BruceSmith

uh oh. secret messages. I suspect death threats. If we don't hear from Bruce in a couple days... Quote They ain't got me yet. I had PM'd Jerry asking for Brian Ingram's contact info, which he sent to me today. Brian and I had a delightful, but brief, chat before he put his kids to bed this evening. He said, "no briefcase," as per Dorwin's commentary. Brian and I made a date to talk again soon, after which I will report back.

I wonder how the FBI first ID'd Petey as a suspect? Based on my personal experience in criminal cases it's a mistake to rule out a suspect based on a witness sketch unless there is a HUGE difference. Petey may not be Cooper but he is close enough to the sketch to stay in the suspect pool. 377 I agree. BTW: Petey's clammed up on me again.

Yeah, the transition from the Portland guys to the Seattle guys seems key. The Seattle guys only had one day and found nothing. So they go back to Seattle with a "found nothing" story. I think the transition, plus the early ending due to snow, helped mess things up. This Portland/Seattle split, plus the Himmelsbach era ending in Portland and a new guy starting, almost is a perfect storm for information being lost. The Portland-Seattle split is a very important dynamic in the Cooper case, in my view. Russ Calame, the SAC Salt Lake City who collared McCoy, told me that his dealing were with Seattle - not Portland - and he talked with Seattle "four, five times a day" about the linkage between Cooper and McCoy. Russ told me that the Seattle crew had strong feelings that McCoy was Cooper, and that they felt Russ and his boys were on the right track. Further, Russ told me that Himmelsback entered the picture only in 1976 when he make the grand jury appearance for the John Doe warrant, which saved the case from expiring under statute of limitations regs. Up until then, Portland was not a major player in the Cooper investigation, and Russ inferred that it never was - it only came to a degree of prominence with the grand jury thing and then the money find. When I said to Russ that it seems as though the Seattle office, and by extrapolation the whole Bureau, was content to let Portland become the public face of the Cooper investigation and its agents the main storytellers of the Cooper story, ala Himms, he gave no direct reply. However, his silence suggested to me that I had stumbled upon an important discovery. Oddly, the best view into the Seattle investigation of Cooper is from Calame. There are no documents or pieces of literature that I can find that talk about the activities of Seattle agents, or in particular SAC Seattle Charlie Farrell. Further, Calame retired shortly after McCoy was convicted and the new SAC Salt Lake turned out to be a reportedly worthless hack who let the Cooper-McCoy investigation fade out. If Seattle (or DC and J Edgar) wanted to keep their Cooper investigation secret, shutting down SLC certainly assisted that effort. Then, letting Himms and Portland take center stage helped maintain the diversion of attention, which has continued to this day, except for the actions of Larry

I asked Petey to describe to me what he thought would be the ideal Cooper. He has yet to get back to me...........

I agree. I will have to call. The dredge is one big question. The briefcase is the other. The third is where the h**l are the baggies with all these thousands pieces of Cooper money? I've never seen a pix of the evidentiary collection that displays the shard find. Has anyone else? Thanks for the correction on who the real singer-songwriter is on this thread. Mark Knoefler is one of my favorites.

Quote Notes, Dorwin Schreuder, Interview January 17, 2010 8 pm, Sunday, January 16, 2009 Hi eveyone. I'm making a special guest appearance tonight. 377 emailed me and asked that I talk with retired FBI agent Dorwin Schreuder. Happy to do a littel pinch-hitting from time-to-time. Besides, the Jets just won in San Deigo and I'm feeling happy! In a delightful two-hour phone conversation, I learned that Dorwin Schreuder was the FBI agent who took over the Portland office’s Norjak case from Ralph Himmelsbach when Himms retired in 1979. Dorwin, himself retired since 1993, is an easy-going guy, full of stories, and a true gentleman. He jokingly confessed that his memory is not absolute, and that I had gotten him “cold” and that if he had some time to prepare for an interview he could review his notes and be able to give facts and figures more accurately. However, I didn’t want to take a chance on any filtering of information, so I encourage Dorwin to just travel down Memory Rd and I’d be happy wherever it took us. Here is my report on the interview: Dorwin supervised the evidence retrieval operation at Tina’s Beach, although he was not the first FBI agent to arrive on the scene, which he believes was actually the field office agent from Vancouver, WA. He recalls getting a call to go out to Tina’ Beach and “bring lots of rakes and shovels.” His Portland Public Information Officer (PIO) Billie Williams also called to say that he couldn’t make it to the site to handle the press and asked Dorwin to act as PIO for this portion of the investigation. Dorwin agreed and ultimately became the PIO for the Portland Office. “There were a ton of media out there for days,” Dorwin said, referring to the scene at Tina’s Beach. When they started, they visualized an informal grid pattern, radiating out for twenty yards from where Brian Ingram found the money and all the way down to the water. “We went at it like archeologists,” Dorwin said, explaining that they preferred not using any heavy equipment initially. The usage of backhoes was much later in the retrieval. In that initial search they found “thousands of teeny shards of money the size of a man’s fingernail, up to the size of a silver dollar.” Dorwin said the pieces were well-preserved and layered in clean sand. “No matter how deep we dug we found money – homogeneously mixed to a great depth.” Dorwin said that most agents were digging at a depth of 1.5-2 feet deep and that they dug at least four holes “at least four deep.” He said they found shards in most holes and evenly placed all the way to the depth of four feet. Dorwin also said that the dredger “Bedell” was parked off-shore in the Columbia, and he concluded as self-evident that the money had been shredded by the dredge and thrown up on the beach as part of deposition of material. Outside of the 20-yard circle the shard finds diminished. Then they brought in the backhoes, but did not find any more shards of money. However, Dorwin also said that they found “part of the leather briefcase – enough to contain the bundle that the little boy found (Brian Ingram).” Dorwin continued to talk about the briefcase throughout our conversation, mentioning it several times, and specifically said that the portion they had retrieved was “about a third to half of the briefcase.” At the end of our chat, I asked him if he was sure about the briefcase find, as I had never heard anyone else say that it was part of the findings at Tina’s Beach – or anywhere else. He insisted on his statement. When I told him that I had thought the money was tied up in a cloth satchel from the bank, he paused, and then very soberly said, “Hmmm, you’re beginning to make me doubt myself.” We talked a bit more about this, and Dorwin confirmed that he was not at the site when the briefcase was found, since only the Ingrams were there, but, in addition, he had never actually handled the briefcase – or any of the evidence – at any point in the case. He was a little hazy about the actions of the Seattle office, and when I asked him initially about the activities of the Seattle guys, he said, “Oh, yeah, they were involved,” but when I pressed him on how many, their names, and exactly what they did, he backed off and claimed that maybe it was only the Vancouver office agents that actually came on site and handled the evidence. Dorwin believes that all the evidence ended up in Seattle. He thought that some of it was in the Portland office, too, for a time. I asked him about the relationship between himself and the Seattle office, particularly with SAC Seattle Charlie Farrell, when Dorwin was the case officer for Norjak in Portland, he seemed to become a bit vague, but left me with the impression that he was confirming that Farrell was still SAC. Dorwin was the Norjak case officer until his retirement, and his involvement with the case was minimal in the latter years. However, in the early 80s, he got about six strong leads a year and plenty of “wannabes” to check out. The Norjak case file in Portland is enormous. Its shelf spans an entire wall. “A lot of good work was done on that case.” Dorwin believes that Cooper never survived the jump and “augured” somewhere, and the animals of the forest disposed of the remains. He believes that the money, “protected by the briefcase” made its way to the Columbia and got chewed up by the dredge and deposited at Tina’s Beach. His voice had a trace of uncharacteristic frustration when he said, “We never found a thing, other than what was recovered at the beach.” Dorwin also told me about his experiences negotiating with three different skyjackers. Dorwin has a Master’s Degree in Behavioral Sciences, and sounds like he was a superb negotiator. Glenn Tripp “Now, Glenn Tripp - that’s a sad tale – the story of that little guy,” Dorwin said at the beginning. Dorwin was involved in the second Tripp skyjacking, the one where Tripp died. In fact, Dorwin was on the phone with Tripp when FBI agents, coming into the place through the cockpit, shot and killed the young man. “At first, Tripp was described as being very violent and abusive to the passengers. But I was just beginning to make some progress with him over a ground-based phone when he was shot.” Dorwin described how he had a portable office set up close to the place and talked to Tripp on a mobile phone, and was patched in somehow to the telecommunications on the plane. “I was just beginning to get him calmed down and he was describing his bomb to me. Then he said he ‘was shielded’ and then I heard a loud bang. At first, I thought Tripp had dropped his phone.” Dorwin said it was a shocking experience to be talking to a suspect when he is killed by other agents. 2. TWA, Portland “My second case was a TWA flight out of Portland, Oregon. The skyjacker wanted to talk to a certain Portland Police Officer about some kind of beef, and the officer was a neighbor of mine.” Dorwin described that the plane was on the ground, and he had negotiated the release of all the passengers, and then the crew, except for the Captain. “It became a real case of the ‘Stockholm Identification Syndrome,’” Dorwin said, whereby the Captain tried to defend the skyjacker, who was a young man. “He was an older gentleman, a fatherly-figure, and we talked to the skyjacker through the Captain’s radio. Well, the Captain bonded with the skyjacker and when I had negotiated with the skyjacker to come down the stairs where we would meet him, the Captain said, ‘I want to go with him.’” Ultimately, all was resolved and the skyjacker taken into custody. 3. Eugene, Oregon skyjacking Dorwin’s third skyjacking negotiation was on a short flight from Eugene, Oregon to Hillsboro, Oregon, at a small private airport just outside of Portland. Dorwin said the skyjacker was a very depressed individual and an alcoholic. “He was very depressed and wanted to commit suicide, but he did have what it took to take his own life so he wanted us to do it for him.” 4. Dorwin’s Biggest Case: The Ecclesia Athletic Association The case that Dorwin is perhaps most proud of, and certainly the one on which he did the most investigative work, was his role in bringing a fellow named Broussard to justice. Broussard was a cult figure from LA who moved to the Clackamas area of Oregon with a number of followers. They attempted to train dozens of children to become star athletes, but their disciplinary regimens were quite severe, and one child died. The Clackamas Sheriff’s department responded to the murder and rescued fifty-three children from the compound. Dorwin spent three years on the case and was able to return indictments on nine adults. 5. Dorwin’s Current Case Dorwin is still involved in police work. When he was a newbie at the Bureau – he joined in 1967 – he was stationed in Tucson, Arizona. He transferred to Portland in 1976. During his time in Tucson, a fellow agent’s grown daughter disappeared from Tucson airport after arriving to pick up her husband on an incoming flight. “We worked diligently on that case for years,” Dorwin said, “but we never got anything. It happens sometimes.” However, a suspect has been indicted recently, a guy who is currently serving a prison sentence on another crime. The suspect had told a buddy in jail, and the word got out. Now, Dorwin has been asked to give depositions in the case. Ta, ta, for now...... Oh, wait, one more thing. I have been diligently trying to correspond with Sheridan Peterson, as 377 has also asked me to chat with that fellow. Petey is cranky and suspicious, and very selective on who, what and when he communciates. At the moment we have exchanged a couple of emails. Is he Cooper? I dunno, but Petey has been investigated twice by the FBI in conjunction to Norjak. First in 1971, just days after the heist, and then a few years ago by the Bureau's San Francisco office, who had three agents investigating him and got DNA samples (voluntarily, I believe) from him. Not sure on the results or findings. I have asked the SF PIO for an update, but somehow they have not gotten around to calling me. Hmmmm... BTW: Georger, I loved the Sultans of Swing rap bit.. Bring it on, Brother.

Greetings everyone, I just wanted to let you know that I am on at intended hiatus from the thread and all DB Cooper research due to medical reasons. I'm okay, but my colitis has reared-up, along with the need to address the underlying issue of an auto-immune response that is fueled in part by what makes me a good investigative reporter - a fierce passion for justice. However, that attitude is also accompanied by a searing vengeance, anger, and a rage against the machine type stuff that is off the charts some days. So I need to calm those wild fellas, too. All the best to y'all, and thanks for all the assistance you've given me.

Maybe your and Sir Cook's assumptions were wrong? Not to mention your approach which usually conveys intention! You just followed Galen Cook into a black hole. What justifies your statement: "I gave the woman all the information I’ve uncovered about Tina and described my concern for her mental state." How in hell can you make an appriasal of the mental state of a person you dont even know and have never met and never will meet, and what in your own person do you think justfies such an approach based on huge assumptions?! A 5 year old would have a better grasp of reality! So, what is the five year old's assessment of Tina, and the reticence of the principles in the Cooper case to discuss its dynamics?

Of late, I’ve been attempting to contact Tina. Part of it has to do with the fact that Florence has not responded. I’ve mailed her the pix of Braden, and Galen has said he sent her electronic copies. Galen says his relationship with Flo is pretty iffy. In the course of all that, Galen asked me to partner with him on finding Tina. He thought a psychological-sensitive approach might be what is needed to successfully discuss the case with her. So far, I’ve been unable to make direct contact with Tina. But here is what I’ve explored. A high school acquaintance of Tina’s, who is now a mental health professional, blogged on a Cooper story in a Twin City newspaper, wondering what had happened to her old classmate. Galen made contact with her, and I joined in. I gave the woman all the information I’ve uncovered about Tina and described my concern for her mental state. The friend has chosen not to engage my invitation to make a joint approach to Tina. I made the same outreach to a member of the Mucklow family that Galen has contacted. Again, they choose not to engage. Lastly, Galen got a phone number indirectly from Geoffrey Gray that was supposed to be a phone number to Tina, but after many tries and leaving messages, I spoke to a guy who picked up, and it was either a really good actor in Langley or a dead-end. My sense is that Tina does not want anything to do with the Cooper issue, and her family and friends are protecting her. It fuels a growing sense I have that all the major players in the Cooper case are clamming up. None of the FBI guys, such as Himm or Russ, will engage an explorative conversation, and Ckret, the FBI and the CSG are stone cold. All my contacts are cold. Rat, Flo, Tina, Himm, Russ. Bernie, Larry, Jeremy. Can’t find any Braden relatives, and the contacts in PA are non-responsive. I really wonder at all of this. It can’t be because I’m just a pesky journalist and folks are tired of the “Cooper nuisance.” But maybe. I know that Himm does feel expoited by my brethren and sisters of the media, but even when I offered to pay for an interview he turned me down. I'll call that guy from Nat Geo, then, and see what he has to say. These are slow days on the DZ and in the Cooper case. And the summer was so hot, too.

Greetings, cloudsurfin, I'll be at Ariel, too, so see you there. I'm a fat, grumpy newspaper reporter(but I’m working on both issues!) getting local color stories for my book on Cooper, which by the way, gang, I am now titling “The Hunt for DB Cooper" and making it a comprehensive take on all the shenanigans that have occurred in the investigation of this case. Look for some guy ranting in a New York accent, and that’s probably me. Please say “Hello.” If you don’t see anyone that looks familiar, just stand in the middle of the dance floor and shout at the top of your lungs: “Cousin Brucie!” I’ll be right there to rescue you. Cloud, if I may, be ready for a varied experience at Ariel. Watching the movie "Deliverance" is good preparation for hanging with the locals at the Ariel Tavern. Personally, some of the characters there really freaked me out last year, which was my first visit. Last year there were quite a few media folks, too. Geoff Gray, renown of the Citizen Sleuth Group, was there, as was the National Geo film crew shooting for their documentary that was aired last July. They were there to get the local scene, but also to film Ron and Pat Forman, who had just written their book about Barb Dayton. I don't know if the Formans will return. Rena Ruddell, Barb’s daughter, was there and fun to talk with. She is convinced her father (mother?) was DB. A radio crew was there from KUOW, the Seattle NPR station, and even though they said they were doing a fluff piece, it carried nationally on All Things Considered the following Monday. Beers, in a can, are three bucks, and the specialty of the house is their "stew" - a thin concoction of veggies and broth with bits of hamburger - pretty down-home stuff. A slice of Wonderbread rounds out the menu and the above entrée is also three bucks. The band was good last year, and a lot of cowboy types and red necks were dancing. This year, I think I'll give that a try, too! Several guys come dressed as Danny, and one wore his chute the whole time I was there. I was impressed that parachutes are so small. The Ariel Tavern is not on the main highway but on the side road to the Merwin Dam. You’ll see little signs pointing the way from the highway, but it’ll be raining, foggy and cold, so if you’re arriving in the evening keep a sharp eye about ten miles up the road from Woodland and I-5. Parking is virtually non-existent at Ariel Tavern, so when you come and don't see a spot, go past it and park at the campground at the bottom of the hill at the base of Merwin Dam. Think of all the history you’re about to witness as you puff back uphill to the bar, and smile knowing it will be much easier on the way back to your vehicle. The rumor is widespread that the FBI always sends somebody to Cooper Days, but I didn't meet anyone who claimed to be from da Bureau. Good travels!

thanks, y'all for the tip and the kind words.

Notes, Money, Report on Mike McPheters Interview, September 29, 2009 Mile McPheters was warm and chatty as we began the interview, today. “Oh, yeah, I was lucky enough to be part of the recovery of some of the DB Cooper money.” But as I pressed for details, his became guarded. For example: “Where the bills discolored in any way? “Oh, yeah, sure.” “Were they blackened, then, let’s say from bacteria or mold or fungus?” “Ah, well, I’d have to go back and check the pictures of them.” As for facts and confirmation, here’s what he told me: Mike found pieces here and there in the high-tide area along the general area of the search. He repeatedly made reference to finding them in the evening , saying things like: “that night when I was there,” etc. Mike said he found about 5, 6 or 7 pieces, and said they were frayed, as one would expect bills to look like after being in the water. “They were very weathered-looking,” he said. Mike was vague and confusing on the serial numbers, at one point leading me to believe that the bills he found had serial numbers, or parts thereof, visible. But when I pressed him on how big the pieces were that he found and did they contain lots of numbers, he hesitated and then got defensive, saying, “Don’t hold me to it,” or “That was a long time ago. He finished by saying that “none” of the bills he found had numbers. Mike stated that the pieces he found were generally 1” x 2.” Some were a little smaller, 1” x 1½” inch, and the biggest was 2” x 3.” Mike said about 20-25 FBI agents were out there “that night,” including “a lot of supervisors.” Mike doesn’t remember if Ralph was there “that night.” Mike avoided my question of what it was like to work with Ralph, nor did he confirm that Ralph was in charge of the recovery effort. Mike doesn’t remember the Fazios. “I don’t remember if they were there that night, or not,” he said. Mike was on site for one “night.” He said he didn't remmebr how long the FBI was out at Tina's Bar. When I asked Mike where he found the bills, he said along the high-tide line, but when I asked him if it appeared they had washed in, or were found at depth as if they had been pumped in by a dredge, he played it both ways. “Yeah, they were right near the surface, not more than a couple feet down.” I pressed him on how deep he dug, and if he could confirm Himmelsbach’s contention that shards were found three feet down. All I got was, “that was a long time ago, I don’t recall exactly.” I ended the conversation because I felt I was losing him in terms of rapport and quality of information. When I asked if I could purchase a copy of his book from him, he surprised me by saying, “It’s for sale at any Costco in Washington state.”

Galen asked me to post this commentary from Skipp Porteus' blog at Sherlock Investigations. -BAS ***************** Hunting for D.B. Cooper Even though I've exchanged e-mails and chatted with Skipp Porteous by phone during the course of a couple years, I have yet to meet him. I'm looking forward to it one day. Skipp and I have a few things in common: we are both private investigators, and we both spend our free time hunting for DB Cooper. Of course, Skipp has his beautiful angels working with him, I work mostly alone. Skipp and I do not share a suspect list. We bounce ideas off of each other and examine hypotheticals that could support some of the more credible theories about the DB Cooper case. Skipp was seen on National Geographic's tv special and I was heard on the Coast to Coast radio show. We both believe that the DB Cooper mystery is solveable and we each carry a portfolio of active investigation in the case. Skipp and I also share the belief that the FBI has not been forthcoming with the public when it comes to DB Cooper. The FBI refers to this case as "NORJAK," the only unsolved case of air piracy/extortion in the United States. Could it be that the FBI is haunted by this case, or does it more resemble a pesky fly that won't leave the dinner table? Take your pick. When it comes to solving bank robberies, the FBI is pretty good. But when a particular robber escapes by company jet and then jumps out the back end into a November storm with a parachute and a bag full of money, the FBI flounders. Sure, the FBI did catch McCoy and others who copied DB, but they were now prepared to defend against known criminal tactics. A criminal with original design is hard to catch, though. For DB Cooper it has been 38 years on the uncaptured list, an eye-sore for the pursuer. Recently, the FBI announced that it was assembling a "Citizens Sleuth Group" (CSG) to broaden the scope of opportunity to catch DB Cooper. In part, Skipp Porteous can take some credit for this, in part, maybe I can. In 2004, I sued the Department of Justice in a Seattle federal court to release some of the NORJAK file to the public. In 2008, Skipp outed a new DB Cooper suspect through an article in New York Magazine, based on his investigative work for a client. Shortly thereafter, the FBI started releasing more details about DB Cooper and upped their efforts to get the public involved. These arrangements are usually broached through compelling efforts of others................oh, those pesky flies. Skipp and I have made numerous attempts during the past two years to coordinate with the FBI in certain matters regarding the Cooper case. For the most part, we have been ignored, despite our professional backgrounds and our knowledge about the case. What is puzzling is that the FBI has made public appearances with certain individuals from the CSG. It can be assumed that these individuals have access to the FBI NORJAK files and the evidence room where Cooper-related "material articles" are stored. Skipp and my repeated requests to the FBI for access to these items go ignored. The question we both ask, then, is on what basis does the FBI discriminate or use discretionary authorization in the sharing of its material evidence to the public? Skipp and I would like nothing better than to see the DB Cooper case solved. Sure, one of us, or both of us, would like to be in on the resolution to this mystery. But after nearly four decades of tantalizing the public with a brilliant and daring escape, does the real DB Cooper really care who solves his case? Galen G. Cook Attorney at Law

All good questions, Snow. I'll put them on the table next time I'm with the Fazios.

[Did we ever get confirmation about a field of bill fragments at Tena Bar? If so, how were the fragments positioned, throughout a vertical layer of soil/sand or on the surface? Along a high water mark? 377 Last Monday, Al Fazio walked me through the money find, or tried to. He had a lot of memory gaps about which day what happened, but here is what I walked away with: Ingrams found the money on a Sunday afternoon. Al says they tried to pass some of it a bank on Monday. Couldn't do it, apparantly, and got directed to the FBI who got out to the beach late Monday. Al and his family were in the dark on the find, and Al first learned about the money when he was driving a load of cattle back from a sale in Oregon and the Feds had his driveway blocked out and wouldn't let him in. Once he cleared that up, he headed to the beach and saw lots of shards scattered along the high-tide line. Al says the bundle of bills was found just below the high-tide line, and Al is passionate when he says, "They washed in. They were buried there by the tide." The next day Tuesday, the feds asked Al and Richard to get their backhoes out and start digging. Al is adamant that no pieces of Cooper money were found beneath the surface of Tina's Beach. Feds were out there for a few days, and then the media came in, and that lasted for a few days. The Fazios seem to have every book written on DB Cooper and access them freely and readily. I saw no evidence of stroke on the part of Richard, as Jerry alluded to a few days ago. He's smart and conversant.

Interesting post, Jo, I like it. A chameleon-like suspect who goes through life using aliases, swaps identities with Army recruits, has multiple wives and lives, and maybe multiple personalities -or at least profound personality changes. He is certainly one man who can come from nowhere and then get on a plane at PDX and a few hours later jump back to nowhere. Ideal candidate for special ops, too, wouldn't you say, especially really, really covert ops - a one of a kind op kind of guy, I should say.

I gather, Lee, that you don't think there is any connection between the money find on Tina's Beach and cattle mutilations on the same property about twenty years later? You may be correct, but how do you rule it out? At the very least, the cattle mutilation discussion has illuminated some of the lamest FBI documents in the history of law enforcement. For me, that view into the Bureau is priceless, and helpful in understanding the feds' investigation (or lack thereof) into the DB Cooper case. As for launching an independent investigation via remote viewing and/or teleportation - why not? If you're unfamiliar with the later techniques, I highly recommend "Psychic Warrior" by David Morehouse. It's a good read, and fully describes the capaciities of remote viewing, and also illustrates the very mixed agenda of the US government. And yes, let's find out why the flight path is so suspect, and why the F 106s couldn't or didn't lock onto the transponders on Flight 305. To that end I am following-up on the post by Snow a few days back that shows a report by Adele Ferguson (who writes for a newspaper I write for, I just found out) that NORAD specifically shut down McChord's request to put chaff in the chutes and blocked the 106s from close pursuit. To me, it's all good.

Don't take a twenty Bruce. Ray Bradbury knew about the horrible consequences of tranporting material across time. Haven't you seen the movie (based on a Bradbury Story) Sound of Thunder??? Can you imagine the chaos if you took one of the twenties that was later found at Tena Bar? 377 Now, that would casue a whole lot of trouble, wouldn't it. Sorry, 377, I think I'm gonna do it and see what happens. No guts,no glory - eh?

The fact is that the flight path was over Troutdale and not over portland. The reason for this was, It was the less populated area. The pilot's were given a choice . They could either go East.From the flight patern (23V)or west toward's the ocean . They chose east.The weather was ,to say the least bad. The wind's were rough . The altitude of the aircraft was above certain turbulance's. When you get close to the columbia River Gorge the air current's change rapidly .Every one alway's thought that the flight path was over portland then followed I,5 not true. The original calculation's were wrong . The pilot's flew to the east to avoid all populated area's. Back in the early 70's Troutdale and gresham had little population. Hope this bring's you up to date. Quote I just received an email from Galen Cook that discusses the flight path. Here it is: Bruce: You can throw this around the Drop-Zone gang if you want to give them more to chew on. I talked with H.E. "Andy" Anderson tonight for an hour. (Sorry, but he does not want me to give his number out to anybody). He told me this: The cockpit crew saw the illumination from the lights below (of Portland/Vancouver) through the lower cloud cover. He called it the "undercast illumination," since there was a lower cloud deck. That means the air-route of #305 led right over Portland/Vancouver, just like the radar track shows. Second, he said that when the plane landed in Reno, the crew stayed in the cockpit thinking Cooper was still on board. So, put this together...............none of the crew knew for sure that Cooper even jumped despite the "pressure bump" registered on the plane's guages. They thought there was a "possibility" that he might have jumped. Thus, the pressure bump was so subtle, they could only guess. This means that Cooper could have bailed-out well past Battle Ground. Anyway, Andy is a real gentleman. Former 747 captain later in life too. Great-grandpa now. He told me the truth of the matter is that no one in the cockpit really knew IF and WHEN Cooper bailed-out. They only knew for sure when the FBI came on board in Reno.

QuoteBruce is an interesting guy. He embraces what I call fringe and paranormal beliefs, stuff that I think has no scientific or even rational merit, but he, unlike his fellow new age travellers, keeps an open mind and a wonderful sense of humor. If aliens were mutilating the Fazios cattle, and seeking DNA to help breed emotionality into their flat "Grey" lives, then it opens all sorts of possibilities. Pranks are an early manifestation of humor. Maybe as their directed evolution project progressed, they conceived a prank to put some Cooper loot at Tena Bar. It isnt very funny, but hey, maybe they bred in cow humor not knowing that cows and humans laugh at different things. How did they get the loot? Show me the proof that Cooper was human. Or as Jo might phrase it, show me proof that Cooper was not an alien. Our enduring difficulty in identifying him might be explained easily by Bruce. What do you say Bruce? 377 *** Thanks for the kind words about my character and sense of humor, 377. Your question about Danny's identity is very timely, as I have been feeling increasingly stymied and seeking bolder approaches to solving the mystery. Here's my current thinking: Since Flo and Tina don’t want to talk, I figured I’d better get on board Flight 305 and see for myself what is (was) going on. So, I’ve been trying to do a little teleporting through time and space and see if Danny Boy will let me light a few of his cigarettes. Haven’t made it yet, but I’m as excited as all heck trying. I’ve also had a great time rehearsing my introductory lines…”Excuse me, Mr. Cooper, but I’m a newspaper reporter from 2009 and I was wondering if I could ask you a few questions?” Or, “Dan, mind if I jump with you so I can see if you made it? We’re not sure in 2009.” I’m also having a very interesting ethical debate with myself over whether it is permissible to snatch a couple twenties so I can prove to you guys that I actually made it when I do. Along those lines, I’m also doing a bit of remote viewing to get my own take on who Danny is and was. Again, not much in terms of concrete information, but I’m feeling the vibes of the 1970s and that’s a very weird feeling, and surprisingly uncomfortable. All these sideburns and bell-bottoms – Whew!!! Home base for the Army’s remote viewers was (is) Fort Detrick, I believe, the same place where MKULTRA was (is) stationed. Lots has been written about the military’s remote viewing, and one of their RV’ers, David Morehouse, is now freelancing commercially. Maybe I should give him a call and get this angle rolling. Dr. Hal Puthoff was the initiator of the Army’s RV unit, as I understand it, and Puthoff is currently head of a private research lab named Institute of Advanced Studies in Austin, Texas. One of his deputies, Dr. Eric Davis, wrote a paper on the current state of teleportation for the US Air Force. A few years ago, I wrote a couple magazine articles on the related subjects of the physics of antigravity, kind of picking up where Nick Cook left off in his “The Hunt for Zero Point – Inside the Classified World of Antigravity,” and one on the Bio-Physics of Human Levitation. Puthoff and his crew were part of those writings. As for the cows, aliens and the loot, all I can say at the moment is, "What a hoot." It reminds me of a phrase that Galen, Al, Richard and myself have uttered numerous times over the past few weeks: "Just when you thought the DB Cooper case couldn't get any crazier, it does."

With the impasse on Braden (no word from Flo on the pix, and dead-ends with phone searches for Ted and family) I traveled down to Tina's Bar to chat with Richard and Al Fazio. First off, I asked them about their cows and if they ever went down to the beach. The answer was "no, never," but Al was quite taken-back by the question. "Who wants to know," he asked with some passion in his voice, so I told him, "Georger." Not sure if he recognized your name, G, but there you have it. Al also wanted to know why you were asking, so I told him about your concerns with hooves digging up the sand, money, etc. He dismissed it all as a never-happened kind of thing. But, there is bigger news, and here is my report: Notes, Fazio Brothers, cattle mutilations. Visit September 21, 2009 On September 21, 2009 I followed-up on a tip from Galen Cook and traveled back to the Fazios to ask them about cattle mutilations to their herd, and crop circles on their fields. Richard and Al Fazio readily admitted to having 4-5 cattle mutilated sometime in the early 1990s, probably 1992. However, they said they did not have any crop circles. Richard brought out a manila folder, titled appropriately, “X-Files” and showed me the photographs of the mutilations. The cuts were serrated, and on one animal the serrations appeared to be very precise and zipper-like. They reminded me of teeth on a Halloween jack o-lantern, and Al described them as “cookie-cutter’ shaped. They were square with 90 degree angles, possessing a flat top and straight sides approximately one-quarter-inch on each facing. In addition, the wounds were cauterized and no blood was found on the ground. The pictures show a very clean wound, as if it was a dissection, and no blood was seen in the cavity. Al reported that sexual organs were removed, along with eye balls and ears, and one cow had circular portions of skin removed from its chest area. The Fazios said the cows had been healthy before the mutilations, and were discovered lying in a grassy pasture sometime in spring after planting cabbage fields near-by. The County Sheriffs investigated and no cause of death was determined. They have been officially declared “Cattle Mutilations.” No footprints or signs of a scuffle were found on the ground. “The cattle were just lying on their side,” said Al, who added that there were no bullet wounds found. After discovery, Richard took a cow that had recently died and dragged it to the area where the mutilated cows were found to see if predators would eat it and what kind of wounds these predators would leave, thereby proving that local critters could have done the mutilations. Predators did come the next night and tore open the dead cow and ate much of it, leaving wounds typical of a wild animal – tearing and ripping - and not the precise incisions on the mutilated cows. Animal pathologists from Oregon State University performed an investigation and confirmed the cauterization of the wounds. Al said that a neighboring rancher had had several cows mutilated in a similar fashion a couple of years prior to their event. When asked about the prevalence of cattle mutilations and what the local ranching community says about them, Al replied, “There’s not too many cattle ranchers around here.” Researcher Linda Moulton Howe, who is a former NBC TV news reporter from Colorado and a long-established investigator into the cattle mutilation phenomena, contacted the Fazios and asked to interview Richard. She invited him to LA to be in a movie on cattle mutilations, but Richard turned it down saying, “I didn’t want any part of that craziness.” Other UFO and cattle mutilation researchers, and media, contacted the Fazios, “And we talked with them – no reason not to,” said Al. A local Dominican priest, fearing Satanists, came out to the ranch with a gallon jug of “Holy Water” and blessed the ranch. The Fazios still have the jar, and it’s still half-filled. The Fazios have a very mixed reaction to all of this. Al is particularly inquisitive about the subject, wanting to know the who, what and why of it all. Richard is more circumspect. The Fazios say they have two thoughts on the source of the mutilations: UFOs or Satanists. “I’ve never seen a UFO,” said Al, and it’s unclear as to whether he would truly like to, but he is clearly intrigued by the possibility, as well. The Fazios questioned me about what I knew of cattle mutilations, UFOs, and related phenomena. I shared what I knew, and spent a lot of time describing my experiences as an "alien abduction experiencer," as researcher, the late Dr. John Mack so elequently describes us folks. IE: Lucid dream states that are fairly lengthy and can be engaged and expanded in hypnosis. As over 90 per cent of abduction experiencers, I have never had an encounter in a fully awake conscious state. When I got home I distilled my thoughts on cattle mutilations and emailed the following to Richard and Al. Letter to the Fazios, Cattle Mutilations, September 22, 2009 As for cattle mutilations, I have three primary theories that I consider: 1. Certain extraterrestrials, most widely reported to be the “Grays” – those little guys with the big heads and big eyes, are harvesting human tissue to capture suitable DNA that is charged with “emotional” qualities so that they can rebuild their own DNA and replace the emotionality that is missing from their life, which does looks pretty grim – they certainly don’t look like fellows who can tell a joke. This is the perspective that I have heard from Ramtha, the Enlightened One, and I believe he discusses it in his book “UFOs - Raiders from Above.” 2. Military- governmental- corporatocracy shenanigans, whereby these elements of our society like to keep people scared and off-center, as described by Naomi Klein in her book, “The Shock Doctrine.” End goal is to control the population and allow the elite to reap greater profits, power, etc. 3. Cosmic Forces: Whoever and whatever these may be, they are using the mutilations to shock us out of the complacency of social consciousness – “bust us out of the box,” so to speak. The goal is to have a greater spiritual awakening, and be more resistant to the machinations of those leading scenario #2. Kind of creepy, and not your typical angelic image of divine beings, but, whatever it takes, I guess, for humankind to evolve. As for the Satanists, I doubt it. First, where are these Satanists and what are they doing with the tissue? I have no sense of them being out there. Besides exceptional abilities to approach cows and do surgery - and leave no evidence of a scuffle in the process - the mutilators are masters of secrecy as no one I know knows a mutilator. But most compelling, where did these fellows get their surgical instruments? As I understand it, the cauterization and serrated cuts indicate a level of sophistication at the upper limits of our technology. So, these guys are smart, savvy, secret and don’t like steak? Why? Why don’t they just steal a couple of cows - or heck, just buy a couple of cows - and take them back to their covens and get all the tissue they want – plus steaks and hamburger – and have a great BBQ and be well-fed when they’re satanizing, eh? And one more thing, the mutilators, apparently, don’t have mothers. Why do they just leave the carcasses lying around? Didn’t their mothers tell them to clean-up after themselves? Very untidy and very rude behavior, I should say, at the very least. If they’re ETs, at least they could have dug a hole and buried the animals, or put them in a dumpster. Judged by the antics of their craft they should be able to dig a hole with their blue beams, etc. Very poor manners on the part of these visitors to our planet, to say the least. A litterbug is a litterbug in my book, regardless of how fancy a tin can they fly around in. One last thing, I'd like to give a Big Howdy-Do to Farflung. I love your posts, sir/madam.

This is curious. Hmmm.

Quote Since you've asked me, Sky: If I had to place a bet this very minute, I'd place it on Theodore B. Braden. But I wouldn't bet the ranch. That said, I tend to think that Dan Cooper might be someone who has never been talked about, yet. My instincts, gut feelings, intuition, etc, tells me that this case is a lot crazier than we have yet to imagine it to be. I say that because there are too many lies, spin-jobs, silent witnesses, and unresponsive officials. At the very least, these distortions create a vacuum that allows wildly implausible theories with no supporting data whatsoever, such as the propeller transport idea, to receive fifteen minutes of air-time in the Nat Geo documentary. It reminds me something I heard Ramtha, the Enlightened One say a while back: "Truth is always the first casualty of war." We's at war, folks. The lies clearly tell us that, IMHO. But what is the struggle all about, eh?

QuoteI remember reading about the FBI's infiltration of AIM. Brown contacts as a disguise may not be such a wild leap of faith. Wonder if it was a commonly used CIA or FBI disguise trick? I wonder if Braden had a NORJACK alibi? The Mayfield H relationship and the apparent lack of thoroughness in Ted M's alibi investigation needs further scrutiny. I still think Braden makes a great Cooper but for the eyes. Galen Cook is awfully quiet... Tom K too. I bet Ckret still reads this forum though he can no longer post. Quote I called Ted Mayfield back in the early spring to see if he would be willing to talk about his relationship with Ralph and the FBI. Ralph, at one point in his book, says that Ted made valuable contributions to the FBI's investigation. I'd sure like to know what they were. Ted ended the phone call as soon as I said I was a newspaper reporter doing a story on DB Cooper, saying "I always get in trouble when I talk about that." I called him right back, and he answered. I quickly tried to tell him I wasn't interested in talking about his being a Cooper suspect, but only to talk about what he did for the FBI that was so valuable. Again he hung up saying "I'm really not interested in discussing this." I haven't tried any further to contact him, but he is certainly on my Cooper Country road map to-do list when I have the bucks and time to make a big swing through Oregon terrain. As for the relationship between Ralph and Teddy M, I read, but I forget where and don't want to dig through my notes at the moment, that Ralph and Ted Mayfield had an altercation at the Aurora (Oregon) State Airport several years before Cooper. It was aviation related and had to do with improper conduct of some kind by Mayfield that Ralph took major issue with. It was not a crime-related thing, but it got them in each other's roll-a-dex, apparently. On a personal note, we have so many Teddys and Tinas. I love it. Still waiting to hear back from Florence. No word from either channel. Until I get more definitive information on the eyes, I'm holding off on the Florida phone slog. My time is a bit short - I only have an afternoon or two a week to make phone calls, and the three-hour time diff makes a difference. As for Galen, I had been in regular phone contact with him through the summer, and met him once in Olympia, WA for some brewski and converation. He was down in Cooper Country for four weeks, and did some buzzing around in BC, too. I last spoke with him two weeks ago and he was back in Anchorage, working on da book. I've had two full responses from Tom Kaye on my emails to him this week regarding the Nat Geo stuff. He told me essentially what Jerry has posted here concerning Tom's views on the propellers, etc. My sense of what Tom wrote to me is that he presented the propeller transport theory to Nat Geo as speculative, lacking any significant data, and was thrown together at the last minute. He also said that he was abandoning any microscopic investigation of the money and had sent the bills back to Larry. He was, however, still following up on the pollen angle. As for Nat Geo, if they stonewall me I'm going to ask my mother to call the chief producer to ask why they are being so rude to her Sonny Boy. When my mom gets worked-up, well, let's just say that grown men have been known to cry. For example: After the black-box-digital-analogue-conversion thing this year, she's already steamed up about anything having to do with TV, Cable, or any fancy-schmansy electronic stuff. (Gawd- you should have seen her in Sears returning her first try at the conversion box last December when I was home for Christmas. Whew.....it wasn't pretty. She ended up talking to the store manager at his home on a day off. Go Mom! Caution: Momma Bears? - you don't want to, ahem, mess with them. Grrrrr.) So, Nat Geo, if you're listening, consider yourselves duly informed.

I have opened up a second channel to Florence and have sent her a color pix of Teddy. Personally, I am very excited by the prospect of Braden being Cooper. At the very least, Teddy's abilities, character and demeanor give us a template to see how Cooper could have been thinking. Further, it gives me a welcomed buffer every time I hear Larry describe how he imagines a bubbling Cooper tumbling in panic to his death. The fact that multiple SOG vets consider Ted a viable suspect gives the Braden angle an enormous amount of credibility. That said, I also possess a warm spot in my heart for Barb. A confession, a more-than-adequate skill set, psychological motivations, and a ton o' details about the how and whys. We probably know more about her scenario than any other suspect, other than Richard McCoy. Yes, it would be incredible that she was masculine enough to convince the FAs over a six-hour period of close examination, but, 43 years as a guy is pretty good practice for imitating masculinity. When I talk to the Nat Geo folks I intend to query them on why the above perspectives were not included, and why they gave so much air time to the propeller theory when the FBI doesn't even post it on their web site. Heck, the Dan Cooper comics rate more attention from the feds than the propellers do.