mrshutter45

You might be right - I could not get a great resolution and couldn't find a magnifying glass. And though the two flight paths might be the same - I haven't checked that closely yet - but I was not looking at the one with the pins. I was looking at this one below in comparison with the LINE c-d-e-s on jumpzone attached. But I didn't try to overlay them. I was going off of a couple of landmarks and measurements, and the resolution is not so great so I could be wrong. It happens occasionally.

you have several good reference points on both maps. to the left is a slanted white line on the drop map. that is V23. running almost horizontal just above the lewis river is power lines. (other white line) these are visible on both maps as well as a Vector map. you can notice certain terrain marks as well to get a good point to mark for a Long/Lat cord. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

"And so my same concerns - the path on the dropzone looks different than the one on the flightpath document. So which one do you go with?" I have to disagree with the two maps not lining up. to date I believe we are looking at two different maps in two different scales. when I first looked at the two, I thought the same thing. when you scale them up they seem to match up. the original FBI drop map is zoomed in much closer than the scale of the flight path map itself. I could be wrong, but it seems to match pretty good. the 8:10 location seems to line up pretty good to the M location on the original drop map. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

"1. This is just my personal opinion based on stuff I've read, but I don't think the FBI had anything to do with coming up with the flight path or the dropzone. Why would they - it's not their area of expertise?." I agree with this. I only state that the FBI concludes they think they know where he jumped based on the information given to them. I'm sure there was a lot of talking going on once the first sign of the stairs being messed with. (not just after take off) when you read the transcripts there is to much silence in the area of question. I have flown the path on my simulator up to the Merwin lake area. it can be done in the time frame they have plotted. this can only confirm the path can be flown in the time frame they have it in. this doesn't mean it's was done on in area they have it plotted. this is at a speed average of about 165-170 KIAS, with a ground speed of around 185-195. watching the video again of Carr saying it's the believed path only makes matters worse in my opinion. has anyone flown a 727 before that is on this thread? I have spoken to Robert99 about this. I'm having trouble gaining speed once I take off due to the flaps at 15 and the gear down. I can't get the plane to go any faster in this position. this is the difference I noticed going from Microsoft to X-Plane. I also wonder if the put the gear up while they were taking off. the transcripts read shortly after take off that they were slowing down to about 160, then mention gear down and flaps at 15. then a short time later they switch to 30 degree's flaps until later down the path they switch and remain at 15 degree flaps. sorry, forgot to mention that the speed hits about 175 on a 5 degree pitch. the only way I can get more speed is to retract the flaps and gear while climbing? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

"It's things like this that make the Tina Bar money find so baffling." Robert, it might not be that baffling if the path is not how they have plotted it. I'm not saying anything is correct until I have more information or proof. I have trust in people here that you do not. I'm not an engineer, I'm not a writer (we all know that one) I put trust in the backgrounds of certain individuals on this thread. what they do outside of this thread is not my concern. (insert your filthy comment plug) you have to look at certain points in this case. lots of troubled area's that need attention. the flight path is one. we have the FBI on record confirming this. I can't prove where the plane was, nor can I agree that it flew over Tina Bar. not until I see more evidence. by pouncing on someone trying to prove something is uncalled for and shows how narrow minded you really are. this is something that doesn't happen over nite. most of us like to check all the angles and look for flaws before presenting something. you should try it? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

that is there markings of the search area jo. I only added the words Lake Merwin and an arrow pointing. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Blevins, here is a rule from Logic 101: If you cannot find Cooper in the area where he ABSOLUTELY HAS TO BE, in your opinion, then it is time to start looking for him in the area where he ABSOLUTELY CANNOT BE, in your opinion. I forget the details but, if I remember correctly, some wise man once remarked about the mentality of an individual who keeps hitting his head against a wall while expecting a different outcome from the next bang. Do you know the source of that saying? Robert99 If you look at this photo provided you can clearly see the area's they searched. for someone to know exactly where he jumped, they sure did spread out! the last time I checked the FBI has never said where he jumped, I believe they stick to the line of....."this is where we think he jumped" also take note of the position of the flight path, if that is what it is on search area 1 & 3??? In this video Agent Carr specifically says "the believed flight path was" admitting it could be wrong. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwI7ITDoeS8 "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

"Robert99 made a reference back there about how 'people are soon going to be up to their knees in (something) which probably means BS" "This is getting old, kind of like Skyjack71's promises of Big Revelations." You didn't really have to come out and say it though did ya? what does the term BS in your comment apply to? as I told you before. take care of your own problems before you go assuming anything else. try that out for starters. when you rush things you end up with constantly changing things like books, websites etc. Reality Hotel thingy "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

"This is getting old, kind of like Skyjack71's promises of Big Revelations." what's really getting old is the fact of you not understanding things take time. that's what's getting old. would you like people to rush you during your half ass research on Kenny? it's only happened because of all the error's you did by not taking the time to check and validate!! most people don't work like you do by taking the word of other people and adding all sorts of things to it. now, since it's taking Robert99 time to put things together you want to call it BS? you have no clue what you are talking about other than what you read, then you want to put your expert opinion in on it. that's fine, but you can't back up what your talking about simply by a copy/paste of what someone else said. that hardly makes it true. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Immediately goes from Cooper subjects to Blevins...almost every time Blevins posts. LOL. Robert99 made a reference back there about how 'people are soon going to be up to their knees in (something) which probably means BS. That's like the fifth or sixth time he's promised A Big Revelation That Will Change Everything. ('Just you wait, son!') I imagine the subject will be how the FBI, radar, ATC, chase jets, and the NWA were all wrong and how he is right...and that's how the money got to Tina Bar, etc. This is getting old, kind of like Skyjack71's promises of Big Revelations. Just saying. I have a few revelations of my own for later in the year, but they aren't 'big' and they don't prove Kenny Christiansen was Cooper. So don't sweat it. I get tired of discussing him anyway. Get enough of that in my email box. Robert, can you please show use where Robert99 promised "A Big Revelation" ? can you provide the post? This will also be like the fifth or sixth time having to remind you about your website being full of error's. you know like the one's you keep trying to say everyone else does? failure to notice that some things other than changing things on a website so they are true and honest take more time. you wouldn't know that since you always assume or take the word from somebody else. one of your "revelations" will be revealed a lot sooner than you think since you never want to talk about Kenny (*eye's roll*) once you show this thread you actually researched things about Kenny's background and the people claiming things about him, you might get some credibility! Verification can't be replaced by assuming. you assume Geestman's sister got a $5,000 loan from Kenny to purchase a home. I'm guessing you checked the property records to VERIFY that she bought a house in 1972? is that why it took Kenny almost 20 years to pay off a $7,000 loan of his own? I guess I'll do some of my own assuming here. sisnce you only have a part time job in the evenings, I'm assuming you are overloaded with this part time job that keeps you from taking the time to CORRECT the ERROR'S that put more myths about this case into hundreds of uninformed viewers of your site (BS) but I'll assume it's true. then again you did tell us about one of your emails, a little kid you thought was Jo. more assuming again (*laughs*) I'm assuming again (just taking after you) that you probably don't want to change the site because it may show some over reaction. Clean up your act dude. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

you also stated lot's of things Jerry said, or at least what you posted he said. here is his response to knowing you. Jerry Thomas: I'll respond by saying thank you for welcoming me back.One post ask how well I knew Paul G. Fact is I've only talked to him over the phone. I do not agree with his findings. He has made many false statements in reference to this case and what, not only I have said, but also what Brian Ingram has said.He is just like Jo Weber or Blevens in that respect.If it does not come from me personally it is not true. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

look at his profile pic Jo..... "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

"If it takes 30 minutes to down load a site - you just go on by. It was not this bad in 2000 when I first got a computer - I thought it was fast...but programs changed and my computer is old and I have dial up - things take forever to come up. Some sites pop easy and some never POP. After 10 or 15 minute I just pass on by and ask someone else to do it." Jo, your "puter" is probably jammed up with cookies. that's why it's running extra slow, even with dial up. there are many simple things you could do to make life easier. free programs to open PDF's, flash player so you can watch video's, and yes on dial up. as for the tower/Vor experiment. you have to admit that's pretty far fetched that you could do that. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Its fun to speculate what "accessories" Cooper might have employed, e.g. brown contact lenses, radios, VOR detecting vibrating corset stays, etc, but he probably had nothing, not even an altimeter. I do wonder why Cooper spent such a long time in the aft rest room. My fantasy is that he was taking out his brown contact lenses pre jump and dropped one. It can take a long time to find such an item. 377 possibly feared being shot while sitting in a seat or anywhere exposed in the plane while it was on the ground? was this during the transfers of the chute & money? This would have been funny to pull on Cooper. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VgaahBvqj-8 "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

check out this watch...... http://www.ablogtowatch.com/citizen-eco-drive-chrono-time-at-watches/ "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

It's a shame this has to go on. it's really hard not to confront the problems he has. including what he calls evidence and what he sent the FBI. that PDF alone should turn there detector's away from KC. personally I would pull everything off the web and start over. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Robert, your PDF with the "filthy" comments is really, really getting old. do us all a favor and put the link to it down in your signature box. yes people make mistakes when researching things. the problem with you is the fact of not wanting to admit them. you website if still showing flaws and you know it. if you did care the website and PDF would not have the error's in them. so stop playing the "people make mistakes" card. I thought a Cooper nut was dangerous? now you are claiming if someone uses an alias and talks smut they are dangerous? Reality Hotel thingy rings a bell. you seem to be the only one DEEPLY concerned about those comments. personally I think it's a problem with yourself having a hard time accepting the fact that they are about you. someone used my name, Whoopty Freakin Do! you think it's some sort of Holy Grail bringing this up over, and over, and over again. Reality you always say? well this thread stops in it's tracks every single time you post. people constantly have to correct or argue page after page with you causing the thread to revolve around you. you fail to notice you lack a lot of common sense and logically thinking when it comes to many of your responses. Final note. yes you have every right to talk about your suspect, but, you have a lot of work to do in order to set the record straight on what is fact and what is flawed. your first move should be fixing your website you claimed you would do over 3 weeks ago........ "Some posts were traced to current posters at Dropzone. I made PDF's of the comments." posters? not singular meaning Georger? who is the other person or persons. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

I mentioned a couple days ago I sent away for the information. this was not from you telling me either. looks like I will beat your deadline. "looks like he paid half" that doesn't sound convincing. I doubt Kenny replaced the countertop. resurfaced is the word. no reason to pull the wood off unless it was damaged which again is doubtful. countertops (wood portion) last years and years and years. I ask questions because I like to get to the bottom of things. you on the other hand like to amplify things that are small or irrelevant. just like giving zero reasons why Kenny had so much money towards the end of his life. we know different from records you failed to research that give a very plausible explanation as to why he had so much money. you are very similar to a guy I work with. he takes the best case and runs with it as well as the worse case, nothing in between. you a Jo share this similarity with the "he could have" scenario. or the "you can't prove he wasn't Cooper" thingy. then topping it off with the "you don't want to find the truth" thingy.... it's obvious you don't know the extent of Kenny's finances, and you struggle with what people told you as truth. you sent the FBI information that is flawed showing them exactly how not to investigate someones background. you have multiple people verifying this other than just me. Good Nite "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Jo, I hope you realize a glitch in a electrical grid is usually caused by an overload. we see this in Florida often when everyone turns the A/C on. I 'm not sure what you are trying to prove here. I don't see where someone would lose there job over a glitch. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Robert, the stairs have railing on them. with a wind load on the stairs they are not going to drop very fast. how would you not stand a chance of tripping going backwards? the stairs will not fully extend with a wind load on them. you assume too much. you assumed Kenny paid cash for his house. you assumed Kenny paid $10 for a piece of property you assumed the piece of wood in the attic was built by Kenny. you assumed the apartment complex just a couple years old was a flea bag resort. you assumed there is no reason Kenny should have almost 200 grand in the bank when he died. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Robert, why are you continuing to be stuck on the stairs opening at 24-36 inches. this makes no difference in how he jumped. that is what the position of the stairs were before any weight was on it. your pictures are not showing anything to do with having gear below you while you jump. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

I was totally expecting this to be the watch in question... I think it was this one "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

How do I find if this watch is 1970 or 1971? I have been searching but found nothing. If it was valuable surely it was reported stolen. try here Jo http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&rt=nc&_nkw=1970+Girard+perregaux+Watch "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

I thought Duane built the dam? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Georger - I have been trying for yrs to understand this. NO one has shared any information with me. I have stressed the importance of the Gyro and the quartz watch for yrs...but never understood it could possibly have any meaning until I found out 3 wks ago that 3 dams controled the grids thur a microwave signal. ONly then did this start to make some kind of sense...but I still do NOT know what, just that it was important and Duane had told me about the microwave controls at the dams. NOTE: He had pointed out every tower in the area - fire and warning and others - so why would I think this was any different? NOT until 3 wks ago. I still do NOT understand what it means other than the skyjacker or someone on the ground had a way of communicating and/or knowning their location. well then you have surpassed (once again) all expectations. Duane was at buDop in '69 ... and now Duane has watches which 'ping-start-stop' as 305 circuits any VOR along V23. That's not a bad catch for somebody who doesn't understand it ... who cannot post pictures but then posts pictures ... who does not understand but knows everything ... is your house haunted? with any luck maybe I can find an island to go to to get far away from .... Cooperland! and she manages to get this information out to the public before the FBI/CIA poof's her posts Inspector Gadget/Weber....I have more info, but I fear it going poof. I gotta go, I just heard a noise outside!! if I fail to return. call the Pentagon and tell them Shutter45 code V23 -305, they will know what to do.....over? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI