rhys

Gee you guys use coal up there in the north island? We are 100% hydro in the mainland. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

There are other DZ's in AK but not sure on their status. try; http://www.aucklandskydivers.co.nz/ "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

Interesting, this legislation seems specific to the united states. The internet has no boarders. How will this effect foreign websites? Fortunately we have royalty free music built into our editing system (rxt), though there are some companies that offer 'choose your own music', which I think is a silly idea, especially when they advertise the fact on thier websites.. With this legislation can foreign websites be effected, such as being blocked in the US or removed if the host is in the US? "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

So what in your mind was determined in this thread about the logic of giving breath strips to your students when they are having breathing difficulties? what was so set in stone that made the thread now dead? Remove the ego crap, and reinstate the conversation. Steve is supposed to be a psycologist, he couldn't add anything to the subject, just condescending tangents. Several other people have also suggested it is not a good idea and they were met with the same type of conduct. How about we discuss the subject. And leave the ego at the door? How has the breath strip got anything to do with the breathing of the subject other than it being a placebo trick? If not, do you think using a placebo is a good idea in skydiving instruction? As the title of the thread suggests, it is a trick. Is trickery a good teaching aid? If you (like DSE) refuse to accept that it is a placebo, then please explian, rather than dismissing without explanation (such as DSE has). There is still a subject here to discuss, a very good one, but some cannot bare to leave their personal differences aside and stick to the subject. I may well be wrong about this but condecending attacks are not the best avenue to explain so. As I said before, I am here to learn. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

Also the dude stowing his toggles on the beach that probably just did the same thing and the guy reaching for a high five on the way through. It was a very very nice swoop. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

You seem to be pretty good at avoiding the point. Can you actually comment on the topic, or just others that have taken the time to do so? This is a discussion about instruction. Your wish seems to be to keep the content away from the topic as usual, if you are going to post in the instructors forum, I suggest you talk about instruction. Not focus on individuals, if you are going to disagree with people, please let us know what it is that you disagree with and let us all learn. I am here to learn, you seem to be here to provoke. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

I think I may know who it is now. In fact we have yet to operate our porter but we have it ready to go, have the oxygen etc etc. We have had an associate of our competition send us very malicious emails to us and false (very negative) reviews of our company and the ski plane company that supplies us our aircraft (C185 and porter). These issues (the ones we are aware of) have been resolved with the websites that post the reviews. Tjis has gotten to the point where we have informed the the police, and the police have asked us if they want to intervene. We are leaving it be for now, but much more of this and we will procecute. There seems to be plenty of anamosity towards our continuing success from this individual and others. I really do appreciate your help. If you would like to cross check is it is the same person I will be happy to supply their name in a PM. Thanks, Rhys "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

Can you please elaborate so we can avoid this happening? "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

I have removed the ad and reposted it (again). I know you said you could trace the person responsable (potentially) if the ad is not removed, having an ad there with SCAM on it does more damage to our company than good. So as much as I would like the offender caught, I want our ad up there without the scam status. If it is marked a scam again I will delete the content and leave the ad up so you can investigate it. Is it really that easy to mark anybodies ad as a scam? Surely someone in the administration has to confirm the status of the ad before it is marked as a Scam. This does nothing for our integrety or that of DZ.com.... "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

I removed the ad, and reposted it. now it is marked as scam again. 5 years ago I left a DZ that did not pay me, They did not pay many people, they used illegal equipment, breached many laws and when I left that company they advertised on DZ.com. I marked it a Scam as it was. That company is in recievership and the owner that was a 747 captain (the only reason it stayed afload for so long) has lost his fit and proper person. I was told by DZ.com that the ad could not be marked a scam. becasue there was no reason to do so. I had no proof even though I was owed thousands of dollars for my work carried out for them. OUR COMPANY HAS INTEGRETY, we have just secured a combination package with the largest tourist attraction in our town and that company is owned by the wealthiest entity in our island. We need staff, and we have had some good applicant come through, but this does not look good for our company, there is only a few days before our premium membership is set to automatically pay for the next term, If I am not given a reasonable explanation then that will be cancelled. THERE IS NO REASON FOR OUR AD TO BE MARKED AS SCAM, AND IF THERE IS THEN PLEASE CONTACT US ABOUT IT. If some random that has a bee in his bonnet over my political standpoint can mark the ad a scam at will, then that is a serious flaw in your system. NOT HAPPY! "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

The offending ad has been removed and replaced with another. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

I have advertised for an instructor for our Dropzone. under the name skydivefj our dropzones account. It was marked as Scam. We contacted the abuse@dropzone.com as directed by the link saying 'is ths your ad' and asked for the scam mark to be removed. I also contacted Billvon who said he was working on it but it was not his department. 10 hours later it is still marked as a scam and there is no reason for it being so. I suggest that before you mark a DZ advertisemnt as a scam that you have valid reason to do so. Our website was linked on the ad and has all the relevant information needed to see our legitimacy. Now it is still marked as a scam, we have had quite a few responses, and some specifying how dubious they are due to the scam status. for a few hours it was marked as scam but could be viewed, now it is blocked altogether. i have posted another in the meantime. I will likely remove the ad that is marked as scam. We are a premium member of DZ.com and there has been no response to our plight. I suggest that one uses their integrety and good jugement when deciding to mark an ad as a scam or not, contact the entity that posted the ad with reason for doing so, and make sure that a follow up on the status of the poster as mistakes like this can cost the poster their reputation and that is not something somebody should pay money for. I would like an explanation for this situation or our financial support for DZ.com will not be renewed. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

Well said. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

No high horse, you came into the conversation claiming you were more qualified than me, attacked me, and added nothing to the conversation. You are a psycologist and you could add your professional input to the conversation. Instead you focus on me. I'm quite willing to learn from you but you are reluctant to give us any input. how about you give us your thoughts on the subject matter. What was hypocritical about anything I have said? maybe you need a shrink? "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

Your intentions were hidden behind your profession. They were also facetious and obnoxious, and this type of conduct is not becoming of an instructor in an instructor forum. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

So you seldom post on here anymore because of attitudes such as your own? "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

you adgenda was to get a reaction from me. so you are being hypocritical. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

Ask them what is going on on thier head, what they think is making them not breath, talk about it. Psycology is a big part of instructing, you dont have to be a psycologist to find to root of ones inhibitions. What do you suggest was not psycological about the breathing difficulty, and do you think instructors should ignore such details if they are not psycologists? Give me a break. If you disagree with my position address the position, not my credentials. We are all here to learn. you are welcome to adress the point with your professional opinion. It seems so far that we have come to two stand points. 1, The breath stip is a good idea. 2, The breath strip was not a good idea. I have yet to see anything in between. Why has this turned into attacking each other rather than addressing the point. Is this what DZ.com has become these days? I have clearly stated what I would have done, given the information. After watching the video of the jump I can see that he was clearly breathing at least some of the time, but as it was sliced and diced it is not possible to know the length of time they were in freefall. This whole discussion is a storm in a teacup because not enough or the incorrect information was given initially. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

It is very common for people to hold thier breath before opening, that is VERY different to holding thier breath from exit to opening. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

Tandem students (complete kettle of fish) 1, I don't give them anything but information. 2, I am in control of them / they are not out there on their own. 3, I don't freak them out with what can go wrong as they have no control over correcting it. (besides the body position I tell them 3-4 times). 4, A wingsuiter that is not comfortble, and not breathing poses a much larger risk to, themself, others in the sky and the incident rate of the said DZ than a tandem customer that goes foetal. Like I have said 3 times; I do not think it is likely that they were actually holding thier breath from exit to opening try holding your breath for 90 seconds while holding a stiff position. Maybe just before opening, but the message that was conveyed to us from DSE was that it was the whole time. How about you discuss the subject. I cannot remeber a tandem customer of mine holding thier breath for the whole jump, so it is not a real good comparison. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

Look, your initial post reads as though you dragged someone through the process rather than nurturing them through. I am not going to go through 5 pages of tripe to get a number, nor am I going to continue to debate with you about it, you posted your actions, and asked for an opionion, don't be surprised if not everybody agrees with you. You may or may not have discussed their anxiety or other reason for holding their breath, but you just came out of the blue, told us a stroy about your breath strips in a thread on instructional techniques in an instructor forum. If you are not willing to open dialogue about your methods, what is the point is starting a thread about them. You are confusing. Personally I would look for the psycological casue of this breathing difficulty. That is where I would probe, find out what is going on in thier head and try to resolve the inhibition. I would have taken them back a step and made sure thay were complete with their progression in the previous stage/s, find the point where thay can relax agian and see what is missing from there. Make sure someone is ready to move on, before progressing them. Dont drag them through their curve, make sure they are having fun and finding a comfortable and relaxed position in each step along the way, not stiff holding their breath or focusing on a future target/aim the whole time without making all the appropriate steps. If someone is not breathing and the effects of that are visible from an external point of view, then that person is not relaxed and far from doing their activity effectively. We all know (or should know) that to master any physical manoever one must learn to relax while doing it. Go back and do some tracking jumps with nice big breaths looking at each other. If they cannot dock or fly relative and show that they are relaxed and coherent, then they are not ready to move on yet. Thats what I would do. Sometime people don't want to admit thay are having trouble. That is what concerns me here. It is better to move on after you are ready, rather than before you are ready. You may well be doing all that but your origional post did not read that way. Try to be a little more concise perhaps? I'm out. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

You said earlier your debrief was about breathing, what did you guys discuss about the cause of him holding his breath? "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

He is saying don't take people on wingsuit jumps that have clearly showed that are not ready. Try a tracking suit, try something else and come back to it, but don't keep repeating the same mistake over and over without changing anything, and hope for the best while placing your faith in the placebo effect. Some people are too keen to progress, when they are not yet ready. I asked how many jumos and in what space of time, to try and get more information, others have asked what the student was thinking or anxious about but that has not been answered, only defensive attacks on those that are trying to help or make the situation more clear. Once again, I find it difficult to beleive that they did hold thier breath for the whole time, but that is the diagnosed problem so that is what we have to work with. How about this conversation moves away from the squabble and back to the subject. DSE, please answer the questions; How many jumps and in what space of time did this person have. and What was determined from the debreif(s) that was the cause of anxiety or lack of breathing? Nobody has the information to give any input other than whether or not these breth strips are a good idea or not. it is common for people to disagree with teaching techniques, so how about we learn to acknowledge our differences and actually discuss the subject and not each other... Instructing is not about ego, it is about learning, and giving your student what they rightfully deserve. "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

Try reading the whole thread.... "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

If someone is clearly uncomfortable enough 2 times in a row flying a wingsuit to the point where they cannot breath, then sendng them up for a third time without ascertaining what their fear was, and using that knowldge to nurture them into safety, is not good teaching. Maybe you did that, and maybe just reminding him to beat before exit was the key, don't turn it into fables. Read your post; You gave us no information about what information you gathered of their anxiety or inability to relax and breath, neither did you give us information about your briefs or debriefs, you simply painted a picture of you guys up there for the third time in a row after two consecutive jumps of them not breathing while trying to fly a wingsuit. Then you say giving him a breath stip saying it is his brathing strip, worked as a teaching aid. What else am I supposed to think. Don;t forget that not everybody has a steep learning curve, no matter how much they may want to think so, ir want to tell you. This person was clealy uncomfortable. How many jumps and in how long, did this person have by the way? "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix