ZigZagMarquis

Yeah, but what if you don't want a harness/container with both the top (chest) and bottom (hip) rigs?? Can you order a Talon FS with just the hip rings?... the F.A.S.T. config, right?

Yes, someone stepping on my lines while I'm packing is a "pet-peve" of mine and yes, I agree it isn't the best thing in the world for the lines either as far as wear goes. Weird thing is though I'm fairly tolerant of it if its another skydiver, especially if its one of my buds, and its plainly an accident... heck, how many of us have done it... snagged someone's lines by mistake. However, something I'm not particularly proud of... ... on the other hand if its a whuffo or worse yet... the kids or dog of some poor whuffo, I've been known to blow them some serious sh*t over stepping on lines.

Alti III... smaller... wear it on my left wrist vice chest strap where I never did much like wearing one... keep meaning to get a mount made to go onto my left lift web, ya know, below the main ring and above the cut-away handle... have seen folks with altimeters there and would like to try it out.

Hmmm... a buck a jump used to be a rule of thumb. So, 300 jumps, take 300 bucks of the "new" price. However, I've seen several canopies bought for a song by someone who low-balled the seller by waving cash in front of them NOW... like, "Hey, you want $750 for that canopy, well see here, I've got $550 cash here right now, what do ya say?" ... and on the other hand, seen folks pay way too much for a ragged out F111 canopy or an old ZP canopy that needs a like kit like bad. edit... of course what in "style" has a lot to do with things too. I'll bet I could walk onto a big drop zone with a used Cross-Fire that is in desperate need of a line kit and get more for it then an F111 PD190 that has less then 50 jumps on it and has been vac-bag sealed and in a deep dark dry closet for 10 years.

Psycho pack... well, I've gotta admit, I've never done it... flat packed for years (yep dating myself) and then moved onto Pro-Packing. Okay, so I can't say if a Psycho Pack is better then a Pro-Pack. I will say that if you're going to Psycho Pack you best get a bridle extension on your canopy. Other then that... my 2 cents... I see a lot of folks who Psycho Pack and stick by it and have no troubles... heck, squares want to open... if you get the lines straight and the slider is up, its all a matter of technique after that to get it in the bag and get openings that don't break your back. What confuses me though... and the reason I decided to post... is I see other folks struggling to Psycho Pack and get their canopy in the bag, but they won't Pro-Pack. I don't get it. Sure, its taken me some work, but I've done the "Pitty Pack" for some of these same folks and thrown a traditional Pro-Pack and S-folds to get it in the bag... and done it. So I don't understand why they won't Pro-Pack. Anyway, I suppose it comes down to picking a method and sticking to it and developing your own techniques. Like I tell folks having trouble packing... jump more... you'll have to pack more then. edit... oh yeah, seems to me, one of the downsides of Psycho Packing could be forgetting to flip the canopy back over before bagging it... seen that happen.

Lets see... what have I seen/caught myself when asked by someone else for a gear check or asked by someone with less experience to "give them a hand" or "hey, take a look at this"... or stuff pointed out to me when I was less experienced... - Cutaway cables mis-routed. - Reserve cables mis-routed... missed the ring on the end of the RSL... e.g. if main would have been cut-away, the RSL wouldn't have pulled the reserve even with the RSL hooked up at the riser end. - More then one main toggle tied on wrong. - Suspension lines & steering lines on mains hooked up to links/risers incorrectly... wrong order on the links... steering line routed around line group... steering lines not through slider grommet. - Missing bar-tac on finger trap for lower control portion of steering line. - Kill-line pilot chute hooked up wrong. - Main D-Bag in-side-out. - Foreign object stuck in main closing loop along with curved pin.

... this may sound contentious, but its really just a conversation... Well Rob, I won't deny that jumping in the desert is more harsh an environment than say Perris Valley. Lets start by talking containers / reserves... lets jump into the time machine and fastforward to say mid to late 2004... next lets say I bring to you my 94 Talon with a Raven IIg not in it (unpacked) with a DOM also of 1994 for a reserve repack(maybe I'm at your DZ for a boogie and had to air my reserve and didn't bring my tools to repack it myself)... you look at the reserve packing data card and see that it has been repacked consistently every repack cycle since I first bought it in 94... packed at places like Cal City and Apple Valley... in fact I know the only time it wasn't packed at either of those desert DZs was when it was repacked once at R.I. at Perris when I had the hybrid version of the hard cable housing mod done... but I digress... and I tell you that I've been jumping this rig consistently (say an average of 200 jumps a year) over the past 10 years... okay... would you tell me that this rig / reserve is no longer airworthy simply because its been jumped in the desert for 10 years? ... or are you going and inspect the harness/container and do a pull test on the reserve and go from there before you would reply? Aside, hey, if the reserve fails the pull test, no arguements from me. Next, lets talk mains... slow down and listen to what you just said... and I'm not disagreeing with you... but, however, in part of your last post, you talk about a example jumper who's doing say 300 jumps a year. Well, I don't care if you're jumping in the desert and dragging your main through the dust and dirt and over the sage brush and broken beer bottles and thru the cactus back to the hanger to pack it OR if you're jumping at some sort of mythical drop zone that has an environment approaching a clean room and its only packed by velvet clad nymphs... after 10 to 20 years at 300 jumps per year, I doubt there's a main in existance that would still be air-worthy! So, I don't quite get what you're saying. If you're saying that gear that has been in service and used on a regular basis for 10 to 20 to 25 years is approaching being "worn out"; then generally speaking, I'd agree... heck, that's kind of obvious... that's how wear and tear happens. If you're saying that desert gear that is 10+ years old and all other gear that is 20 to 25+ years old should be shelved "just because". Well, I'd disagree with you. I know folks here in the desert that have gear in the 8 to 10 to 15 year window that is fine becasue they take care of their stuff. I know folks that jump in the desert that have gear that's 3 or 4 or 5 years old that is trashed because they don't take care with their rigs.

Viking... Rob does a good job explaining the pre/post 94 Talon and later 97, Talon 2 line in his posts, above. Myself, I jump a Talon T6 DOM Jan 94... thought it was 95, but just went and looked and was reminded it was 94. Anyhow, I've put over 1500 jumps on my container and haven't had a problem. Its always has had a Raven II reserve in it. I've packed a PD190, Sabre170, Sabre150 many times and have paked a Sabre-2 170 and Stilletto 150 in it... the Sabre150 and Stilletto 150 both packed up rather "soft" in it... closing loop just long engough to stack 3 gromets on top of it... so, I'd not recommend that in a T6 long term. One thing I'd suggest though that you look for on the rig if you buy it that someone here reminded me of reading all the replies is the old soft housings that used to be on it. Originally, my rig had soft housings, but at some point I had what was called the hybrid mod done to it... its been a few years since I had it done... R.I. was still down near Perris, not Eloy, so its been a few years. Anyway, the hybid mod only replaced the soft cable housing around the yoke, for the left riser cut-away cable, with a hard housing, but left the soft ends. I decided on the hybrid mod at the time because I found it more of an issue that it was difficult (not impossible, just a moster pain) to route the left riser cut-away cable with the orginal soft-housing, but much easier with the hard housing around the yoke. With the hybrid mod on my rig, I've chopped my main many times on the ground to keep from getting drug in high winds and in the air once to get rid of a spinning ball of trash mal and not had a problem. However, if this rig still has soft cable hosings, I'd recommend the full up mod which replaces all of the soft cut-away cable hosings with hard housings... especially if you're jumping high performance canopies by today's standards. Some riggers think less of Talons then other rigs. Just my opinion, but I think this is mostly because of the reserve pilot chute configuration that uses a conical spring of a type that requires the rigger to "Collapse the pilotchute while stuffing the fabric INSIDE the coils." This is unlike other rigs / reserve pilot chutes where those systems' manufacturers instruct otherwise, but the point is that's a different system with different packing instructions. Anyhow, talk to your local rigger and see what he or she says. Also, as always, if you're not a rigger yourself, having a rigger look over any used gear before purchasing it isn't a bad idea.

Ahh... the never ending question as to which rig is best... Bummer that you don't have the chance to jump a few different ones Drenaline. Personally, I'd say there aren't any "bad" rigs out there these days. It pretty much comes down to a matter of style and cost... i.e. which rig you think looks good when you pick the colors, patterns, etc. you want if you're custom ordering and then cost... eee-gads!... all new containers are getting expensive these days, but some are less expensive then others so that may be a factor to you, but even if you buy one of the more economical containers, all of them are just fine. Some riggers will tell you that this rig is easier to pack then that rig when it comes to reserves... this is true to an extent, but they're all similar... so unless you're planning on getting a rigger's ticket anytime soon, that may or may not be a factor in your decision... of course, from a piece of mind standpoint, you may want to pick a rig your local rigger is comfortable with... i.e. some riggers run in fear when they see a Reflex or Racer come through the door, while others don't. Personally, I jump a Talon 2 circa 1995 with a post-production BOC mod. Why? Well, I bought it in 95 when I had a Vector 2-2 stolen earlier that year. I'd have bought another Vector at the time, but at that time Relative Workshop was up to a 50+ week deliever time! No shit! Anyway, I've been happen with the Talon 2 ever since and am considering buying another Talon, but I see now that R.I. has come out with a Talon 3. Anyway, if you're into freeflying, make sure you consider pilot chute and riser protection a lot as one of your decission factors. Anyway, happy rig buying! Getting your first new custom rig is the BEST! ... oh yeah... BEER !!!!!

What data do you have to support this claim? Undeniably, the desert environment is harder on gear then say landing and packing on grass all the time... however... just because a rig has been jumped in the desert for 10 years doesn't mean its "bad", as long as its "air-worth". Of course, that can be a point of contention.