DSE

One thing to consider when wanting to grow in Photography (especially on the ground) is that you can get an FD to EF mount cheap. You can get GREAT SMOKIN' deals on old FD lenses. you'll lose autofocus, but who uses that on the ground anyway? I have a Nikkor 50mm 1.2 lens, a 105mm 1.4, and an 85mm 1.2 that I love. All manual, but amazing glass

There you go, still non descript but you are in the business of renting cameras, i see where the anamosity comes from now. That expains a little. I appoligise for essentially calling you a liar, but you a quite non descript, we can only assume you are talking about skydiving photography when you are a moderator in this forum. Funny though because I was paid about $40k for purly making dvd's in the last last year, some with sony DV, some with CX and some with go pro. Earnng money from doing something constitutes someone being professional does it not? I also earned another $40-50k skydiving. that make me a professional at that too. i don;t blow on about it though, but but is professional if you make a living out of it. When you are a moderator of a skydiving photography forum, you would be expected to understand this. handicam is professonal use, the custimer pays $$$ and we make a living off it = commercial and proffessional. like I mentioned earlier, you can scale this up to feature length films costing hundreds of millions of dollars right through to a $100 7 minute video of a customer having the time of thier life. There is not another camera on the market that can deliver a better image from a handicam angle for the price or close to it. It is the best option for handicam at present. and it takes me 4 miunutes to render and 4 minutes to burn after a few minutes of editing. That is not very long and there preson that is doing it has no problems, and this is on a $1000 computer. You want better faster etc etc, but it is certainly not nessecary. Uhh...Rhys....we also rent GoPro's. No animosity at all. They're tools, nothing more. Someone needs a hammer, we give em' a hammer. They want a saw, we give them a saw. But what we don't do is hand them a jigsaw and tell em' how they can cut down big rees in a single bound because it's smaller and cheaper. If I'm asked to design a camera setup for a crash scene, I'll always turn to CX series first because of the quality, controllability, audio (for sync and Pluraleyes) and lens adaptability. If I know the camera is going to get trashed, I'll turn to the GoPro. We've already destroyed half a dozen, they're disposable (more or less). What they're not is a camera that fits the description, standards, and protocols of "professional video quality." Then again, neither does a cell phone and we see iPhone content on CNN from time to time. And we all know exactly why the picture looks so crappy.

Over the course of 30 years in the business? Particularly when a big part of our business is renting cameras? As far as paying for them...neither a silver spoon nor lying, Rhys. It's called "work" and being at the least marginally competent at it. Kinda like telling some skydivers that you can't see a reason they'd own dozens of rigs, even tho you're aware they do all sorts of things ranging from film to CRW to wingsuit, or maybe have been part of a team... Maybe you need to expand your imagination? Seems the biggest stick in your craw is the term "professional." If for some reason you feel wearing a plastic camera on your wrist makes you a "professional photographer," you're correct. I disagree with that. I would consider you a "professional skydiver who happens to wear a camera to get the best shot he can while attending to other things." Once again for those in the back that haven't heard; I don't hate small format cameras. I simply recognize them for what they are and what they aren't. They're not a tool for professional video, by the definition of "professional" in the world in which I work every day. Your mileage may vary. Either way, this horse has been beaten to death, I agree. There I go again "where?" You can't dispute a word in that para. Unless you've figured out a way to make a GoPro sound good (even GoPro admits the sound is deplorable) Perhaps you've figured out a way to shift and expand the gamut of the AVC cameras? I'd like to know more about that. Otherwise, accept that the grading is reduced in order to save bandwidth. Less chroma grading means greater light sensitivity and less overall bandwidth requirement for the encoder. In other words, it's over saturated. Some people like that. But it *does* take the camera out of the realm of professional use. AVC and small format cameras are simply the video version of iPods. No "professional musician" would ever suggest that audio compressed for iPod comes close to even CD quality let alone anything else. But it *does* suffice for most. AVC is not dissimilar at all to AAC in terms of how it works on the weaknesses of the human eye/ear. Perhaps you've figured out some means of Xferring 5 minutes of AVC in HD resolutions faster than 5 minutes of MPEG 2 in SD resolutions (AVC files are larger). Maybe you've figured out a way to decode AVC faster than MPEG (you could be a very rich man should this be the case. Not even USB accelerators for AVCHD benefit the AVC cams). GoPro's have their place. But they are a camera and should be treated as such by newbies and experienced skydivers alike. they offer tremendous value for debriefing skydives, practicing jumps, shooting friends, and educational purposes. I don't believe they can be used for RW competition or used ethically for outside tandem (handcam, they're terrific, I have a handcam glove for my gopro used mostly for wingsuiting). Comparing their quality to higher bitrate, larger sensor, better encoders isn't accurate, and will likely never be. 300.00 for a gopro on a helmet vs 329.00 for a CX100 on a helmet? I'll take the CX please? For handcam...just give me the smallest thing possible that makes a picture, even if its B/W, that weighs as little as possible.

Jay Stokes runs courses at Elsinore in the winter. Hard to find a better Tandem I/E... You'll also be in an area that has lots of potential employers, warm weather, and close beaches.

weather permitting, I'll be at Couch Freaks with a bunch of spare nylon. Look for the Phoenix-fly trailer

Love the DOF on that Basket piece!

Let's clarify a couple things, Rhys... Most of this thread is about helmets and GoPros. You're talking now about handcams and GoPros. Shifting subjects and perspectives doesn't make much sense. Handcams and helmet cams are pretty different things, wouldn't you agree? Or were you advising handcam cutaway systems earlier? Of course a GoPro is gonna look better than a .25 lens on a CX100 As mentioned numerous times in other threads, there is no HD .25 lens, the best resolving around 240 lines vs 600+ on other low-cost wide angles. With more information, now I understand your position. You ask how many cams I've owned in my life? Hell, I have no idea. A few hundred. We have 65 in our rental stock right now. How much did I pay for em'? About the same as you, bud. I've never gotten a freebie. I do get long-term loans and review cams that go back after 30 days, but I'm also a consultant to Sony and Canon. What's your point? I fly the same cameras most everyone here flies. I guess you've missed the reviews I've done on those same cams. You don't get to change horses in the middle of the stream and still claim the high-horse, Rhys. Make up your mind whether we're talking about GoPro on a helmet with a cutaway or a GoPro on a glove. On a glove, it's always gonna look OK because you're close to the subject and graded colors don't matter. It's always gonna sound like shit because it's a GoPro. It's always gonna take longer to Xfer, edit, and burn simply because of the non-standard formatting of AVC and HD vs AVCHD or MPEG 2 on an apples-to-apples CPU.

Amazon has lots of CX100's quite cheap. The times I fly without a wide are when I'm concerned with picking up a specific depth and width and a wide angle interferes with that. 40mm-50mm is perfectly set for those shots. I stand by my original statement; Different folks are satisfied with different qualities of output. I for one, will never deliver (what I feel is) a bad product where audio can't be heard and is muffled or unintelligible. It is the student's story to tell. If you're happy delivering bad audio, less than best video for price point, that's your albatross to wear, not mine. My albatross is that I can't reasonably use the cameras I'd like to on every jump due to damage to my neck and/or back. If you feel that you're being called a moron because you deliver unintelligible audio, you're somehow creating words that weren't used nor inferred. My self-respect demands that I do the best I can within the boundaries of my activity. For a few bucks more in my camera I can deliver clean audio, a cleaner picture, delivered in a faster transfer and editing process, and send the customer on their merry way. To me...that's very very important. It's THEIR life experience and it's important to me to deliver in the best way possible. Your values may be different. Not suggesting they're lesser than nor greater than. Just different. Sorry you find that offensive. You already know I use GoPro's for AFF and coach debriefs. That's where I think they belong. I don't believe they belong in a place where an unsuspecting public doesn't know that they're not getting the best documentary experience possible for the same price that everyone else charges for higher grade video. You make so many assumptions it's kinda hilarious. Nowhere did I say I jump tandems without a wide lens, now did I? I do a lot of wingsuit jumps as well as some background jumps, filler and puff pieces. No lens adapter needed. I would submit that those using GoPros for tandems are far, far far in the minority. There are a LOT of DV, HDV, and AVCHD cams out there. Many DZ's are opposed to using these lower grade cams for tandems. Byron Bay for instance...Same with Picton. I believe that Toogoolowah isn't accepting them either. I guess we'll find out soon enough at the next PIA convention

Apparently some followers of Islam are angry about repeating themselves too. They believe they are interpreting the instructions of Allah correctly, you believe you are correctly interpreting the story that God wants you to hear. How exactly are you and someone from Islam different in this context?

You do, but hopefully with the spirit of God teaching you...A nice rule of thumb to keep is, when it starts becomming about you, your lusts, and what you want...you're probably going the wrong way. But don't you see...the pilots of those planes that flew into the WTC fully, firmly believed God (Allah) was guiding them and waiting to receive them. I fail to see the difference between their brand of "understanding" and yours. It was all about them and their own glory...don't you see? Nope...I see that it was about doing the will of Allah, for his glory. Same as most every other religious douchebag claims he/she is doing things in the name of, because of, heard from "God". God is such a convenient excuse for so much that people do to each other. I really wish folks would use "Mickey" instead. Then we'd have a tangible icon that could be burned at the stake.

You do, but hopefully with the spirit of God teaching you...A nice rule of thumb to keep is, when it starts becomming about you, your lusts, and what you want...you're probably going the wrong way. But don't you see...the pilots of those planes that flew into the WTC fully, firmly believed God (Allah) was guiding them and waiting to receive them. I fail to see the difference between their brand of "understanding" and yours.

It's not so bad when understood...many of the evil acts such as performed by David and Soloman serve as a warning, inspiration and example of God's grace, love and understanding. Who defines "understanding?" Many of those that follow Islamic faith "understand" 9/11 to be prophecy fulfilled.

cough cough, BS! are you including the lens and swithce and the maintenance of thm? I poersonally spent over $350 on switches alone in a 6 mount period. How about the case/box... Just spent 300.00 each (same price for GoPro) for four CX100's (I don't like the bottom load on CX110/150) and will install them on helmets that have HypEye's already installed. Not my fault if you can't install your switches so they don't get busted. And yes...I frequently fly them without the wide lens. but if I do fly em' with a wide lens, I fly a lens that cost half the value of the camcorder, but I come up with video that is a quarter what I'd prefer, but twice as good as the GoPro. Bottom line is that some folks are very content with delivering schlock to customers and that's just fine. Content *IS* king, and as a pro, I accept that the experience could be shot with a shitty cell phone, too. But there are people that actually concern themselves with the quality of what they deliver. No different than dropzones that use mechanics coveralls vs those that have custom jumpsuits with Cordura butts and nice DZ logos. I happen to believe in doing the best I can within reason for the amount being paid. I will never, ever accept the shit audio of the small format cameras for tandems. I have more self-respect than that. Poor sucker customers don't know the difference. Until they see/hear a higher quality product.

Chris, What about a "fin" like the military helmet you built has, the allows for a "drop in" for either the GP or the Contour? Or a secondary piece that can be purchased separately and installed via screws like the flat top adapter you used to make?

The bible is a pretty fucked up book to begin with, misdirected by Christians in the first place, mistranslated at least half a dozen times in the second place. The Book of Mormon is a pretty good document of fantasy and reasonably close to the original, but it comes no where near the Bible for babble. I can't help but wonder if the Koran is as badly interpreted and translated as the Bible is? If so, perhaps Islam's PR would be as good Fox News puts out for Christianity. Oh wait...Fox is half-owned by a Muslim. You'd think he'd work on getting better PR.

I understood the point you want to make, I think. However... Are you considering Mormons as a unique off-shoot of Christianity? Mormons by definition aren't Christian. Or perhaps you're trying to identify fundamentalist Mormons as fanatical off-shoots of Mormons? Fundamentalists are no more unique from Mormonism as Mormons are from Christianity. Lutherans, Protestants, Baptists are all off-shoots of Catholicism...

the Mormons haven't been around long enough to kill thousands. However, the Mormons have killed hundreds This is one example. Google "Danites" for a few interesting (probably mostly inaccurate) reads.

Well, there are groups that call themselves "Mormons" that still practice polygamy. They are not recognized by the "official" LDS church. They also seem ok with pedophelia and incest (1st cousins anyway). There are extremists in most religions. It would be inappropriate to label the vast majority of LDS polygamists as "extremists." Many of them attend the same wardhouse as their single-spouse counterparts. Two of my neighbors are polygs, and there are a couple skydive polygs too. They are normal members of the Church in many respects. In Cardwell Alberta, same scenario as here in Utah, FWIW.

CX150 uses both MSPD and SD Class 6 cards.

I don't know anyone who regularly jumps L glass for tandems, no. I do know people that jump L glass regularly. I jump the 15mm or the 24mm for most of my tandems unless it's a commercial shoot, and then it's L glass.

Canon Expo coming up...Can hardly wait to play with the new stuff a bit. The 8-15 has my attention.

You have no idea of the not so subtle difference. Its not that one suit can or can't do a manuever like the other. Its how you use your body to initiate and follow through to perform every motion in the suit. You can totally feel it. Like dancing some moves require the hips to start others the shoulders and arms. But of course some people just bomb out of the sky to a somewhat predetermined deployment area and then land somewhere...... without ever learning how to really fly.And then post here about it over and over. Reminds me of a Loic anecdote. It was at Deland in 2004. He was there and someone had organized a wingsuit gathering. Two planes full of them, Loic was organizing one of the planes and as he was talking to the group before before boarding someone told him he had no idea what he was doing. He didn't like it, that was clearly visible, but he just brushed it off and went about his business. If someone can tell Loic he does not know how to fly, who am I? As irrelevant as it is to this topic... >>Flying Skills >>Organizing Skills Two very different skillsets.

Actually, they are not L glass. They seem to have chosen the Canon 10-22 in front of the RED. For the 5dmarkII they have chosen the 15mm fisheye. I guess they have the 2/3 RED cameras instead of the 35mm which explains the 10-22´s. Interesting that they choose the smaller sensor, since the 35mm + a 16-35 f/2.8 might perform better in low light. (assuming they are shooting in low light..) Also choosing the 5Dm2 which has a slow fps is a weird choise for this kind of a shoot.. (edit: also assuming the 5Dm2 is for shooting stills) Wonder if they even know what they are doing ? In the vid, it's not L glass, but Paul Shull from Canon had told me they'd ordered 16-35L for this which makes sense @2.8. Perhaps they aren't on the cameras for the news story/puff piece? or perhaps they changed their minds. I agree, the 5D is a wierd choice...even for shooting stills. Weird for stills, weirder still for vid. Burst speeds would be very important for the exit, I'd think. I'd submit they know a LOT more about what they're doing than Kittenger's crew, with all the space launches, space data available, etc. Some of it is a broad guess, but who of us wouldn't be a bit lost? It's never been done at this level.

Eat an apple. Seriously.

Four RED Cams with Canon L glass plus whatever else they've got going... This is an awesome undertaking. Even if it fails, it's massively informative and exciting. One thing that's a little skewed; it suggests they're broadcasting 4k video back to earth. I'm questioning that. Recording 4k is one thing; punching it out over airwaves is entirely something else. Looking forward to seeing this one!