all rescues)

I would place my bet on depression ,low self esteem and low self image leading to a frantic search for happiness as some possible explanations. .................................................................

--There’s a high-ethics question, more of an intellectual/philosophical nature than pragmatic impact: if one’s charitable behavior is based on the ultimate reward system (eternal life), how truly freely given is/can that personal or community charity be? VR/Marg You are definitely a very moral and generous person, of which I have no doubt. Christian behavior is not motivated by reward. It is motivated by a desire to express God's Love. Ephesians 2:8-10 Sums it up pretty well. "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and not by anything you have done, it is a gift from God. It is not as a result of works, that anyone should boast. For we are His workmanship created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them."

--Ahh, finally after wading through lines of gibberish we get to your point. I assume you're saying that attempting to scientificaly examine the idea of a god is pointless. Well, no it's not. If you logically examine the hypothesis of the luminiferous aether, we can falsify it. Theories about the nature of the universe that include stacks of turtles, angels holding up planets and space-time pinching gods are also fair game and really should pass muster if they are to hold any weight. Otherwise, you might as well believe any old crap . Not currently possessing the technology to figure out how God works does not disprove His existence. Nor does it open the door to include every little fantasy you can think of. Most of our existence as humans has been spent living and working in a world we couldn't possibly understand. We were able to use our minds to logically follow predictable patterns that eventually led to unraveling the truth. I hate to say it but your fantasy world leads to No Where Land. Mankind has a historical record for acknowledging the existence of God, and since He is still very much a part of our daily reality there is obviously an evolutionary advantage for seeking Him out. Evolutionary bias is based on real word forces not characters from La La Land.

--And you can see some EM radiation, it's called light. (And we can detect the rest of it with instruments, are you saying God can be detected with instruments? Talking of rubbish analogies. My Point exactly. In the void of space electromagnetic radiations are invisible to our senses. They are only detectable when they interacts with other mass or energy particles. Similarly God's presence is visible when it interacts with the minds and lives of mankind. ___________________________________________ --I'd be careful using such absolute statements there. Tendencies towards religious belief might just be a side effect of some other thought patterns and mental qualities we've developed. No need to be careful. We are created genetically to experience God just are we are created to experience reflected photon beams. We can use our free will to blind ourselves to the call of God, just as we can shut our eyes to turn off the light. _____________________________________________ O come on, I agree it was not very professional, but surely not insulting. ----It's a slap in the face to the entire concept of what science is. Good Lord, who is being sensitive now? .....................................................................

--How is this any different than a barly clothed woman selling Black Velvet? My idea of heaven IS a barely clad young lady and a bottle of Velvet. Hey Andy what are you doing over here in Speakers Corner? I hate to tell you but entrance into that haven may require a pretty steep price.

--You reinforce my point. 'God' is invisible! Electromagnetic radiation is also invisible but is still exists. Are you trying to say that invisibility equals "non-existence" ? _____________________________________ -Proof that people do and have believed in God is in absolutely no way proof of God. The only thing it is proof of is that people do and have believed in God. That's it, nothing more. Disagree, it is definitely proof of some type of conveyed advantage to survivability and reproductive success. There has to be something there or the whole experience would have disappeared long ago. ________________________________________ --Similarly (hypothetically speaking) if, in the early stages of human evolution, common belief in God conveyed some kind of survival benefit it would still not in any way be evidence that God exists, just that common belief conveyed some form of survival benefit. I am not sure what you mean by "early stages" Gods presence is still very much apart of the human experience. ____________________________________________ --And the 'holy scriptures' comment is simply insulting to science, and indicates a massive lack of understanding of the subject . O come on, I agree it was not very professional, but surely not insulting. ____________________________________________

-Yes it is. Show me a picture of what god looks like. ______________________________________________ You will never understand God if you keep trying to cling to your physical senses for perception. God choses to exist as a nonphysical Spirit and can only be understood through spiritual means. ______________________________________________ --The visible proof for God goes back through the ages of our species self awareness. --What does that even mean? What 'visible proof' _____________________________________________ The visible proof is the history of mankind as far back as we have archaeololgical evidence. Humans have always sought out God. Maybe with more misunderstanding than understanding at times, but we have sought Him none the less. And according to the holy scriptures of evolutionary theory, if a trait or behavior fails to convey a benefit in terms of enhanced survivabilty and propagation, it is cast aside to the rubbish bin of history. I am glad to say that the God gene is still alive and well in a great number of the human race. Meaning there is a reason we are still in possession of the desire to know God . He exists! .................................................................

I think this statement is absurd. Replace the word god with the phrase "invisible (to any form of human perception) dragon in my living room" in your statment and hopefully you will see. The beliver in the invisble dragon does have faith,the non believer does not require faith it merely requires lack of evidence. Same with god. I believe in things based upon the evidence for them, no evidence= no belief. Not believing should not then be treated equally as believing. _____________________________________________ Your statement is nonsensical. No one is talking about an invisible anything. That analogy is not relevant. The visible proof for God goes back through the ages of our species self awareness. God has always been apart of our self-consciousness in one way or another. Many have used their awareness and knowledge of God for great good. Others of us have taken something wonderful and turned it into great evil. The ignorant do not nullify the Truth. .....................................................................

-- I would say the only need we get born with is to have a feeling to actually be important and loved and that in turn leads to religion . _____________________________________________ That could be, but many of us have also become aware of a desire to know God personally. And as a part of that awareness we adopt His values to create our reality. ____________________________________________

--But how do you scientifically explain god? If you can't, chances are it doesn't exist ____________________________________ Scientific observations and Spiritual Truth are not interchangeable and therefore can not be understood or proved by the same methods. We are born with spiritual needs that can only be satisfied by spiritual wisdom and a relationship with God. The proof occurs when those needs are recognized and then satisfied by faith and wisdom from God. God reached out to us through His Son to assist us in the discovery of the spiritual part of ourselves. ...

--Well, sicence is the developement of knowledge based on empirical observation and rational deduction. ____________________________________ Agreed. --whereas religion is revealed knowledge maintained in spite of empirical observation and rational deduction. It seems to be fairly obvious that if you adhere to one methodology, you'd have a difficult time adhereing to the other one simultaneously. __________________________________________ There is a difference between religion and a spiritual relationship with God. Religion as you say ignores empirical & rational deduction. Relating to God on a personal basis, from the spirit, is free from such limitations. Science and Spirituality combine to allow for a harmonious understanding of reality. ...

QuoteReligion bases on faith (accepting things as true altough there is no prove and it can not be proven), while science bases on prove only. I do not see any logic in accepting both, so I say men has to choose to go with just one of them. I chose to go with the one which I can prove. ____________________________________________ The wisdom gained from a spiritual relationship with God is not the same as that learned from scientific discovery. Spiritual and scientific knowledge are not mutually exclusive. They should be mutually included in a balanced construction of reality. Religious people who impose their unfounded beliefs on science are no different than scientists who try to impose their extrapolated beliefs on the spiritual. ___________________________________________