Robert99

Farflung, Thanks for the information. It looks like LaPoint had exits available that would fit all possible theories. Also, maybe I can't remember what I just had for breakfast, but I think the chase aircraft were F-111s. Their use had been arranged due to their range and electronic capabilities. Robert Nicholson

Georger I love it when you are Walking Tall - that has to get someone's attention. I do NOT know who Robert 99 is - but he is a obstinate know it all who quotes what others have said in books and articles. He never admits that he could be wrong when he is only using what others have written - note I did not say researched. I had a long talk tonight with a friend in WA. and this whole group of individuals know the Plane WAS NOT West of the PDX and that the plane was EAST of I-5 and East of Vancouver. There are individuals in the Battleground, Heisson and Orchards (all over 70) who still remember the night the plane came over. The FBI tried to bury Cooper in 1980 after the money find - with the speculation the plane was on a more Westwardly route. Bury Cooper in Myths - so we can bury him forever - seemed to be the mentality of the FBI in 1980. The map this thread is using that shows the curve of the planes' route turning East just above Vancouver is wrong. That curve happened AFTER the plane crossed the Columbia. Take a piece of clear plastic and draw the marks as the come down and all of those dots. 2005, 2010 etc. Now slide that piece of plastic down on the map and you have a more accurate route. There is still something wrong with those markings after the plane crossed the Columbia because this is when the plane set course along I-5 South. I don't care who made or marked that map or what technolgy they were using - it was ONE person and that person made a mistake in some co-ordinates. One of the DZ's individuals was kind enough to send me the map use in the thread. The pilot I spoke to said there is NOT enough information in the transcripts I found and this particular map is NOT the proper map to use. Seems he has been unable to locate a 1970 navigational map used by Delta during that time period....the Navigational maps of 1968 - 1970 are the maps that need to be used. The transcipts should be used on those MAPS only. You can NOT apply information or knowledge or name changes that were transitional to the transcripts. If there are any commercial pilots out there who kept their old navigations maps of the area - we need them....these maps need to be PRE - 1970. We only need to borrow them and they will be returned un-harmed or they can be reproduced for us and shipped at my at my expense. We also need the exact trascripts between plane and communications - it is my understand that some of these communications are MISSING. Did anyone ever suspect for one moment this was deliberate? HOW many minutes are missing in the communications and what was the given location when that happened? I know Robt99 has ALL the answers. He actually has NONE...other than repeating like a parrot - what was in this book or that book. FACTS - and MAPS. This is what we need - the dead-line is just ahead of us. This will NOT continue after Nov.24 2011, so it is now or Never. Who really really wants to solve this case and/or put some of they myths in the graveyard where they belong? Pehaps the biggest clue of all is already in a graveyard in WA. Jo, Unlike you, I do know who Robert99 is. He is a fellow who dislikes to see attempts to pass off utter nonsense as facts. Here are just a select sample from your post. 1. "The FBI tried to bury Cooper in 1980 after the money find - with the speculation the airplane was on a more Westardly route. Bury Cooper in myths - so we can bury him forever - seemed to be the mentality of the FBI in 1980." In reality, in 1980 the FBI speculated that the airliner was on a more Easterly route than they originally thought in 1971. That is the direct opposite of what you are now suggesting. 2. It is a direct violation of the Federal Air Regulations for pilots to use maps that are out of date. The maps that pilots use must be valid for the day they are flying. This means that the maps the airliner's flight crew was using had to be valid on November 24, 1971. This is a simple fact known to all pilots. And these maps are changed on a regular basis which varies from 60 days to once a year. 3. If you have been paying attention to this thread over the past couple of years, then you know the problems with one specific set of the air traffic control transcripts. In fact, I think you and I have exchanged posts on this very subject. Robert99 tells me that he did not copy any of the above from books but did all the original research himself. The mystery of who is Robert99 may soon overtake the mystery of who was D. B. Cooper. Robert Nicholson

Farflung, Oddly enough, I have not been able to find a mention of the means LaPoint used to exit the Hughes DC-9. None of the articles that I can find online about that incident mention it. Regardless of the reasons, Cooper did have problems getting the stairs down. On the matter of the parachutes, pages 30-32 of Tosaw's book describes Cooper's examination of the parachutes before take off with Tina standing beside him. Tina stated that Cooper took out the packing card and examined it. She also stated that Cooper put on the military style parachute and adjusted the straps in a manner that led her to believe it was an everday occurrence for him. I don't have any personal experience using airline type Interphone systems. However, based on my personal experience in general aviation type aircraft, yelling in the face of chicks does not particularly impress them, at least in a favorable manner. I am in complete agreement with you on your last paragraph. Robert Nicholson

Farflung, You are correct, of course. Cooper did some redundant things as you say. In my humble opinion (forgive me Jo), Cooper appeared to have some specific KNOWLEDGE of the 727 systems but didn't seem to have any appreciable EXPERIENCE with those systems. At least in part, this could have been determined from the aircraft manuals as you say. But how did Cooper know that the rear stairs could be lowered in flight in the first place? As I understand it, the 727 was the only airliner in use in the USA in 1971 where that could be done. It would seem from this that Cooper had some knowledge of the Boeing/CIA/Special Operations testing and/or operations in southeast Asia. Remember that Cooper specifically asked the agent that he bought the ticket from if the inbound aircraft was a 727 and was informed that it was (no aircraft substitutions that day). Why did he ask for the landing gear to be kept down? That may have a simple answer. Perhaps Cooper felt that keeping the gear down would insure that the aircraft would be kept at a reasonably low speed. Maybe the flaps could have been retracted without him noticing it, but the sound of the landing gear going into the wheel wells would probably have gotten his attention. I don't know if any of the leading edge devices would be automatically deployed with 15 degrees of flaps. Perhaps the outboard slats would have been but I kinda doubt if the Krueger flaps would have. If I recall my days of riding as a passenger on 727s correctly, the outboard leading edge slats were the last or among the very last things to be retracted. And this didn't happen until the pilot had completed the initial climb out from the airport and was interested in increasing the speed and getting above 10,000 feet and into 250+ knot territory. This may or may not have something to do with the 170 KIAS that Cooper specified. Robert Nicholson

Farflung, the book by Tosaw discusses the interaction between Cooper and Tina in the most detail. Cooper specified that the airplane was not to be pressurized, he gave a specific flap setting and airspeed, and climb to altitude. He also said to open the stairs (to some extent) before take off. Rataczak argued with Cooper that the airplane could not taken off with the stairs even partially down. Finally, Cooper agreed to have the stairs locked up before take off. But he immediately told Tina that he knew the airliner could take off with the stairs down. When Cooper had trouble getting the stairs down, either he or the flight crew suggested leveling off at 7000 feet and slowing the airplane down. If I remember correctly, Rataczak slowed the aircraft to about 140 knots indicated airspeed. Why would Cooper have trouble lowering the stairs? The stair control panel on this specific airliner may have been different from any that Cooper had encountered before, such as in special operations. So this may have been a new panel for him and he even had trouble following Tina's instructions. Robert Nicholson

Ralph and the helo were all ocver the place, flrew north 20 miles or more... so Ralph's report applies to where? I dunno. His report cannot apply to PDX. Attached is the hourly record for PDX on 24 Nov 71. Ckret's report conflicts with Ralph's report? Maybe not. Who knows "where" Ralph is talking about. He may be speaking about what it was like 20 miles north of PDX-VCR ? And no report to date specifies what conditions were like above 5000 feet. It is those conditions which bear directly on what Cooper could see or not see from Malay south. (*I know where the winds aloft records are but I have never been able to pry them lose from the beaurocrats who have them ... ) There is one interesting aspect of the hourly records below, however. That is the shifts in wind direction which were happening that day almost hourly ... from SE to SSW to SW and back again. These are surface wind records. We still have no data whatver about winds aloft above 5000 feet. That data is crucial to this case. Who cxares what the surface winds were doing! It is the winds aloft which have always been crucial to this case and for that we have nothing. Georger, The quote in Nuttall's book applies to the Portland/Vancouver "metropolitian" area. That is, the built up area that had houses, other buildings, and lights in those two cities. The quote in Nuttall's book only addresses the fact that there was a dense cloud cover and overcast that prevented the airliner, flying at about 10,000 feet, from even seeing a "cloud glow" from those two cities. The ground conditions are meaningless in this case. However, the cloud layers, or sky cover, reported in Ckret's information and elsewhere are meaningful. As recently discussed in other posts, Ckret is saying that there was an overcast at 5000 feet and a broken cloud layer (which in this case qualifies as a "ceiling") at 3500 feet above sea level. As Georger also states, there is apparently no information in circulation at this point that discusses the cloud information between 5000 and 10,000 feet. I think I have seen some winds aloft for the lower altitudes that was put out by Ckret. However, at 10,000 feet the wind was about 25-30 knots from the southwest (or 225 degrees true). If you can obtain better winds aloft information, please post it. Robert Nicholson

That is NOT what I said and nor does anything Sluggo say impede me in anyway. I don't have time for the likes of you. I have MORE important things to do rather than answer you stupid retoric...which by the way GOES no where and for which YOU have NO proof. It is all just YOUR opinion and how is one to know what COLORS your opinion? Maybe money - a pay-off to distract the thread and the public. End of Conversation. Jo, You don't have time for me? We must have exchanged 20 e-mails just within the last week. Proof? Where is your proof? Me distract this thread? You are just being devious. Money? A payoff? I must have missed that memo, please resend. Robert Nicholson

In November 2009, I made it a point to be in the Portland/Vancouver area so I could see the actual weather for myself. It rained off and on all day ever day and was very similiar to the weather described for the day of the hi-jacking in 1971. Robert Nicholson

Robt you seemingly have a answer for everything, but you have never talked to the major players who were on that plane. 1 minute or 2 minutes differance in time does change where the plane is at a given time - it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out. What is points are used to map the route also make a difference. I was told by a major player that the plane crossed the Columbia between Vancouver and Cames. There was more conversation about Troutdale airport and the altitude from plane to ground was low. I do not "get" all the technical terms. Without telling you where this came from consider: 1. Search and rescue capabilities. 2. Do no harm (this means going around the heavily populated areas because there is a BOMB on board. 3. Has Cooper left the plane? The route proposed by this thread is off because I know the plane crossed the Columbia between Vancouver and Cames and I will never forget who told me this and when. This person had NO reason to lie to me and this person knew where the plane was. Troutdale Industrial was mentioned during this same conversation. Portland DID NOT want the plane flying overhead with a bomb. If you knew there was a bomb on a plane - would you allow it to fly over populated areas unless you could be reasonably assured Cooper and the Bomb were gone? Go in low and hope he jumps. I believe from the sitings this is exactly what happened. Jo, On the matter of time, the cockpit crew could glance at the clock, see that it reads time X, and then get on the radio and tell everyone that we felt a pressure bump from the stairs at time X. No adjustments to the time are need for a delay in making the radio call. Even a real estate agent should be able to figure that out. "Go in low and hope he jumps." Cooper told the crew to fly at 10,000 feet and they did, or very close to it, all the way from north of the Mayfield Intersection to the Reno area. The flight crew always reported their altitude as 10,000 feet until they got to northern California where they climbed to 11,000 feet to get over the mountains to Reno. The matter of not flying over populated areas with a bomb on board was discussed by the crew even before they took off from Seattle. Rataczak suggested that they get above the overcast and then head out over the Pacific ocean. As they were approaching the Portland area they were on the west side of Portland and that would be the logical side to bypass Portland. It doesn't make sense to fly an additional number of miles just to pass on the east side of Portland. On your other information, you have more "secrets" and undercover contacts than Wiki-leaks. Robert Nicholson

Jo, Let me repeat some information for you for about the 10th time. 1. The visibility from Seattle to Oregon? You already know the ground visibility at Seattle and at Portland. It is reasonable to assume that the ground visibility at points on V-23 between Seattle and Portland would be about the same. That is, about 10+ miles, which is a good visibility in that part of the country. 2. What did the pilot see? Probably a lot of clouds, maybe some stars, perhaps some rain, maybe some lights on the ground as he was climbing out of Seattle, and a lot of lights on his instrument panel. And that is no joke. 3. What was the lowest altitude and at what point did that occur? If you define altitude as height above ground, the lowest altitude would be zero in Seattle and Reno. If you define altitude as height above sea level, the lowest altitude would be 433 feet which is the official elevation of the Seattle airport. The Seattle airport is north and east of both the Battleground VORTAC and Lake Merwin. Further east of what when they approach[ed] Lake Merwin? "(Robert your accounting DOES not agree with what I was told yrs ago by SOMEONE who knows)" What are you talking about? My accounting of what? I am glad that 'SOMEONE" knows. In fact, I have always wanted to meet "SOMEONE" (or ANYONE) who knows. Can you arrange such a meeting? 4. The time of the bump could easily be viewed on the cockpit clock. If it was relayed, it would be a stated clock time and a relay time would not be relevant. Typically, in that day and age, a control tower or other such facility would tell the crew the time (so they could adjust their clock) as hours, minutes, and quarter minutes. But the most accurates times of all are those in the ATC radio transcripts and they are accurate to the second (or very close to it). 5. Can you give a single reason why the plane would be east of the Portland PDX when it crossed the Columbia? It makes no difference if you are referring to the present day BTG VORTAC or the Portland airport. Why would the aircraft add a number of miles to its flight path to go east of Portland, and interfere with traffic on two or three other Victor airways, when it could take a simple track on the west side of Portland? Honored to be of service. Robert Nicholson

Mr. Nicholson - I am NOT playing a health card. I had surgery nine weeks ago and tomorrow I have the first of many appts to address the other problem. The surgery is so specific - I have been told it cannot be done by any Surgeon in our area - that is a large area. So I guess I just played a Flush. By the way I am not a "Darling". That is a bird and if you are going to compare me to an animal use a stalker. You will have to discuss your question with Sluggo outside of the thread - I am sure he will have an answer for you. Part of this has to do with his over sensitive reaction to some things I say and his virtual down play of important factors because "he" doesn't think they mean anything. Sluggo has been an immense value to me in helping me to gather information and maps and for that I am forever grateful. I like Sluggo. Personality wise - Sluggo and I -CLASH, I get mixed emotions about what he is thinking or saying. He is a VERY nice and intelligent person and tries to be objective - but, like myself he lets too much of his own feelings get in the way. Two such individuals in one room is chaos along with intolerance and that is NOT productive. Sluggo is a very very intelligent man, but if someone is super sensitive - they just cannot be around me for very long - because I will say and do what I have to do and I do NOT want to have to be on guard about choosing my words or saying what I have to say. I have a job to complete and I can't worry about hurting someone elses feelings. His knowledge of the case is surpassed by only one other individual I know and have met. Jo, Thank you for the explanation. As I understand it, you are saying that Sluggo cannot be manipulated and that, in turn, impedes the progress of your Mission on this planet. Robert Nicholson

Jo, YOU ARE MAKING CLAIMS THAT I DID NOT MAKE! 1. The weather from Seattle to Portland was not socked in. At take off from Seattle, the ground visibility was about 15 miles with light rain showers in the area. I do not know what the cloud or sky cover information was. The Portland ground visibility was about 10-15 miles at the time the airliner flew through that area. The area probably had light rain showers at ground level also (the information is not complete). Ckret's information is the only known sky cover information. 2. I am not aware of anyone making the statement you claim here. Where did this come from? 3. The cloud coverage south of Portland is not relevant to Cooper's jump since he jumped before the airliner got to Portland. 4. Cooper told the flight crew to climb to 10,000 after take off from Seattle. They had to level off and slow down at 7000 feet so that Cooper could get the stairs down. I have no idea where the rest of your allegations came from. In actual fact, the airliner reported it was level at 10,000 feet at 7:53:34 PM PST and it was still north of the Mayfield (now Malay) intersection at that point. That intersection is 41 nautical miles north of the present day BTG VORTAC and a long way north of the Columbia River. There is no record of the airliner descending to 6300 feet after reaching 10,000 feet until it was landing in Reno. 5. You didn't get this information from me or from anyone I know. What is your source for it? It doesn't make any difference if the co-pilot was new to the route. All the co-pilot was doing was keeping the needles on his instrument panel where they should be. It's as simple as that. Jo, If you want to be factual then stop fabricating statements. Robert Nicholson

Jo, Is it possible for you to explain exactly what in hell you are talking about? Robert Nicholson

Sailshaw, Cooper had been wearing those sun glasses for about six hours when he jumped. The time required for night adaption for the normal eye is probably not more than about 10 minutes, based on my personal experience. I would suggest that Cooper's wearing the sun glasses had more to do with concealing his identity than anything else. Do you seriously think that Cooper would dally on the stairs for several minutes? It was quite chilly on those stairs and a bit breezy as well since the airliner was going about 224 MPH at the time of the jump. I doubt if Cooper was interested in freezing his rear end off. So you think I made a little joke? Modesty panels or not, basically the only way for Cooper to exit was straight down those stairs. If he had tried to jump from a point up the stairs there is a very real possibility that the stairs would have moved upward and slammed him against the fuselage/stairs interface and he wouldn't like that. So the only sensible thing to do would be to take one more step than there were steps on the stairs. While I appreciate your efforts as a True Believer to sell the "cloud glow" story, if Cooper wanted to land near the Portland airport (as you claim) he would need something more accurate than "cloud glow" to spot his jump point. You are assuming also that the airliner passed close to the Portland airport. What is your basis for that assumption? If I remember correctly, Amazon previously made some offers to you about helping you arrange for a parachute jump to help educate you on parachuting. My suggestion is that you take her advice. Robert Nicholson

Jo, you write: "Sluggo is NOT acceptable because he is too bias[ed] - both pro and con." Jo, darling, I am not going to play the health card like a certain person has been doing for the past year on this thread. However, I am getting along in years and probably have lost some brain cells along the way. Nevertheless, you have aroused my morbid curiosity. Would/Could you explain the logic, if any, in the statement quoted above about Sluggo? And in plain language please. I'll be forever grateful. Robert Nicholson

Georger then states: Georger Thank you for being such a detailed researcher of records. With NO knowledge of the technical aspects of the door opening - my simple mind says they had to take the altitude down so the door could open. All of this 10,000 (that is the point at which Oxygen becomes questionable). Why Cooper demanded they stay below 10,000 - not at 10,000. Duane showed me the over-head oxygen tanks on one of our flights - I wondered how he knew this, but in those days I had NO knowledge of Cooper other than the trip to WA and knew NO details about the crime when I called the FBI in 1996. I have had quiet an education in these past 15 yrs - but retaining some of the details to defend my story are difficult for me. Thank You for a post that gave me a "memory charge" regarding things I told the FBI.

Ckret's report: (The weather: Ceiling of 5,000 feet, broken clouds at 3,500, scattered clouds at 1,500. Winds of 12 to 14 knots, light rain showers. ) So where are the reports above 5000 ft? The crew report? Georger, There is some confusion in the wording as used in Ckret's report. I'll discuss that below but first I must make a disclaimer for Jo's sake: Jo, I have not personally interviewed the weathermen who produced the weather report Ckret provided, I have not personally interviewed Ckret, I have not personally interviewed Himmelsbach or Rataczak or Dr. Hawking or Bozo the Clown. So you will probably discount all of the following. Now back to business. The FAA Handbook of Aeronautical Knowledge defines sky cover as follows: 1. Less than 1/8 sky cover is defined as "scattered, clear or few". [In my experience it is usually called "clear".] 2. From 1/8 to 2/8 sky cover is defined as "few". 3. From 3/8 to 4/8 sky cover is defined as "scattered". 4. From 5/8 to 7/8 sky cover is defined as "broken". 5. A 8/8 sky cover is defined as "overcast". 6. "Ceiling" is defined as the height above the earth's surface of the lowest layer of clouds, which is reported as "broken" or "overcast", or the vertical visibility into an obscuration. Using these definitions, the "broken" clouds that Ckret reports at 3500 feet would be the "ceiling". And the "ceiling" that Ckret reports at 5000 feet would probably be listed as an "overcast". If the weather information was available above 5000 feet, it was probably not reported by Ckret since Cooper would not be able to see the ground until he was below 5000 feet or maybe even below 3500 feet. Overall, the cloud cover was not good for spotting a parachute jump from 10,000 feet. Robert Nicholson

Sailshaw, It is very simple. Cooper would know to jump when he got to the end of the steps. He wouldn't try to jump from half-way up the steps. So when he got to the end of the steps there was only one thing left to do. Jump! Of course, Cooper didn't know exactly where he was geographically. Maybe to within 20 or 30 miles. Robert Nicholson Im going to stick my neck out and ask: "how does he know anything ... to within 20 or 30 miles ... IF he literally does not know anything" ? Anything is anything! (or, does anything actually escape from a black hole? Do black holes eventuallycollapse? Hawking says they do.) Georger, I'll yield the points to both you and Dr. Hawking. What I was trying to say is that Cooper didn't know precisely where the aircraft was and didn't have any means to determine its position with any degree of accuracy. So when he jumped, with the weather being what it was, it was basically just a matter of walking down to the last step on the stairs and then taking another step. No need to hang around hoping that he could spot something familiar through a break in the clouds. And Cooper could only hope that there was solid ground down there somewhere and not the Pacific Ocean as Rataczak had suggested. Himmelsbach was right in saying that Cooper had guts. That jump was a leap of faith in more ways than one. Robert Nicholson

Sailshaw, It is very simple. Cooper would know to jump when he got to the end of the steps. He wouldn't try to jump from half-way up the steps. So when he got to the end of the steps there was only one thing left to do. Jump! Of course, Cooper didn't know exactly where he was geographically. Maybe to within 20 or 30 miles. Robert Nicholson

I think Rataczak's made it pretty clear that the crew knew where they were at any given time during the flight. Airliners didn't just fly blind because there were clouds hanging around. Not generally. He's also been insistent on that they knew when Cooper jumped. Rataczak lays out the scenario clearly: 1) Airstairs open. Crew feels pressure bump in ears. Indicator light comes on showing door is now open in flight. 2) A short time later, less than two minutes at most, crew feels the plane bounce. 3) At the same time, the indicator light goes OFF for a second, and then comes back on for good, staying on for the remainder of the flight to Reno. 4) The indicator light came back on because when Cooper jumped, the stairs rebounded back to an almost-closed position for a second (light goes off), and then settled back down (light comes back on). Were they over Vancouver, or the Columbia River? Absolutely not. My information says at LEAST 8 and maybe 10 minutes of flying time north of Vancouver. This translates (@196mph) into between 24 and 32 miles north of Vancouver. This would put them in the area between the Merwin Lake Dam and a few miles south of that point. Not coincidentally...the place they also found the parachute, which STILL has not been explained to my satisfaction. I know some of you are accepting the FBI and Cossey's explanation on that one. No problem. I just don't agree. Mr. Blevins, After the airliner took off from Seattle, do you know the time (which is in the transcripts) and the approximate location of the aircraft when it reached 10,000 feet? The target cruise speed after reaching 10,000 feet was 170 Knots (don't confuse with MPH) Indicated Airspeed which translates to about 195 Knots True Airspeed. (That is about 224 MPH.) Or to put it another way, in level flight the airliner had a target speed of about 3.25 nautical miles per minute through the air mass. The ground speed is something else and to obtain it the true airspeed must be adjusted for the wind speed and direction. Mr. Blevins, what is your estimate of the wind speed and direction? What is your estimate of the ground speed? Do you have an estimate for the time of the jump? Do you have an estimate for the location of the jump? Does the sequence of the lights in the cockpit related to the air stairs provide a time for the jump? Probably. Do the lights provide a location for the jump? If you think so please explain your rationale. You estimate that the jump took place about 24 to 32 statute (?) miles north of Vancouver (what is now the Battleground VORTAC?). Assuming these assumptions are correct, that translates to about 21 to 28 nautical miles north of the present day Battleground VORTAC and presumably on or near the centerline of V-23. If Rataczak had one VOR and one DME tuned to what is now the BTG VORTAC, he could have instantly read them and that would have given a position for the jump that is as accurate as anything in the present day records. Did he do so? He apparently didn't. So the estimated location of the jump has to be made based on the estimated flight path and the estimated position of the airliner along that flight path. From the Seattle VORTAC to the current day Battleground VORTAC, is 105 nautical miles. The airliner probably passed within 1000 feet laterally of the Seattle VORTAC about the same time it rotated for take off. Using the previous estimate (converted to nautical miles) of 21 to 28 nautical miles north of the BTG VORTAC, leaves 77 to 84 nautical miles that the airliner must travel from Seattle to reach the area you have specified. Would you care to estimate the time the airliner arrived in the area you specified? Does this agree with what Rataczak said about the jump time? I look forward to your response. For your information, a number of calculations along the above line have already been made and I'm sure you can easily locate them. Good Luck! Robert Nicholson

Sailshaw, Your idea that aircraft can navigate accurately using "cloud glow", even when it is reportedly not visible, is very interesting. However, the hijacked airliner had at least two VORTAC receivers and two ADF receivers which I suspect are a lot more accurate than "cloud glow". This statement is just based on my personal experience among other things. It seems to be a case of you against the world as to whether or not Cooper knew his location when he jumped or had any means to determine his location. You are free to believe anything you want, but not all theories are created equal. Robert Nicholson

Jo, Something obviously happened to you today. Why don't you get some sleep tonight and tell us about it tomorrow. It is now after 4:00 AM in Florida. Robert Nicholson

Jo, Maybe you don't remember me but we exchanged PMs in December, January, February, and as recently as June 9th. These exchanges were initiated by you. You "memory" of me, or wild imaginations about me, seems to be working great this evening. One last comment, in the Portland area I only used one weather report and it covered the entire day. I didn't shop around looking for a weather report to support a particular scenario. Just the facts. Robert Nicholson

Since Jo is making allegations faster than I can read them, I'll use this means to answer some of them. First, contrary to Jo's claims, I do not believe the FBI maps giving the flight path (those that were provided to Sluggo by the FBI) are correct in the Portland area. I have so stated on this thread and elsewhere. Consequently, I must deny any efforts to make anyone believe they were created by the Almighty. Second, I did inform Airtwardo that there were published accounts stating that the cloud cover over Portland was so dense that even the glow from the city lights was not visible. I don't believe that constitutes telling him that he didn't have a clue. I haven't heard anything from a reliable source about Airtwardo being offended. Third, Jo has claimed that I am not a "skyjumper", and presumably never was. Sailshaw has claimed that I am not a pilot, and presumably never was, and, in addition, Sailshaw claims that I have never flown at night. These claims are pure BS and are only evidence that both Jo and Sailshaw don't know how to do their homework. Fourth, did I run all the knowledgeable and experienced people off the thread? How can anyone reply to such a claim as that? Fifth, I have never claimed to own this thread. And I most certainly don't own it. Sixth, just another day at the office with Jo. Seventh, I am beginning to look at Duane in a new light. Cheers. Robert Nicholson

ROBERT STOP THIS! WHAT QUALIFIES YOU TO DISPUTE THINGS THE SKYJUMPErS TRY TO TELL YOU AND WHAT THEY STATE! WHY WOULD YOU USE WEATHER INFORMATION PUBLISHED IN SOME OF THE BOOKS? DO YOUR DAMN RESEARCH AND YOU WILL FIND WHAT HAS BEEN STATED IS NOT TRUE! Sorry, but I got a big job to finish in the next few wks and the above is typical of why the case has never been solved. Who said what - what got his information from whom! There are ACTUAL RECORDS use those if you want to be the big wheel and the know-it-all. STOP stating that this was published or thatr was said - FIND the ACTUAL weather reports for all areas. GO talk to the only real witness who can give you the answers - personally. ALL you are doing is mudding the water with what someone else said in a book - what about actual reports. Use actual reports or forget this and stop wasting the time of those who really want to solve this and stop making mud cakes. What QUALIFIES you to dispute the word of the skyjumpers who did this during the war and those who do it recreationally. Jo, What in hell are you talking about?!! If you had done your own "damn research" you would know the answer to your own question! Basically, you are asking why I dared to offer some additional weather information to Airtwardo to clarify a statement that he had made. The weather information for the night of the jump is a matter of public record and is online. You could find that information yourself if you were interested. If the word of "skyjumpers" must be accepted without reservation, then why are you questioning what I say? Again, you haven't done your homework! Mud cakes? Do you have a recipe? Jo, I realize that your explosion this evening is due to the simple fact that I do not share your belief that Duane Weber was D. B. Cooper. I have previously explained this in PMs to you and elsewhere. Nor do I believe that Salishaw's candidate is viable. Nevertheless, that's the way the ball bounces. Sometimes life can be a real bitch! Best wishes. Robert Nicholson