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Georger, I feel guilty basking in sun and 73 degress OAT today. If tough weather builds character no wonder we are so flaky in CA. Wonder why Cooper chose to do his caper in winter? That Hudson landing was flat out amazing. I have heard that the pilot had a lot of glider experience, might have helped a lot. I am so thankful everyone got off with no injuries worse than a broken leg. Talk about a textbook perfect water ditching. Reminds me of the one where JAL put a DC 8 into SF Bay, but that pilot thought he was on glide path for a runway landing when the plane lurched to a stop in the foggy bay. Everyone got out OK from that one. The DC 8 settled into the mud and did not submerge. JAL was on scene within hours painting over the company logos as every plane on approach to runway 28 at SFO flew right over the wreck. Wonder if that US Air Airbus will ever fly again? I thought not on that JAL DC 8 but it was OH'd and took to the skies again. When Boeing's restored 307 Stratoliner ditched in Puget Sound a few years ago (pilot ran out of fuel) they raised it and restored it to flying condition. http://tinyurl.com/6u522r Georger, freezing winters, floods, hot humid summers... why not trade that for a longshot earthquake risk on the left coast? 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Georger, Don't you have to be pretty darn close with a Brownie 620 class of camera to have the person appear as large as they do in the picture? I am assuming we are seeing the whole frame. The chevron man also appears as if he might be looking in the general direction of the camera. So given the proximity of the camera to the subject, the size of the camera (we are not talking MINOX here) and the fact that the camera is likely in the subject's field of view, how likely is it that this shot was really covert? If a photo would mean disaster for this person, one might expect him to grab the camera and/or rip the film out. I have seen cops do this when police brutality was photograhed back in the 60s. I don't get so torqued about Jo's positions and the time one might waste pursuing or responding to them. I don't think she is consciously inconsiderate. She really believes what she promulgates and is on a mission. In general, we are far less kind to her than she is to us. Glad to see you reconsidered your departure from the forum. We need smart science oriented critical thinkers like you on here so please stick around. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Barbed wire STILL is a big deal, if you are on the wrong side of it. There I was, flying an Eipper MX ultraight at about 1500 ft on my second solo flight when BANG, the damned Rotax snowmobile engine self destructs throwing a rod. The terrain below is pretty rocky except for a couple of cow pastures which have been cleared, but the cow density is very high. Descending as a poor performing glider, I spot an area of a pasture that is free of cows. I line up, am making what looks to be a perfect emergency landing approach when I finally see why there are no cows in this patch. Duhhhhh. There is a barbed wire fence straight ahead of me, perpendicular to my flight path and obscured by tall weeds. I can see my self being shredded. I wait until the last possible second, clearing the backs of cows by a few feet and bury the stick in full up elevator deflection. I mush over the top, clearing the barbed wire by a few inches, stall and slide to an uneventful landing cushioned by the tall weeds on the other side. Whew! Every skydiver who jumped rounds in winds has stories about how they got back to the DZ without snagging their gear on barbed wire. An old timer told me just forget about trying to climb over it in your gear. Throw your gear over it and traverse it gearless, its the ONLY way. That's what I did. Cooper probably had to deal with barbed wire hiking out of his LZ. It wouldn't be easy at night in the rain. You'd think that there might be some odd muddy footprints that would have captured some farmer's or landowner's attention the next day. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Kathleen Soliah, aka Sara Jane Olsen. Involved in a bombing incident in San Fran. She was part of the SLA (the group that kidnapped Patty Hearst). She was found in Minnestoa because of the TV show "America's Most Wanted". They have helped identify and catch a lot of people. Google her name for a lot more info. Several other SLA members went back to jail after having served time and living normal lives. Family pressure from the Opsahl family reopened an unsolved Carmichael CA bank robbery case in which Myrna Opsahl was killed. Even though the 1975 case was stone cold, new evidence was found resulting in murder charges being filed in 2002. Guilty pleas were entered and the defendants are serving time. You just never can tell when something new can turn up and solve a case that has been cold for decades. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Well, my teenage kids would never agree with that assessment, but I like to. Thanks Orange! I will never threaten to leave. One day it might just be down to just me, Jo and Quade. Jo and I could go back and forth forever, as you may have noticed. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Don't leave Georger. We need balance here. The seesaw will tip wildly without you. Reconsider please. The forum does get entropic but it eventually swings around to on topic DB Cooper discussions. Hang in there. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

No, can't say that I have. How about "have a nice day"? Does that ever work? What ever happened to the night clerk? Jo, did he actually get interviewed by the FBI? If so was it by phone or in person? I know the answer is somewhere back in the forum archives but I cant find it. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Jo, I understand your frustration, but the FBI has better things to do than prove suspects are not wanted criminals in order to satisfy family members needs or demands . They looked at Duane, found no probative unequivocal evidence that he actually was Cooper and moved on. Proving Duane was not Cooper is an inefficient use of investigative resources. Their refusal to go further with investigating Duane riles you up, but that is their call. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. So far nothing you have offered proves Duane was Cooper, only that he might have been. Thousands of people might have been. The FBI wants to solve this case as much as you do, but their solution is not predetermined. It is an open question with them, but not with you. All Cooper roads lead to Duane and vice versa as you see it. The FBI sees it as an unsolved case in which a number of suspects have been looked at, but none provably Cooper. You are biased. You are sure Duane was Cooper or at the very least was involved with Cooper. You refuse to consider that he just knew about Cooper, as many did, and had ZERO involvement. You see coverup and conspiracy in every goof the FBI made in their investigation. The truth is far less glamorous. Evidence gets lost, mislabeled, altered and even pilfered. I got a few cases dismissed due to evidence handling screwups. It happens from time to time even with no conspiracy, coverup or bad intentions. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Now that's clever Snow. Also tracing the dry cell was a good idea. In the early 60s I was my hardware store's only customer for those big screw terminal cells. I used them to power the glow plug when starting my model airplane engine. They'd stock a new one about every 6 months, I'd buy it and they'd order another. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

My opinion Jo, for what it is worth, is that we have only had ONE FBI/CIA type on this forum ever and his participation was hardly covert. Any time someone starts down the CIA conspiracy/coverup path it is a pretty safe bet that they are wrong. You have yet to articulate a credible theory about why the FBI or CIA would be trying to cover up anything about this ancient case case. that has no current national secuity issues. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

That darn Snowmman, he has rained on my Gossett parade big time. If we are to believe what Gossett's co worker and his wife say about him, we may be looking for evidence in the wrong dimension. Gossett believed in time travel portals. No wonder we can't find anything. That Tena bar money slipped back to our dimension through a worm hole. Still, in spite of Gossett's unconventional ideas about physics, he was jump trained, did know the area, looks enough like the sketch, had money problems, etc. With no hot 20, no DNA match and no positive ID by Flo or Tina Gosset remains a maybe in 377's eyes. You may disagree with Galen Cook, but he is an intelligent person who has put a lot of effort into solving the Cooper mystery. I find him to be non dogmatic and open to new evidence. Gossett is just the best suspect he has found so far. Show him better evidence about someone else and I bet he will listen. Maybe we can renew be nice to Jo month and have it continue in Feb. Any other votes? BTW, where did the night clerk go? Is he back in China? 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Good point. I still think its worth looking for suspects. If you found someone who fit the criteria and had unexplained cash wealth following the hijack, that would be worthy of further investigation. When I thought that Boeing was the only source of info about the feasibility of jumping a 727, I thought the list of possible Coopers was at most a a few hundred. The Air America tests vastly enlarged the pool of possible Coopers. Gossett looks good, but without a hot 20 or matching DNA or a positive ID by Flo or Tina, he is just another maybe. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

The FBI has done some bad deeds but I don't see credible gossip or criticism about them protecting their own when an agent has gone totally criminal. They have a strong interest in weeding out the bad guys within. This has been demonstrated in several successful investigations and prosecutions of corrupt agents. "Underbelly of this forum..."? Who are you referring to? Snow? Sluggo? Jo? Jo, tell us your theory about how merely IDing the guy you photographed with the sleeve chevrons near the LDS building will solve the Cooper case? I just don't follow the logic at all. Jo, a lot of your evidence is compatible with Duane being or knowing Cooper, but it is equally compatible with Duane merely knowing ABOUT Cooper, so it doesn't prove anything. You have some evidence (his alleged handwritten notes in that Cooper book in the library) that Duane was seeking info about Cooper. Cooper needn't have read about Cooper. He knew the story first hand. The crossovers and links between smoke jumpers, CIA, SE Asia and Air America, SAT, etc sure makes me think that if Cooper knew about the ability to jump from a 727, he was somehow connected to all that. In the story below a businessman facing legal trouble bailed out of his plane after a faked emergency. Duhhh, like who carries chutes in Piper Malibus??? Maybe if he had calculated fuel/distance, bailed out over land and had the autopilot on a course that would take the plane over the ocean at the point of fuel exhaustion it might have worked, but this guy gets an F in planning a credible disappearance. http://content.usatoday.com/topics/topic/Piper+Malibu Wonder if he had prior jump experience? What is very interesting is that the guy apparently stashed a motorcycle in the drop area and used it to escape. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Too bad Coppola didnt have this info. A rodeo deep in Laos would have fit right into Apocolypse Now. Can you picture it? The links between smoke jumpers and covert ops in SE Asia are intriguing and stir up all sorts of imagined links to Cooper. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Jesus! You know the NEXT video has to be more insane than this one. HOW?? Are they going to buff their fingernails on a particularly flat stretch of granite face? 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Exactly my reaction. Doesn't look combed back at all in any of the sketches. I associate combed back with slicked back insofar as directional orientation of the hair is concerned. If only Tina remembered and would talk. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Do you think "combed back" meant it couldn't have been a "comb over" to cover a balding head? 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Always liked Douglas transports. Have jumped DC 3 DC 4 and DC 9. Douglas scooped Boeing by making the DC 8 design easily stretchable. Hardly any 707s still fly regularly, but there are still lots of DC 8s earning their living every night flying parcel freight. The added capacity in the stretch versions kept them viable. I have been pondering Gosset. Can't rule him out. Still, without a hot $20 bill, everyone claiming to be Cooper remains a Cooper wannabe to me. If Gosset were Cooper, why would he confess to ANYONE? Guilt? Atonement? Possibly. He did become ordained as a priest in some splinter Catholic church later in life. Apparently moral issues were a factor in his life. Show me a twenty. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Don't pout Miss Kitty - yer still the owner of this-here saloon. Just remember half the people can't read. The rest don't care. And the Snow can't last forever. George Yevtoshenko On June 30, 1968 Major I.F. Yevtoshenko (+ others) forced the landing of a Boeing 707 owned by Seaboard World Airways on Iturul Island, Kurile Islands. It was carrying US troops and entertainers to Vietnam. Picture attached. Yevtoshenko was flying a MiG-21 (there was more than one?) The picture is not a Boeing 707 but rather a Douglas DC 8. Too bad Georger's relative wasn't flying during the KAL 007 incursion. His cool head might have averted the tragedy. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

A rat? Then follow your own tail? You are one of the people who said you did not believe the Ingram story and cited reasons why. Your own citations were clues you failed or werent interested in following up on. You moved ahead with other matters and dropped the Ingram matter. I didnt. Therein is the difference. Im sorry! G. Why sorry? I wasn't criticizing. I had no evidence that the Ingram story was phony, just a hunch. I did do some online research on the Ingrams but it proved nothing other than some of them might have lived under the Cooper flight path. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Probably because the rescue costs are too high? What would you do with an F14? You cant even afford the gas. I know, you have an answer... maybe try for a submarine and go looking for Coopper with Tosaw! G. F-14? why waste money on US stuff. MIG-21 and MIG-29's are where it's at. See then you get the USAF to pay you to do dogfights against you. http://www.redair.net/home.html Hey it's 2008..it's all about private armies now! Get your own. Last one armed is a rotten egg. Don Kirlin, the owner of Redair, is a skydiver and sure knows about 727 jumps. He personally fought with the FAA to permit 727 jumps at WFFC. He had to pry stuff out of Boeing to satisfy the FAA on practicality and safety, but he did it. I saw his Mig 29s at Quincy Illinois in August 2000 and talked with him about them, but they weren't flying yet. I am not sure they are flying even today. They were very low time planes, one was essentially new. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Probably because the rescue costs are too high? What would you do with an F14? You cant even afford the gas. I know, you have an answer... maybe try for a submarine and go looking for Coopper with Tosaw! G. I was planning on selling a few to Iran actually. They are offering millions for critical spares. Got any F 14 radar parts? Hughes spin tuned magnetron? Just kidding... One reason they are crushing the F 14s rather than doing the normal desert storage for a few years is the fear that parts will find their way to Iran. Iran is now the only country flying F 14s far as I know. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

Leave it to Snow to extract hidden data from stuff. I watched the normal speed video of the 727 S/L jumps and thought everything was hunky dory. Man, they almost cooked the tops of those canopies. Right into the exhaust plume and very close to the engine so we are talking HOT EGT. The very brief dwell time saved them. I wonder if Air America saw what Snow has shown? I sure missed it in the normal speed mode. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

airplane trivia: those blast deflectors were aftermarket, necessitated by a few paratroopers actually hitting the side of the C 141s when they jumped without them. The C 141s are all being scrapped now. Seems to me they might have made good air tankers for forest fires. They are using a DC 10 in CA with good results. Jets can carry a lot and transit between a tanker base and a fire at very high speeds. The govt no longer sells flyable aircraft surplus to civil buyers if they have any possible military use. The DOD bid contracts require that the wings be severed at the roots and cut up before removal from the Davis Monthan AFB storage area. Hey, I paid for those F 14s they are now scrapping. Why can't I buy one? 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

I too am puzzled by all this new money find info and why it wasn't previously released. I have always smelled a rat in the story, but it's just a hunch based thing. 377 2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.