ZigZagMarquis

... hmmm... reminds me of a "no shit, there I was story" one of the old "grey hairs" at the DZ tells... it goes like this... he was on a night combat jump in Vietnam, wound up hung-up in a tree at night, didn't know exactly how high up he was... did the "deploy the reserve" and shimmy down the reserve lines as described above, but in the dark, wound-up on the inside of the reserve chute... now stuck in side his reserve at the "bottom", he's thinking "this is just great"... he's debating whether to cut himself out, but still isn't sure how high up he is OR wait for the VC to find him... anyway, one of his buddies comes along and cuts him out, seems he was like a foot off the ground at that point... don't know if it was a Bull Shit story or not, but funny. Anyway, TDOG, let us know when you're going for "intentional power line landing" training...

We have been test jumping this line stow method for a while now. I really like it. It leaves the absolute minimum of line unstowed, and still allows both risers to be stowed down the sides of the container. Speaking of risers...their main purpose is to keep "things" from entangling with the deploying suspension lines. Ideally, they should be long enough to reach the BOTTOM of the container...like they still do in reserve containers. Main risers, however, have gotten much shorter so that pocket rocket drivers can reach up and either collapse or pull down the slider. This shortening of the main risers has had, as usual, unintended consequences. 1. With risers this short, the main turn toggles are no longer in, or at least very close to in, the main container where they should be. This makes it possible for the toggles to get free without the main container being open. This has killed several people. My answer to this new problem was secondary riser covers. 2. The shorter the risers, the longer the unstowed suspension line has to be, thus increasing the chance of entanglement. I don't yet know what my answer to this problem will be, but I am working on it. As to why line twists happen, I suspect that unstowed line length has very little to do with it. My two leading suspects (other than body position and the old reliable "shit happens") are: 1. Too small or improperly made pilot chutes. (The longer the time to line stretch, the longer the rather unsymetrical bag is exposed to the slipstream, and therefore, the more likely it will spin) 2. The often very different forces that are required to open the left and right tuck tab riser covers. If one cover releases just a split second later than the other, it simply can't help things very much, can it? Velcro riser covers didn't suffer from this problem, but alas, they are no longer cool. Some people also think (Bill Coe included) that uneven riser cover release is a main contributing factor to hard openings. This is another problem I am working on. Come on you all, lets see the arugments with what this poor lost soul has to say. Sparky Awh, come-on Mikey... all those "would be canopy engineers and want-to-be experts out there", as you put it will square off against you and I... well, errr, sometimes I deserve it, but they're smart enough not to go up against Bill.

Okay, I'll bite... what's a Ground Launch if its not getting a tow on your canopy behind a vehicle... is it where you go out to a hillside somewhere with your skydiving rig and try to launch yourself under your main like you would with a paraglider??? *confused look*

If you're talking about getting a tow behind a moving vehicle... make sure you have one of your buds video it, I've seen lots of "crash and burn" footage of folks doing that...

I broke my right ankle back in 98, bad Tib / Fib fracture on a bad landing (low turn)... Anyway, I had 8 screws and a plate, but unlike your injury, 7 of the screws & plate were on the Fib and the 8th screw was up through the end of the Tib to put it back together. After the injury & surgery, I was in a cast and on cruthes (non weight bearing) for 6 weeks... after the cast came off, I was still on crutches and still non-weight bearing for another 3 weeks, but could do physical therapy on my right ankle. Walked with a cane for awhile after that, continued to do physical therapy, hung out at the DZ on the weekends. I was grounded for a little over 6 months total after the injury. At about 10 or 11 months after the injury, I had the hardware taken out for similar reasons it sounds like you're wanting your's out... and because I had the thought in the back of my mind that it would be really "bad" to rebreak the same bones with the hardware still in. In between when I got current again (injury + about 6 months) and when I had the hardware taken out (injury + about 11 months) I did jump, but jumped a bigger canopy... running out a landing wasn't something I wanted to do. Anyway, after having the hardware out, I was up and walking within a couple of days, no real couch time that go around, and was only on the ground again for 6 weeks. After getting back in the air again, I jumped with an ankle brace for a couple of years until I forgot to bring it with me to the DZ one weekend and decided to forge ahead without. Having said that, let me say, I'm not a doctor, obviously, so you should listen to them and not what a bunch of folks on the internet say... but, if you haven't already, you may want to talk it over with your doctor about what would happen if you break the same bones again with the hardware still installed? ... and seeing as how the screws and plate are on your Tibia (if I understand you correctly) then maybe there is a difference where they want to leave it in, but were willing to take it out for me since the plate and most of the screws were on my Fib... remember, the Tibia is the weight bearing bone in your lower leg, where as the Fibia is there for muscles and tendons as I understand (again, engineer, not doctor here). Anyway, good luck. I'm sure we'd all be currious to hear how things go for you and what your doctors say.

I used to like them... then I got a 20 or so of them under my belt and decided I'd had enough of it... would rather stay on the ground and drink beer and watch others go up to do their "D-License Night Jumps"

__________________________________ You are correct! RSL ring comes standard on Sunpath risers. That reminds me of a rig I worked on. The owner tried to remove the RSL ring from the riser of his new Javelin. He removed the 3rd. ring of the 3-Ring! Chuck LMAO! That's funny!! Anyway... ALL OF the risers folks have talked about here WORK. If someone perfers one over the other, fine, but remember they're all basically the same and they all work. Anyway... Anyway... Thanks for the pics, ernokaikkonen. Skyblu3, I think the de Fance system is what used to be called "Zoo Toggles"... maybe Chuck will know (masterrig)... or pretty close to it and I believe they've been around longer then the 90s.

Actually, now that I think of it... I had a subscription to BPA's Parachutist mag counterpart for a year and enjoyed reading it... but I think BPAs mag only comes out 6 times a year or something like that (or it was something like that at the time) and I don't think I got all the issues I should have because of the nature of it having to come across the pond and all, I think a few got lost in the mail... anyway, like I said, I enjoyed reading the issues I got as it was a different slant on things. I think you'll feel similarly about Skydiving mag.

Sunpath has the hard housings in the risers too... so basically, the only diff between the two is that RWS uses a stright pin for the bottm "tuck" and Sunpath uses a hard fold of fabric just like the top of a toggle for the bottom "tuck"... ... oh, and RWS uses tape for the "sleeve" to stow the excess brake line on the back of the riser... where as Sunpath uses elastic... personally, I like the elastic better, but the tape on the RWS version works too... either way, better then stowing the excess through the top of the riser where the speed link or Slink attaches the lines to the riser... ... anyway, we're splitin' nits...

Personally, as an experienced jumper, I tend to read Skydiving Mag more then I read Parachutist. So... depending on what in international subscription is... I'd say you'd be happy with a subscription to Skydiving. I keep a few issues of Parachutist around for the pictures to show my whuffo friends when they ask and because I feel I have to get something for those USPA dues...

Dunno... I've heard both arguments... turn it off before the drive home if you're going "up" on the way home and I've heard the argument that it doesn't matter. In the beginning, I used to always leave my Cypres ON and let it turn itself off whether I drove home or stayed at the DZ at night to jump the next day. After having a set of batteries drop dead at about 18 months into its 2 year "life" (not the 1st set of Cypres Batts I ever had, mind you) I religiously turned my Cypres off at the end of the day on the next set of batteries... they lasted the two years. After that, I've gone back to just letting the unit shut itself off... on that Cypres, the one in my Talon94, and on the second Cypres I've since purchased on my Javelin... and all of those battery sets have made it their advertised 2-years. So what do I conclude from my experience... I suppose that if you turn it off at the end of the day before driving home, you may buy yourself some extra margin, but if you don't turn it off before the drive home, I wouldn't go so far as to say they won't last 2-years. Form your own decission based on the info you have and do what makes you feel good is my 2 cents on this one. Now, of course, that all applies to an original Cypres... a Cypres-2, dunno. What you definitly DO NOT want to do is turn your Cypres on at home and then drive to the DZ!! or IMO... Turn your Cypes on at DZ - A, do a few jumps, drive to DZ - B and jump it without turning it OFF and then back ON again at the second DZ.

Interesting. I've never had a problem with Sunpath's Velcro-less toggle / riser system on my Jav... except maybe once in several hundred jumps on it and I attributed that to the "shit happens" sometimes / below the noise level catagory. Now in the past I have had problems with brakes coming unstowed on opening with, what happened to be what I was jumping at that time, Velcro'ed toggles, on a more "frequent" basis then I liked, BUT it was a problem were the "cat's eye" on the canopy steering lines where you set the brakes was "too big" and after sewing that up a bit, never had a problem with unstowed breaks on opening anymore.

Sunpath's Velcro-less toggles/risers work good too IMO. I see you jump a Javelin (according to your profile)... why didn't you order a replacement set of Type 17 risers from Sunpath with toggles/risers... they come standard with RSL hook-up I believe too.

Yeah, I know. Mostly I was just venting. I'm a little ticked at the place... well, a little ticked a me actually... for allowing myself to be affected by DZ Politics; something I made a blood vow I'd never ever do again... again... or agian, ever... Anyway, why do you have a picture of a friggin' SkyPig as your avitar? PM me with an email for ya and I'll get your some pictures of an aircraft that has 21st Century technolgy... not the best late 60s technology.

Yep, Aussie chicks rock! If I'm in a bar fight, I want them on my side!!

... well, you could always throw in a Mc-Side-Salad instead of fries once in awhile.

Only if you're on the 4-Way team sponsored by McDonalds.

Thanks for the info...

That's really funny. I got to remember that one for a new student or tandem Yeah, well, I guess I have to give credit where credit is due... back in the day, a buddy of mine, Philly, was spotting a load over Cal City for a Dar Robinson (sp?) stunt for that ol' show That's Incredible. The gig was... they had this old VW Micro-Bus with the roof cut out in the back of this C119. They were going to dump this thing out of the back of the 119, it would be "stabilized" in freefall under a drouge... Dar would bail out after it, fly down to it, get in, deploy a huge assed cargo cute, get the thing started up and when it hit the ground, cut-away the cargo chute and drive away... *cue Cathy Lee saying* THAT's INCREDIBLE! Anyway, they were having trouble with the drouge deployment system and had bounced a couple of Micro-Buses... but thought they had it all fixed and were going up for another try... so... the last attempt goes something like this... according to the lore... my buddy Philly is spotting this 119 over the outskirts of Cal City, gives the signal to "go"... the crew starts to push the Micro-Bus out of this 119 when the drouge fires still inside the plane... as the Micro-bus and drouge go out, barely missing the horizontal between the twin booms at the back of this 119, the drouge cleans out out a bunch of fuel lines inside the cargo bay of the bird... with fuel spraying all around... one of the crew... who had a bail out rig on for "safety", but wasn't a jumper asks my bud Philly what they should do! To which he replies, "You wait here, I'm going for help" and he promptly un-assed himself from the airplane. Anyway, all ended well, the pilot & co-pilot managed to land the plane without things going boom... and I don't think they ever got that stunt working right... ergo, you never saw it on T.V.

Ya know on other posting boards I lurk, I can understand the ZigZag portion of my handle being mistaken for a drug reference... but on a SKYDIVING board!!???... Geeze!!! Doesn't anyone do 4-Way RW anymore??? Ever heard of the Zig Zag to Marquis Block anyone???

*shutters* Why do I always get the feeling like I'd rather go to the dentist then talk to the local FSDO.

bytch... I'd be surprised if it had anything more to do with other then they ordered a new stamp for some reason or another around that time... but, just the same, an interesting bit of canopy trivia.

You're right, those crappy little plastic hook-knives you get for free a lot of the times with a new rig are basically useless. However, I'd rather see folks have a real hook-knife in a jump plane then a straight blade "K-Bar" type knife... I wouldn't want to be on a plane with some sort of an emergency going on and an over-amped pilot or another jumper with a straight-blade knife slashing widly at something or other.

Yeah... I remember that one... I was at Cal City when Troy & Wallace & Company filmed the stunt / re-enactment. Troy's got bigger balls then I do... ...or is paid really really well... . Anyway, what I'm amazed by from the original incident was that the guy's jumpsuit bootie didn't fail at some point... and that the the pilot didn't have a hook-knife onboard; big learning point there. Like most have said, I don't think dumping while in tow that that would be a wise thing to do... it might cause an aircraft that is flying to no longer be fly-able if your trash wraps around the tail... and then you may get to see the pilot do his first skydive as he "goes for help" while your sorry ass is still wrapped up with the airplane heading rapidly towards the air -- earth interface.

I remember seeing an old Ghost Riders video of the 4 of them exiting the Skyvan at Perris (I think it was) where it looked like they all did exactly that, or pretty close to it. I wouldn't want to try it unless I had to, but would be willing to ride up in the Skyvan and video you doing it, if you want... ... course, I'll have my rig on and will "go for help" if your main winds up wrapped around the tail...