vortexring

I've been wondering what on earth can be done to sort out the utter mess Iraq has become. I'm of the opinion 'we' should stay the course, despite the deaths and financial strains. Despite the issues surrounding the conflict, morally doing the very best to stabilise and develop the country is now our responsibility. I'd beould be intrested to read of others general opinion, and perhaps their reasoning as well. 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

No, this is good John. Trans-fats are killers mate, and their generally found in cheaper foods. From ice-cream to ready-to-eat pasta bags. And being found in cheaper foods, it's generally the poorer element of society eating them, and feeding them to their children. Banning them is an excellent idea - they have no nutritional value. 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

I'd sell the car and use the money to help finance the on-going police investigation into her death. Are Scotland Yard being influenced by conspiracy theorists?? Whilst on the subject, David Shayler, the ex-MI5 whistle blower, was on Sky news last night giving his opinion on the Litvinenko 'murder'. He was adamant that it was carried out by the all powerful oligarchs but ended up going off on a tangent about building 7 at the WTC coming down by controlled explosions, the lack of aircraft accident investigations required by law, how 9 of the hijackers have been found alive(!), the shipping of the suphur tainted debris to China, and the news footage of the airliners 'melting' into the buildings. But the best was his claim that it was a missile which was fired into the Pentagon, for yada yada reasons. Why were there no eye-witness reports?? The science authour and fellow interviewee sat beside him then piped up and mentioned how his close friend had witnessed the event. Brilliant! Now that was entertainment. Because it's all true!

I think you're tweaking for the fun (and it is!) of stirring shit, but I'll answer, for the benefit of some of the genuine Neanderthals out there: hahahahaa - I'm not shit stirring! Thanks for your excellent & informative reply

This is all very nice, but seeing as America is not a Muslim country, why not simply conform? 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

Yeah simplistically your right John - even more simplistically you can read what I mentioned earlier and see how simple I am in regards to all this, haha! Hope your well.

I know that and seriously believe it to be the way to end international conflicts - to be the so called melting pot where different ethnicities break down to unite as one. I don't believe in nationalism. It delays the pre-mentioned. But the US is not quite there yet. So why not conform to it's system if you live there??? 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

In the UK a number of years ago(pre September the 11th) there was a bit of a ding dong debate regarding a Pakistan Muslim polititician argueing that there should be far more Muslim politicians in the UK, and a positive step to achieve this should be made. It opened a can of worms in regards to how fellow politicians could argue against him, in regards to racism and what have you. Ultimately the Muslim politician soon lost his wind and publicity. When in a country different to your ethnicity you primarily 'conform to it's system.' It's simply a case of respect. If they don't respect the system, it's laws and rules, then, to speak simplistically, you can fuck off.

I've few doubts that Litvinenko's death was sanctioned from the top - I'm also fairly sure the outcry over the circumstances of his death were anticipated, such as the Russian counter-accusation for example. Perhaps the key point from all this is why!? The answer is fairly horrible. 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

It's not ridiculous for this to be an issue considering todays conflicts in the Middle East - would you really expect anything less? However, the conflicts themselves are beyond ridiculous. 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

Perhaps they'll find themselves answerable to various elements of their decisions, you know, the one's resulting in numerous innocent deaths? 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

The entire international community is bullshit - with some imagening they understand the BS, some thinking their privy to inside info. beyond all BS, some frustrated by the BS, others unaware of any BS, whilst the remainder realise it's all BS! 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

I'm with you on this one - it's an effort in the right direction. 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

I don't do hangovers 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

It's ALL about power. Power. Your life is a lie. My life is a lie. Baa ba black sheep? 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

Yeah! It's like, there I was like, and then this, em, shuffler thingy came over - like a dogs name! HAHAHAHA!!! Rover! over - rov..sorry. where was I. Yeah! It's like, there i was and I ...I....hey! Stop hogging the joint ya jew! Anyway, there i......... Sorry. 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

Hey, chill out mate, have a cake......... 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

Perhaps an area worth considering is why so many people believe in such theories - is it simply a reaction to being continually lied to by Governments? I'd be amazed to find somebody who fully believed and trusted what they were told by their leaders in power. Power - can of worms there, eh? Now, a lot of Americans, being the nice and genuine trusting people they often can be, can also be rather naive. And gullable. So maybe there are more than what I might expect, who do believe everything their told. Big mistake. Obviously. There's no smoke without fire.....I certainly hold my own rather surprising opinions - but for years I thought, where's the evidence. Then decided perhaps I'd already seen it. Perhaps you all seen too. Did you give a f**k? Intrested, yes. But whether you, your mates, me, actually believed the evidence is neither here nor there. Nothing will change in regards to the official history of events. Certainly not now - in 100 years or so perhaps. There is never enough evidence EVER proving the theories. Why? edit to add: just my view having only seen the first few mins of the clip. I'm on 2mbps broadband and it started to stop while it 'buffered' - so sorry for being presumptious - but we've all seen this before!

But what if the politicians receive instructions directly from God? What then? Then we're all in a world of shit mate 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

Ha ha! Indeed - surely a 'humane' death sentence for the very worst offenders is the way forward - taking into account that there 100% proof of the crime committed. It could free up a bit of space and help reduce the amount of crims getting out on early release and re-offending. But then this is another issue altogether! 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

Sure - your right - America in Iraq contributes towards zero muslim hatred of the West. "I think -- tide turning -- see, as I remember -- I was raised in the desert, but tides kind of -- it's easy to see a tide turn -- did I say those words?"- George W. Bush, asked if the tide was turning in Iraq, Washington, D.C., June 14, 2006 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

As if that's ever going to happen 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

They hadn't 'levelled' it with bombs. Still, perhaps you operated around areas I've not and seen a bit more? 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

It wasn't a case of bailing after getting rid of saddam's regime - more a case of the 'coalition' actually having some kind of plan or phase to initiate once actual war fighting had ceased. Instead of doing next to nothing as the looters destroyed what was left of the country, as they ripped out miles of wiring from power stations, emptied out old Iraqi army ammo. bunkers, and beat their donkeys within an inch of their lives as they dragged off lampposts. The scale of the looting would have to be seen to be believed. Ultimately the opportunity was there, to start extensivley rebuilding the countries infrastructure and to successfully gain the trust of the local populaces. (Hearts and minds? An opportunity lost - despite an opportunity literally fucking screaming to be won) Some argue the Iraqis only have themselves to blame, in regard to the efforts of the populace in looting virtually anything lootable. But this is not so. Their certainly partially responsible, but the coalition took on the responsibility by invading the country for...wow...for what? What were the reasons again? Duh!!!! 'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'