Chaucer

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Everything posted by Chaucer

  1. Why would the ATC transcripts contain anything worth redacting? Any of significance would be between Flight 305 and NWA ground personnel. 305 discussed very little with ATC once en route to Reno except altitude and altimeter reports.
  2. In 1971, the transponder code for a hijacking was 3100. It was changed to 7500 effective September 9th, 1976. Source: FAA Airmen's Information Manual, May 1976.
  3. I have posted the unredacted teletype on Shutter's site. There's nothing untoward in those redactions. They simply excluded anything not relevant to Flight 305.
  4. Both Rat and Anderson say there was a report of the bump to NWA. However, this report doesn't appear in the teletype nor the Harrison notes. Why do you think this is so?
  5. I'm guessing money deteriorates at a faster rate when exposed to a moist environment.
  6. But that's just the thing. The Jeffries report was ignored by local authorities because they believed it the crime scene was 20 miles north. We didn't learn about it until a few years ago. How many other reports like that south of Battle Ground were not made or ignored by the press or law enforcement? Impossible to say.
  7. To be clear, Grinnell never said the money was intended to look "hastily prepared". He said different denominations were set aside in a safe inside the main vault. Those packets were stored in currency bags. In preparing the Cooper money, those $2000 packets were taken from the bags and packaged in some manner. Not sure where the notion that they were intentionally made to look "hastily prepared". According to Grinnell, the entire scene was a "scramble", so it is more likely there were actually "hastily prepared".
  8. The FBI documents along statements by Tina indicate that the money was wrapped with paper currency straps. Mr. Grinnell has also indicated the money was wrapped with currency straps and rubber bands. The money was found with rubber bands and no paper straps. The FBI said that money was found on Tena Bar the same way it was delivered to Cooper. Tom Kaye has indicated the same thing. Paper lasts for a very short period of time exposed to the environment (2 to 5 months) There's no alternative model for the packaging. The packets of 100 bills were wrapped in currency straps and then rubber banded together into a bundle. The only question, in my mind, is how many packets were rubber banded together. Grinnell and his wife (a retired Sea-First bank teller) both said that standard was five packets to a bundle. Grinnell could not say with certainty if that's how the Cooper money was packaged. He did say it was a "scramble" and its possible the packets were rubber banded differently than normal.
  9. I don't know if Carr ever spoke with any of the Ingrams. I can ask.
  10. Hang on...I guess my post was not clear. Eric's "new" flight path indicates that Flight 305 "doglegged" several miles to the west after Battle Ground. The FBI file that I posted utterly refutes that notion because the radar operator said Flight 305 was a couple miles east of the centerline of Victor 23. Long story short: Eric is wrong.
  11. EU presented this map of his self-constructed flight path. He will be presenting the proposed flight path on his YouTube Channel on Wednesday. Obviously, this silver bullet to this proposed flight path is the testimony of the person working the radar at PDX who said that Flight 305 was one to two miles EAST of the centerline of Victor 23 as it approached the airport. Also, I do not now how he will explain how Cooper drifted against the prevailing winds to land near Tena Bar.
  12. I honestly don't know. All I can say is that I think the money found on Tena Bar was the same as was delivered to Cooper. I don't think it was re-packaged or changed between the hijacking and the find.
  13. Oh, georger, I obviously want you to stay. As for FJ, I don't care. I find it amusing that the thinks his threats to leave are actually taken seriously. Where else would he go to demonstrate his brilliance? Or more accurately, where else would he go?
  14. So, I guess that means you do want to stay? Even though you get very little from participating? Do you want people to beg you to stay? Because, frankly, I don't give a shit. Clearly, you are the most brilliant researcher in this case, but if you want to go, then go. I don't know how we'll manage without you. Either way, we'll miss you, sweetheart.
  15. I mean, you're a real swell guy and everything - you're humble, respectful, and have a great sense of humor - but I can't think of a single person who would miss you if you stopped posting here. The way I see it...you're banned from Shutter's site, you're not welcomed in the Facebook group, and the Mountain News is gone...so this is basically the only place to display your brilliance for everyone. I think you're stuck here.
  16. Tina did describe the money. She said it was "packed in small packages with bank-type bands around each package." Also, bank employee whose name is redacted, but who I believe to be Bill Grinnell was interviewed on December 2, 1971 stated "the bills were made up in packets of$2000 each and were banded with Seattle-First National Bank or Federal Reserve Bank bands or quite possibly banded with bands from other banks." That terminology leads me to believe that the money was packaged as described previously: packets of 100 bills with paper currency straps on them rubber banded together into a bundle of five or perhaps three. Regarding Grinnell describing how the money felt - all I can tell you is that the man is earnest and honest. He told me what he could remember, and that was one detail he provided. Is that conclusive? Certainly not, but I would guess that each of us could tell the difference between large bundles of money and loose packets inside a cloth bag. I am hopeful that Tom will present his findings at CooperCon and sort of put this whole issue to rest one way or the other.
  17. I'd suggest that when it comes to the money find, georger has the most credibility of any researcher in the Vortex.
  18. This has been discussed before, but apparently more serial numbers were discovered by the company Ingram hired. https://www.pcgs.com/news/pcgs-currency-notifies-fbi-of-d-b-cooper-serial-numbers?fbclid=IwAR0WHUTrH_LSMGQzk_YXE8wIqsTdrzYq0aPY3hi4OGbUqO3XY92m8sAre5g_aem_AZNtLSCmJBgldGIigR5WcbHbmT_PMV1SfO3-bij0_HgoOc9GMMpREJZq0bxP3Cu4wQw&mibextid=Zxz2cZ The process revealed 35 additional full serial numbers that are on the FBI's 1971 complete list of notes given as ransom, but apparently were not recorded when the notes discovered by Mr. Ingram in 1980 subsequently were inventoried by investigators." By my math, 35 additional numbers totals $700. $700 plus $5800 equals $6500. That would mean that there were, at one point, more than 3 packets, correct?
  19. My Discussions With A Senior Director At NORAD Regarding The NORJACK Case I had the extraordinary opportunity to speak to a gentleman with unique insights into the SAGE radar system. His name is Len Camp. He was a lieutenant in the Canadian Forces, assigned to SAGE in Syracuse, NY as a flight controller in 1973. Two years later, he was promoted to the rank of Captain and was rated as a NORAD expert controller. He served with NORAD for 28 years and ended his career as a senior director for NORAD with a rank of Lt. Col.. He graduated from Syracuse with a degree in mathematical physics. He then graduated from the University of North Dakota with a degree in Space-based Radar and Small Satellites. He was trained in Aerospace Project Management with the Canadian Forces. He is currently the founder, CEO, and owner of HyperAero Consulting which consults the government and private companies on hypersonic aircraft. NORAD was a joint US-Canada military organization intended to provide early warning in the event of a Soviet attack on the North American continent. There were a few dozen Canadians and Americans “co-manning” at each other’s control centers and headquarters. This ensured that bi-national cooperation was a critical part of the mission. Lt. Col. Camp's expertise was in fighter control, so he had a ton of insight into how SAGE worked with interceptor jets. He said that there is a great deal of verbal communication between military and civilian air traffic control. When asked about Ammerman “taking over” the F-106s, Mr. Camp said that while it is feasible that one or both of the F-106 pilots was monitoring FAA frequencies and perhaps passing on first-hand information to Ammerman, the military would have absolutely retained control of the fighters during the intercept in accordance with FAA regulations (Order JO 7610.4W Special Operations). When asked about the retention of the SAGE radar data, Mr. Camp was emphatic that the data would have been saved. His words were “absolutely and undoubtedly” all of the relevant data from the NORJACK hijacking would have been recorded and saved. In the event of an unusual incident, the weapons team, control center supervisor, or senior director could order the computer room to initiate a record for later analysis and/or evidence. For an event such as a commercial hijacking, the SAGE control center supervisor would likely have requested the computer personnel to put the data of the event “on record”. Recording SAGE radar data was a common occurrence and something the techs would have been extremely familiar with. In fact, he said that any aircraft - civilian or military squawking an emergency IFF (Identity Friend Or Foe). Mode 3 :hijack”, “lost comms”, or “emergency” would have automatically been recorded. The computer could then print this data out on computer card decks or long-form paper. This data would have been preserved as a stack of IBM cards for an indefinite period of time. Further, a “data reduction” could be done to eliminate extraneous data in the airspace to only focus on the relevant aircraft. This would provide a summary of the recorded radar data and IFF tracks. When asked about the possible construction of the yellow flight path map, Camp said that SAGE did not have the ability to print out a map. However, SAGE would print out the data, and it would then be translated by hand into GEOREF or the World Geographic Reference System. That could then be translated by hand into latitude and longitude. SAGE also had a special team of people who would do this in real time. There was a large glass display where data could be inputted using manual inputs: setting up special control zones, inputting flight plans, airbase weapons status, weather reports, etc. So, they might receive a verbal report like: “from the Hawkeye beacon, 255 at 27,000” and could then manually plot that on the glass display. It would then be input into the AN/FSQ-7 Combat Direction Central or simply Q-7 which was the overall command and control system used by NORAD as a whole. Each SAGE blockhouse kept a qualified air crew on staff to provide expertise in any aviation matters that the radar techs and computer personnel might not be familiar with. It’s possible that this was Capt. Spangler’s duty on the night of the hijacking. Capt. Spangler was a C-141 pilot attached to the 62nd Airlift Wing. Mr. Camp suspects that Capt. Spangler received the printouts of the IFF codes and the corresponding SAGE radar symbology. This symbology would have then been translated into GEOREF and then into longitude and latitude along with the corresponding timestamps. .These timestamps would be down to the tenth of a second. The time frame of the computer is roughly 15 seconds with three sub-frames of about 5 seconds each. He considers it very likely Spangler chose the exact times spaced about a minute or apart to keep the clutter down on the map. Thus, it is highly likely that the radar plot points expressed in red Xs are exact down to within plus/minus 5 seconds. This means that if between 8:00:05 and 7:59:57, Spanger would have chosen 7:59:57 because it is closest to the round 8:00. This is significant regarding the timing of the map plot points. Mr. Camp then believes that Capt. Spangler would have sat down at a drafting table and manually translated the GEOREF data into standard longitude and latitude onto the yellow sectional map.Later, an FBI agent would have added the blue ink “connect-the-dots and times. Camp considers it likely that the FBI would only have received the first plot of 7:54 and then been allowed to transfigure the rest of the information on its own. When asked about any confusion in the aircraft with the data, Mr. Camp said there was absolutely no chance that SAGE would not be able to differentiate between the hijacked airliner, the Delta Darts or the T-33. The computer places track symbology on the fighter's data based on its call sign (ex. MP06) and a unique MODE 2 IFF assigned to each airframe as primary. The chase aircraft would be given a generic track number, usually UP21, but could also have a unique mode 2 code to help with track. Again, redundancy. It was literally used to “separate radar traffic” Mode 2 was military only. It provides a 4-digit octal (12 bit) unit code or tail number. Mode 3 micivilian and provides a 4-digit octal (12 bit) identification code for the aircraft, assigned by the air traffic controller. Commonly referred to as a squawk code. Thus, the IFF codes for the chase planes and the hijacked plane would have been completely different and recognizable both to the radar operator to on the printed radar data provided to Capt. Spangler.\ Meanwhile, the airliner with a Mode 3 “hijack” gives the computer enhanced IFF to use in tracking logic. In other words, the hijacked airliner would have been the “star of the show” and would definitely be identifiable relative to the other aircraft. When asked about SAGE “losing an aircraft”, Mr. Camp said the only way SAGE could “lose” an aircraft is if the aircraft fell below 10,000 feet. Gaps in coverage might occur due to terrain masking. Typically, TRACON or low altitude “gap filler” radar could provide that lost coverage if needed. Moreover, when asked about radar coverage, up to 20 radars could be tied to a single SAGE control center. He believes McChord had a dozen in 1971, perhaps more. Interesting, the first plot on the USAF map is 7:54 which corresponds to when Flight 305 reached an altitude of 10,000 feet AMSL. Importantly, there were military radars all over the country, not just along the coasts and borders. The entire 360 degree sweep of the airspace would be fed to SAGE. Thus, SAGE was not just outward looking but its radar provided coverage to the entire North American continent. Regarding the reliability of the SAGE system, by the 1970s, SAGE had a 99.5% reliability rate, according to Lt. Col. Camp. It also had BUIC or Back Up Interceptor Control sites that would act as redundancy should SAGE ever be knocked out by an attack. This is part of the military’s active redundancy concept. There was always a back-up to a back-up to a back-up. Interestingly, Len put me in contact with the gentleman who was working the T-33’s training mission that night. We’ll call him John because he doesn’t want to be talked about publicly. It was a 3 on 1 mission with the Air National Guard. John handed off the T-33 to another operator who was working the F-106 chase planes.. He said that the 3 F-101 pilots were shocked that their target was diverted to a higher priority mission. This man was sitting next to the gentleman who was working the F-106 chase jets, but doesn’t remember much else because he was focused on his F-101s who no longer had a target. So, what are the implications of Mr. Camp’s information? First, we know what data was provided from SAGE. Second, we know how that data was used to create the flight path map. We also know the margin of error of the map - one nautical miles north-east-west-south and 5 seconds one way or the other. This means the yellow USAF map is far more precise than previously believed. It gives a tighter north-south error than we have suspected. We know that it eliminates any possibility that the map was constructed using faulty data. We know that it eliminates the possibility that the chase jets were confused with 305. The SAGE radar data would have provided the Mode 2 and Mode 3 IFF codes that would have allowed Capt. Spanger to quickly identify which was the jetliner and which were the trailing aircraft. We know it eliminates any possibility that SAGE would have “lost” Flight 305. Even if the radar operator was incompetent, the system still would have recorded the data. Also, SAGE recorded everything within a 360 circle of its airspace. We know it eliminates any possibility that SAGE was “down” that night. It had a 99.5% reliability rate, and had multiple redundant systems in the event of a catastrophic failure. Clearly, Mr. Camp’s testimony puts to rest any notion of a “westerly flight path”. The radar data is sound. The construction of the flight path map would have been based on sound and unimpeachable data. If any question of a flight path outside the confines of Victor 23 ever existed, they should be squashed now. A flight path outside of Victor 23 was always fanciful and existed outside the boundaries of actual evidence. Mr. Camp’s testimony only underscores that. Moreover, Mr. Camp’s testimony is completely congruent with the FBI files we have seen. There are two anchor points in this case. The first one is the flight path. The second is the money find at Tena Bar. There are two mysteries in this case. The first one is the identity of DB Cooper. The second is how did the money arrive at Tena Bar. The answer to both of those is unknown, but we can be as certain as possible that moving the flight path to account for the money find is untenable and not in accordance with any factual evidence. The only question we should be asking ourselves - outside of the the identity of DB Cooper - is how did the money arrive here of the plane was over here.
  20. Good stuff, G. I don't see anything that contradicts what Grinnell said or what the Ingrams said. Maybe I am just not looking at it correctly. Seems perfectly plausible to me that Grinnell's description of the money and the Ingram's description of the money correspond. What am I missing?
  21. This is from Tom's paper in Nature: "The rubber bands were intact but crumbled off and the bills were badly deteriorated around the edges. The bundles were solid lumps that had to be separated professionally..." So, could the Ingrams have been referring to removing the rubber bands from these "solid lumps" rather than from the surface of individual bills? Also, where does this anecdote about pieces of the bills coming off with the rubber bands originate? Last, have you ever been able to confirm this: "Three agents swear that when A2 and A3 were digging a trench about 2o yards south of the Ingram find, intending to go to a 3-4 foot depth, they had no more than brought the first shovel of material up and dumped it, than they saw a 'fist-sized clump of what looked like wadded up decomposed money, a ball of rotted bills', which they called everyone's attention to, and it was bagged to be sent off for analysis. (This is before Palmer had arrived). This suggests that perhaps some of the money which was at Tina Bar had fully decomposed, in contrast to the Ingram bills found higher up in elevation and in the upper active sand layers vs. other money which was perhaps at a lower depth and closer to the water line?"
  22. I only mention it because the Ingrams described the bills as "clumped together". I'm wondering if they would have been picking rubber bands off the sides of these clumps rather than the surface of the bills.