mrshutter45

looking back into the thread it seems possible she is mixing the stops up. several times she mentions an area that she seems to refer to as unknown owners of the property where Duane went down to the rive ALL by himself and told her to wait in the car. also lots of comments about a cabin on the river east of Tena bar. she made statements that law enforcement would not look into the area in the last 14 years. she went onto to say it would cost a couple hundred dollars for the documents. it seems the cabin has vanished and been replaced with a building on the river at Tena bar. the change happens around 2010...2011. in 2008 & 2009 she said several times they were not at Tena bar & lots about the cabin on the river "way east" of Tena bar. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

I really don't have anything to do with what Georger is saying. he makes his statements, and I make mine. I understand the cash part of it. who wants to pay for this. not me. perhaps we will find another approach. I found a site where it is possible to get the DD-214 for free, but, it could take months. this all started with the lack of documentation. you have to agree with that. the one and only true source is the US Army. I do believe it's possible he was. I also feel if Porteous has the documents he says he has. it would be the end of the story. proof for everyone? I will set this aside until something can be established. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Jo, you just made that quote. you claim you were there at the end of September, you really can't use Sept. in counting. the money was found early Feb. 1980. this would be a little over 4 months. "put Duane on Tena bar before the money find and I'll pay attention" "I can't put Duane on Tena bar." you can't mix that statement up Jo. perhaps you are mixing up a website vs a thread. a website you can say what ever you wish. a thread is a place where people converse. mainly on something that was said earlier. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

"I think you and Shutter are simply angry because I don't respond with what you want." angry? where do you get wanting proper documentation as anger? isn't this what you are claiming the FBI is doing with the Amboy chute, not enough documentation? you assume way too much. that seems to be one of your problems. isn't Marla claiming LD was a paratrooper. I know it's simple to figure out he is not, but, it's the same. I believe several TV shows claimed that as well....... "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Gray said this: "Kenny trained with 11th Airborne Division, the Angels, which had been sent to the Pacific. But he never saw combat. When he was finally deployed, on August 16, 1945, his discharge papers show, the war was over. He ended up in Japan, joining the initial occupation forces". now read this...does it match? I think it's fair to say something is wrong. http://www.ww2-airborne.us/18corps/11abn/11_overview.html "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

"Option 1. A paper sack Duane threw into the river at the bridge 8 months before it was found on Tena's bar." 8 months Jo? Sept 79- Feb 80 = 8 months? also take notice that you claim the area Duane went to the river by himself, with you in the car was not Tena bar. you claim the FBI wouldn't look into who owned the property. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

I've decided to take this position on Christiansen and his death, and whether or not he was a paratrooper: Prove he died from an AIDS-related disease. Prove he wasn't a paratrooper. You see...I am not in the habit of proving other peoples' allegations on this thread. If they are going to put forward those ideas, they should not come running to me for their evidence. I will wait for their alleged proof on these things, and then present what I have. I willl say this much regarding Kenny's service: The reason why Gray's listing of Kenny's unit and mine do not match is because I listed his BTC, and Gray lists his permanent party unit. You were in the service, right? You know someone is assigned to one unit in Basic Training, and another for Advanced Training (depending on the specialty) and sometimes even another when they are assigned to their final unit. that sounds like a response Jo would give (*laughs*) no records (actual) have been shown that KC has been a paratrooper. that's the bottom line. go ahead and take the easy way out of it. this question has been asked my times. not just by me. you would never accept the answer you just gave for this. not in a million years. did you read about the company Gray speaks of? it doesn't match. earlier I was doubtful he wasn't a paratrooper. after digging further I'm concluding it's unsupported due to lack of evidence. you are the one who claims he was a paratrooper, not me. it's your obligation to prove this as fact. not mine. until actual proof has been shown. you can't use this as evidence. based on what you are saying. I find it difficult to even verify you talked to Lyle about this? you said that Lyle was mailing the certificate. now, do you wish to recant this allegation? the privacy thing is ridiculous. you and the whole family are accusing him of a Federal crime. terrorism, kidnapping, extortion etc. etc. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

it's my understanding that the FBI did dig further at the site. nothing was found. after it was concluded as to not being Cooper's chute. that is all they are going to explain. they will not go step by step spoon feeding the reason. you seem to want to turn the ordeal into something it's not. if they no longer have the chute this would be another indication it's worthless. you should be working on proof KC was a paratrooper. I just read where Porteous claims to have the records. you give a different training company than Gray reports. lots of confusion surrounding this. where is the Death Cert? is Lyle riding a bike to Seattle? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Blevins, To the best of my memory, a parachute was NOT required for doing acrobatic flying in the early 1970s EXCEPT in certain situations. If you were flying your own plane solo and not-for-profit, then no parachute was required. If you were carrying paying passengers and doing acrobatics, then a parachute was required for each person on board. Generally speaking for sports aviation, if you were interested in staying alive, then a parachute was a very good idea. If not, then no need for one. For sports contests with airplanes, the organizer usually required a parachute. Robert99 I seem to agree with your conclusion. I'm reading a lot of people stating this almost word for word as you mention above. "The FAA requires parachutes in flight whenever anybody other than a required crewmember is in the airplane, and certain limits of pitch and roll are to be exceeded (except for required spin training). This means that parachutes must be worn by pilot and student during dual instruction in aerobatics. As far as the FAA is concerned, parachutes are not required during solo aerobatic flight. But the IAC, being the safety-conscious organization that it is, does require that all pilots wear parachutes during contest flights. And believe it or not, you actually can function with this piece of safety equipment strapped onto your back! Maybe our American backs are just more tough than your Oz backs! Tom P." it's not required in Australia or New Zealand. I'm sure there is other countries. from what I understand of the FAA regs on aerobatics, if your are flying solo a parachute is not required, but if you are carrying a pax then they must wear one. 91.307 Parachutes and parachuting c) Unless each occupant of the aircraft is wearing an approved parachute, no pilot of a civil aircraft carrying any person (other than a crewmember) may execute any intentional maneuver that exceeds— (1) A bank of 60 degrees relative to the horizon; or (2) A nose-up or nose-down attitude of 30 degrees relative to the horizon. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Blevins, Have YOU researched anything that will appear in your upcoming book? Or, are you just copying posts from this thread? Citing your own post as "research" will not get the job done. Robert99 no word yet on the Death cert? no answers here either..... conflictions...according to Blevins Company E, Third Parachute Training Regiment. Sent to Pacific Theater later, but war was ending by the time he got there, assigned to duty in Occupied Japan, in the city of Fukuoka. according to Gray: "Kenny trained with 11th Airborne Division, the Angels, which had been sent to the Pacific. But he never saw combat. When he was finally deployed, on August 16, 1945, his discharge papers show, the war was over. He ended up in Japan, joining the initial occupation forces". http://www.ww2-airborne.us/18corps/11abn/11_overview.html "I've looked up 11th airborne rosters before but have never found KC's name." "I still have not found any record of KC being ASSIGNED to any ABN DIV, maybe he was only attached?" " proof that he was a paratrooper has never been presented though it's been asked since the beginning." "Or ask Geoffrey Gray in an email. He was the first to mention Christiansen's service publicly, not me. Always go to the original source." I think the original source would be the US Army? does anyone see a problem here that needs proper documentation? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

there is no proof it was in the ground for 40+ years. I think amazon could answer that question better. I would think if you put a white sock in the ground for a year or two, it wouldn't be white coming out? can you show where the FBI claimed it was from the missing pilot? source, please.... "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

the chute is nothing but ...a chute. if they were nervous it was going to be Coopers chute and not want it known they wouldn't have made it public information. the people who found the chute remained silent so nothing would have been said. is it strange? yes, call for cover up...doubtful. I believe it was the media that concluded the 1945 chute. If the chute is 33 feet in diameter. the whole deal is out the window. I don't think it's a law ( last time checked) on disclosing every angle they used to identify the chute. if we use the flight path written in stone done by a bunch of smart guys and we go by what Rataczak says. the chute is in the wrong spot. If the police can't link Cossey's murder to the Cooper case the FBI has nothing to do with it. I do believe enough time has past where the family should voice concern. possibly seek outside help. I don't think the FBI cares what we think one way or the other on there conclusions. the case is old, they admit they have limited time on working the case. if 1000 people were calling in everyday, perhaps they would change there tune. the term "whatever' comes to mind. I found out last night that a guy I am going to be doing work for is a FBI Agent. maybe I can get something out of him. he doesn't even know that I know he is a agent. another cop who referred me to him told me who he was. this answers my question why he asked me if I was law enforcement. when I asked him for his address, I told him I needed a writing utensil. he said it sounded like something someone in law enforcement would say. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

it doesn't make any sense unless the Government funded it. they would lose money with it sitting there locked out of there hands. all other reports are they had to rush to get the money together. if it was ready it would be a quick escorted drive to and from. I forgot, where did the story come from about the money being readily available? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

"Thought the money was recorded previous to the hijacking" I just found this from ckret: "but the order per serial number was never documented. There is no indication the money was re-bundled. " and this "It is my understanding the money was wraped in rubber bands, no paper bands. the money was put together in different bill counts so it looked as if it was put together in a hurry." the order must of been documented. they claimed the Tena Bar money was still in it's original sequence.??????? let's see what Georger says about this. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Robert says" "Supposedly, this was done for three main reasons. First, they already knew how much money had arrived from the bank, i.e. the amount requested by the hijacker and provided by SeaFirst. Second, to make the hijacker believe the money was not recorded. Third, because no one had time to count out individual bills because everyone was in a quick-fast New York hurry to get the money to the plane." first you start off with the word "supposedly" that means you don't know. I recall the money going through a recordak and being photo copied. this would cause the bundles to be broken up and put into the machine. I would say they probably counted the money during this operation. two birds, one stone. this would be were they made different amounts in the bundles as well. if in fact they did that. I can't buy the FBI not knowing the actual amount. I don't care if it came from the President of the United States. I would make sure. if they had several machines. this shouldn't really take that long depending on how fast the machine was. we don't know when the money got to the FBI. this makes it hard to try and pin point a time frame. I think the above could have been done if they got the money quick enough. it's possible the stalling was the money and not the chutes. they are not going to give that clue out to anyone. you would think the chutes would be the easiest demand. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Surgical, Super, Dental, airplane glue. none are made for ears. I use the term hard to believe a lot vs deceptive. I never said you were lying. you have some issue's with many of the comments you have made. I have a very good memory as well. I can remember as far back as 3. I had a double hernia. we traveled a lot in the 70's. I can not recall anything about Mom or Dad throwing something out the window in our many travels. I remember certain points and times. nothing irrelevant like trash. back then I'm sure it happened. I was reading back in the thread further today. I noticed you claimed an amount of $27,000 in the bag? it just doesn't make sense to have hard earned cash sitting in a hole right in the crime scene area for years. (close to it) you really need to go public Jo. you have stated this many times over as well. have someone speak out about your case. then you won't have to worry about being nervous. phone interviews with reporters etc. you are spinning your wheels here. get it over with one way or the other. my personal opinion is that you don't have any hard evidence supporting your story. it seems you take a "what if" and turn it into reality. it might work for you, but, in reality it's a stretch. that's how I see it. if I'm wrong, I'm sure proof will tell me I'm wrong. I have been proven wrong many times. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Ive never found any early statement of a total amount Brian found - anywhere. There is definately nothing in what Tom s calling the FBI Transcript. Nothing in any early newspaper article Ive ever found, except for refereces to Brian finding $3000. Nothing in sources Ive interviewed. Somewhere the early reports of Brian finding $3000 morphed into $5800 later ... and my guess is it surfaced in some interview Himmeslsbach gave to somebody. I dont think anybody knew/knows how much money was found due to bills being stuck together and fragments etc. All of the early newspaper accounts seem to refer to Brian finding $3000.00 Again, where and when it jumped to $5800, I dont know. I could search all of the newspaper articles I have and try to locate a source and date ... if it matters. My guess is the FBI was the source of $5800 at some point, and it might have been Himmelsbach first stated $5800 at some point ... since Himmelsbach was the point man at first. Maybe it was Pringle in Seattle? I guess the best way to find out would be to ask Brian exactly how much money he has. since it went to court there must of been a way they divided the cash? did they ever weigh the money? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Jo, you have claimed many things as facts. Carr even pointed that out to you. the problem I see is that you have indeed been to Tena Bar with the film crew and H. how does anyone know you took the story from there? I simply showed flaws in your statements. 377 clearly asked you to put Duane on Tena Bar. your response was that you couldn't. Instead of posting here night after night and POSSIBLY doing damage to your case. you need to go public and have the living witnesses prove your theory. it's not going to happen on here. your past tells me you jump to conclusion way to often. it's hard for anyone to believe what you say. you go into rants and start name calling without any reason. you have to accept questions will be asked when you make some of your claims. super glued ears, CIA, Area 51. remembering a trash incident from years and years ago. giving detailed info about trash? that's very close to a photographic memory. 17 years later from 1996. very hard to believe. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

The Computer Graphics people for the documentary "The Skyjacker that got away" must have had good access to all the Cooper Material. Check out the CG rendering of the Carr picture Cooper money folder. Attached picture. "The Skyjacker that got away" link below. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2I755lTZmU I doubt they have any other info that we have. the bills are CG no doubt. even the numbers are not the same font used by the Government. I made a quick sample myself. I don't have the correct number font to make look authentic. but did sign it "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

"PROVE YOU PERSONALLY WENT TO TENA'S BAR IN 1971, 1979, 2001 AND 2010 THEN YOU CAN HAVE BRAGGING RIGHTS. USING PICTURES OR ARIALS THAT JUST MIGHT NOT HAVE THE RIGHT DATE IS NOT A GOOD THING. THE ARIELS USED COULD HAVE BEEN EARLIER THAN THE COMPILATION OF THE MAP." who's quote is that? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

I'm still confused. Georger says there never was a true amount given ( hope that is right) then we have Brian finding $3000 according to a newspaper. we have accounts of the bills with rubber bands intact, but, crumbled when touched. (none got out) then years later 35 additional serial numbers were found. if you can find the actual amount of bills Brian had. you can figure out how much money was there. if he split the money with the Insurance company and the FBI has 14 bills, you should be able to come very close to the real amount. this pic only shows the FBI having 10 bills. not sure how many they really have. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

I thought you might be interested in this post made by ckret Nov 29, 2007... The money was packaged in varying amounts, so one bundle would have $500.00 another $1,000.00, there was no uniformity to it. I have been searching for the evidence report from the lab but have not found it yet, lots of files to go through. When I get it you'll be the second to know. this part does not include testxyz. it appears Jo has removed a large portion of her comments on this page including the one were she accuses me of being on drugs. I have that portion written in my post, but, not in quotations. Sep 11, 2013, 6:58 PM Post #46833 of 46839 (288 views) "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

I NEVER EVER said the sack held anything of size. I described the bag like one they put ice cream in at a convenience store yrs ago. It was NOT a large bag - lunch size - Lunch size 1969's not today. I NEVER said it held anything of size - it was folded over at the top and not flimsy like bags today - so I compared it to an ice cream bag. Maybe 8 x4 at the base and perhaps 10 inches tall 2/3 of it was folded over at the top.,,,firmly! Sorry again Jo. just doing what you always tell people. "read the thread" see photo. sorry. I'm also amazed how you remember something so irrelevant over a decade later "firmly" "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

just sent a reply lol "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

questioning someone with different stories is hard being a bully Jo. the remark about drug use was way over the line. why would you get so upset. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI