Ron

None ya:7:1 Never anyones business, 7 coach jumps, drank a beer. No video it didn't happen...Ask Ladyskydiver. Can't prove a thing. Edit: Why would you want to live in OK again? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Told ya. Whats next to work on? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

There are 4 ranges in fighting....(It's been a while, so these may not be the "correct" terms). They are divided by distance. Legs (Far) TKD is very good for this. Hands (Medium) Boxing, Kendo....ect Grapling (Close) Akido.... Wresling (Ground) Jujitsu.... The best way to train is I think work on the ground and then branch out to the farther disance styles. The theory is that while being good at stopping a guy before he gets into you is good...But if he does get by your legs, hands, ect...You had better be able to deal with him. Wing Chun is great for an all around MA. Mind set, conditioning ect. A MA developed by a woman...VERY effective with punches locks throws ect. Concept is taking the direct line. I never found a really good school, and now don't have the time to do it now the way I would like to anymore. I did Brazilian Jujitsu and it is a quite effective MA for fighting. Most of this training was in the Military...Very good for fighting since most real fights end up on the ground. I have a BB in TKD...Good for exersise...Not very combat effective. Plus I have seen TKD BB pull punches in a fight...You execute what you trained...So if you are going to go into a striking art...Go full contact. But it looks cool, so if you want high kicks to look pretty, its not bad. Did Boxing many years ago to work on my hands. Did Kick boxing to learn to put power behind my kicks and not pull them. Did Akido...I liked it, but it is difficult to learn and harder to use it correctly. I would take Brazilian Jujitsu, or Wing Chun if I had the time. If you want the midset...Wing Chun, or Tai Chi Chun. Combat...Wing Chun, or Jujitsu. Flash...TKD. All will give you exercise. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

There is only ONE question you need to ask yourself. What do I want? And then do that. You need to live your life for you, not your Mom. Other thoughts: ANY soldier is doing an important job. I went Infantry cause when you are a kid and play war, you don't play "Rigger".... The field was fun, the guns were fun, but the time in the rear sucked...My friends that were riggers seemed to have more day to day fun and a better life. That being said...You are 19...I would stay rigger and if I wanted to reup, go into another field. 82nd Airborne "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I don't see how you can consider what I wrote as an attack...You have said the SAME thing to him. All I want is for John to come up with a plan...Something other than saying more training is needed. He shoots everyones plans down, but never comes up with a plan of his own....I am really interested in what kind of training he thinks is needed that is not already covered. He is a teacher...He knows more about education than I....But saying we need to re-train someone without saying how or what is not an answer. I have yet to see him give any plan or program for training....On this issue or the BSR one. I would REALLY like to see his plan. He is more than qualified to come up with one. I'm sorry if you think I am bashing him...But he IS the expert on education here and I really want to hear his plan. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Bad judgment maybe...bad timing...maybe. Your opinion. And I do believe you feel that way. I know EXACTLY how you feel about me...you have made it quite clear. I DID congradulate him when got married. I don't agree with gay marriage and he attacked me for that. I was happy for him anyway. I DO feel badly that he is being forced to get divorced. I don't even agree with him being forced to get divorced. Even if I don't agree with the situation, I still do not wish people to be unhappy...Even when they attack me. Of course he, and you, will not believe me. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Its not that you sugest training...Its just you call everyone elses plans "Suboptimal", but you never come up with any plan that you think it "Optimal"...You just nit pick others ideas and call them bad, but never offer a sugestion, or action plan to make them better...EVEN WHEN WE ASK YOU. You would rather just bitch about everyone elses plans than do anything about the problem. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Could not you have done the same? I told him congrats when he got married...But he slammed me...I told him sorry, but brought up how he treated me last time. And like I said...If you have a problem maybe you should have taken it to PM's or SC? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Peal the velcro...THEN pull... Just kidding. That sounds pretty bad.....Riser inserts are cheep and easy fixes...They were not needed in the days of docil canopies, but today a 1.4 is not considered "high". Also even a big canopy can have high "G"...G force is caused by the speed...And a big canopy can mal bad enough to spin like hell....It is harder to do, but it can happen. Simple fix? Get riser inserts....I like the ones from RW that are metal better than the plastic ones (I have seen them become kinked)...But even the plastic ones are better than nothing. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Even those of us who congradulated you, but you called a biggot in another thread? Sorry it did not work out for you...Of course you will not believe me..But I can live with that. Edit...Actually you called me your Enemy if I remember. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

bingo ,and thanks. Love that. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Hard turns are bad due to you build up speed and increase the amount of energy that will result in injury if you hit someone. You *might* go up in a strong updraft....But that just means more time...A high speed impact can kill you. Talk to your instructors about this...This may be something they tell students who are mostly alone in the sky...The rules might be different for you once you are in groups. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You have several times said that we should not do anything till we have more information about the problem. I call it information paralysis ...You can't make a choice till you have the perfect solution...And when a perfect solution does not exist, you just wait till one does. How about grounding them AND making them retrain? Grounding for punishment since they did something stupid...And then training to make them more aware. You don't just give out "A's" do you? I mean you do fail students if they don't do things right don't you? No, we know people who want to learn and seek knowledge works...Just having training does nothing...Or have you not noticed that? Explain how jumping with an instructor is going to teach you you need to pull before impact? I mean, if you don't understand that, take up bowling. Restrictions that force people to learn...You just want to ask nicely that they learn. Like it or not...Punishments work. What kind of retraining do you sugest? I mean not pulling is akin to flying your plane into a mountain. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Not just ducted fans...but almost anything thats cool...sorry I P-51 mustang is a great fun plane...but a BAD trainer. Some info Here And a list of Clubs Here If you were in FL I would let you take one of mine up to see if you like it...I keep a trainer plane for just that reason. A good plane that if you have help you can learn to fly with and is still fun is Here You can by a complete plane foe less than 400.00 bucks. Better yet, you can go to the clubs in your area and buy someones old trainer for a lot less....I bought the one I let people play with complete ready to fly for 200.00 Got more questions? Ask....Kallend is also big into this. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

OK. Valid reasoning, and I agree that it should not be a problem. I think we also agree that a fast spiral is a bad idea? Maybe I wrote that badly...My issues with turning in a cloud is not that you could climb...Possible, yes due to convection. But I doubt thats any issue...My fear is that turning in a cloud will keep you in the cloud longer. Staying in low visability longer than a straight line out would provide. Again maybe I wrote that wrong. Two jumpers in two turns that are close risk hitting more than two jumpers that are going straight. If two jumpers are going straight they have one chance of hitting, two jumpers in a turn near each other continue to come close to each other. Lets see if I can explain this better. Take two pencils. Put them on the desk. There is a chance that they may cross. As two jumpers going straight may collide. But that is ONE possibility that they will be in the same airspace, at the same time, at the same altitude. Take two CD's and put them on the desk...Due to the greater area of the disks...They may cross. Plus on every rotation of the jumper you risk flying into the other jumpers airspace. In essence you could fly into the other jumper once on EACH rotation...as opposed to one chance on a straight line. In either case I think we agree that using brakes to reduce the potential energy of a collision is the right idea. As for an off field landing...I'd rather land off, than collide. See this is where we dissagree...I don't want to be in the same airspace, or close to the same point if I can't see them. I want to go to half brakes to reduce speed, and get away from them if possible...I see a circular path of both jumpers just increasing the possible collisions. Did I communicate it better this time? Agree 100% Interesting discussion. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Following your logic: You have a problem with acne....Uh, we can't do anything about it because we don't know what will work. So, its best to do nothing...sorry about the crater face bit. We just tested the fuel for contamination...But to be safe, we sent some to the lab for a few tests....The results should be back next mth if all goes well. You can jump then. Best to be safe and wait. We can't fix that wing since a wing has never been fixed with that EXACT same damage before...We don't know what will work so we just better scrap it. Well we think removing that cancer might work...But since we are not sure, it's best to do nothing. You have to look at the cost of NOT doing anything....Something you can't seem to do. You would rather do nothing. "In the absense of facts.....Don't do anything" -Kallend If we all followed that rule...We still would not have fire. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Not an issue if the groups took enough seperation. My fear of teaching people to turn in a cloud: 1. Might not turn slow, might turn fast. Pilots with instruments tend to screw up in cloud. It would be hard to ensure you are not GAINING speed by turning. 2. Turning in the cloud could KEEP you in the cloud. When you are flying a glider and hit lift, you turn to STAY in the lift. If you are in a cloud and turn...Unless you just flew in, by turning you might just stay in the cloud. 3. If you are close to someone, by turning you are risking hitting them...On every turn. With an off heading opening you *might* end up turning towards another jumper...If you are turning you *ARE* moving towards other jumpers at least half of your rotation. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I thought about that....One occurance, or one during every turn. Also if you are in a cloud and turn...well you might just stay in that cloud. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Valid thought...But try this. Take a piece of paper, and imagine a 4 way. They break off, and turn and track. Now draw the break off and then the deployment. Draw circles around all of them. do the circles increase or reduce the seperation of the jumpers? Now do the same thing and draw straight lines....Some math guy can fiqure the chances of two of the 4 picking courses that will cause them to collide....I think it is quite small. And if you stay on a straight course, you only have one collision possible...However, if guys are turning then every revolution can cause a collision....You are in essence keeping the people closer and increasing the number of opportunities to collide. Now thats my thoughts...but I welcome other reasoning... "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

It is as fair a question to ask as Johns question was. How do we know grounding will work? How do we know it will not? Fact is for some it might work, and for others nothing will. Also you can debate, study...ect any issue. It requires experimentation to prove or disprove a theory. BC feels that the current situation was not working and that there was a problem. He thought about it and put a program in place to fix it. 1. Identify a problem 2. Brainstorm solutions. 3. Review solutions and network to see it any have been used and what the results were. 4. Pick a solution. 5. Implement. 6. Monitor for effect. 7. Re-evaluate solution. We are at step 5 going into 6. I am sure step 7 will follow. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

What evidence do you have that it will not fix the problem? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Do you really think it is better to turn while in a cloud? Most people speed up in a turn, and when turning you might just stay in the cloud. I was always told...and always taught to stay straight and go into half brakes to slow down..... My reasons: 1. Half brakes reduces the potential energy in a crash. 2. You were trying to go away from other jumpers when you lost them......So why turn now? Stay the course you had. I agree with everything else...Avoid, go slow and make noise... Good topic. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Do you fly already? If not, that is the wrong way to start. I see guys come out to the field with planes like that, or a P-51 or some other war bird....Just last week a guy showed up with a Citabria.... Very cool plane, but not a trainer. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

One someone sent me....If youhave one and want it out, but not be outed...Ill post it for ya. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I want an Omega Seamaster Chroograph....Very nice watch...But I have a hard time justifying it with the Rolex I have now. If I had known Rolex's were crap at keeping time, I would have bought the Seamaster. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334