Hooknswoop

That is the whole point, get differing views and why people think the way they do, then make a more educated choice for yourself. I'm glad you used this thread to that end. Good job. Derek

I'm in over my head on this one Derek

And spin things to their own end. Derek

LOL. I would really like to understand why though. It goes against what I know about canopies. Derek

I don't think tht is better, since stopping faster doesn't make things worse when you don't need to sto faster. No harm done if you stop faster. But with an RSL, you can get an unstable reserve deployment. That can be a problem. If the RSL was only 'armed' if you were below about 1000 feet, it would be a great device. Derek

Then I stand corrected. Derek

I don't think it is as simple as # jumpers killed vs. number saved. Airbags fire when you hit something. Imagine if they fired when you hit something or jammed on the brakes hard. The save vs. kill rate for airbags wouldn't change, but they would go off a lot more often than needed, instead of rarely going off when not needed. People wouldn't have airbags anymore. That is the same thing for RSL's. They go off regardless if you need them or not. In most cases, they are not needed and shouldn't activate the reserve so quickly. For 100 malfunctions, how many would an RSL be needed and how many would it not be needed? Derek

I understand what you are saying, and from a purely logical perspective you are 100% correct. The problem is the human mind. Like you said, "I'd be lucky to remember my name. Procedures better take over automatically at that point.". In your mind, you are pre-set that the RSL will fire the reserve. You aren't going to be thinking during a mal, just going by what you have trained for. After releasing the main, you are in the mind set that the RSL will activate your reserve, if it doesn't, then things are not going as they should. This can cause panic, which makes it even harder to think, which can prevent you from pulling the reserve handle. It is all mind set. Derek

Maybe, but probably not. Rick Horn would have found his reserve handle no problem after he cut away and the harness was un-loaded. The floating reserve ripcord could have been found very quickly also. It isn't so easy to determine a true RSL save because the jumper isn't given the chance to save themselves. Derek

How many of those are really saves? How many of those would the jumper be dead had theynot had an RSL? How many people have had a problem with their reserve because of an unstable RSL-activated reserve deployment? Again, out of 100 RSL-deployed reserves, how many were saves? Derek

People have gone in from unstable reserve deployments. No line twists on the reserve is better than line twists. Therefore RSL's make things worse more often than they make things better. Derek

Only if the main is out, cutaway, and the RSL is connected. I really think that thinking of the RSL as the primary is a mistake. I don't understand why you wouldn't think of yourself pulling the reserve handle as the primary method of activating the reserve. What if you have a total? What if the RSL has become disconnected? What if you are jumping a different rig with no RSL? There is no good reason to not think of the reserve handle as the primary reserve activation methid. Derek

It is an attitude towards your EP'' and your gear. I believe people have been saved by their AAD's and have gone in because of this attitude towards RSL's. They expect the RSL to deploy their reserve for them. Then during a real mal, they cutaway, expecting the RSL to activate the reserve. When it doesn't for whatever reason, they panic because things are not going as it is supposed to and the ground is getting big and they can't think............ Expecting the reserve not to come out until you pull the reserve handle prevents the chances of this panic. If the RSL does deploy the reserve, no harm done. There are 3 ways your reserve can be deployed..... Derek

I dunno, a lot less than have been prevented would be my guess though. Derek

You have this backwards. You are the primary system, you pulling the reserve handle is the primary for deploying your reserve. Your Skyhook is a back up to your actions, not the primary. Do not rely on a RSL or AAD. They are strictly back ups. Derek

In a wrap, or any other malfunction for that matter, the last thing you want is more complicated emergency procedures. Trying to remember that this is one of the malfuntions you should disconnect the RSL prior to cutting away during a malfunction and then actually doing it complicates your EP's and takes time. It has happened before, killed the jumper too. Derek

Poor body position is one cause of malfunctions (poor maintenance and bad packing are the other 2 major causes of malfunctions). Some manufacturers recommend being a little head high for the reserve deployment. This helps the reserve PC clear the jumper's burble. I don't know of any manufacturer that recommends the jumper be unstable for reserve deployment. A little head high is not unstable. Derek

Anytime. Derek

Ya, it would have made things worse, deploying my reserve while I was on my back. Derek

A Raven 2 is 218 according to PA and a Super Raven II is also 218 sq ft according to PA. PIA measured them both at 203 sq ft. Derek

Yes. I didn't need it to deploy the reserve for me and was semi-stable for my first. Derek

On those rigs (I learned on one), the main deployment ripcord was where the cutaway handle is on most rigs, with the cutaway/reserve handle where the reserve handle is on most rigs. If she had learned on one of those and resorted to her initial training on that system, the correct action would have been to pull the handle that is now her reserve handle, not the main handle. Doesn't fit. Derek

Take 100 malfunctions. How many of those would the jumper have failed to deploy the reserve in time? How many of the 100 does the reserve need to be deployed immediately after cutting away the main? How many of 100 malfunctions where the RSL activates the reserve would it have been necessary for the RSL to immediately initiate the reserve deployment for the jumper? If the answer is less than half, then the RSL results in an unstable reserve deployment when it didn’t have to be more often than not. This would mean RSL’s makes things worse more often than it makes things better. How many people have gone in after cutting away waiting for an RSL to activate their reserve that never did? How many people have had an AAD fire after cutting away and waiting for an RSL to activate their reserve that never did? I have had 14 cutaways, 11 on sport gear and 3 tandem. None were with an RSL. I was able to get stable after cutting away the main each time. If I had had an RSL for those 14 jumps, the reserve would have been deployed immediately after cutting away each time, while I was unstable for all but 1 tandem where I cut away a bag lock and was stable the whole time. So for 13 of my 14 malfunctions, the RSL would have made things worse (deploying my reserve while unstable), not better, and could have resulted in a reserve malfunction. I believe that the vast majority of malfunctions where an RSL activates the reserve for the jumper, it was unnecessary and made things worse by deploying the reserve while the jumper was unstable. Of course, given the choice between no reserve and deploying the reserve unstable, the better choice is an unstable reserve deployment. The jumper still has that option without the RSL. They lose the option of getting stable with an RSL. The only time an RSL is a good idea is if you cutaway very low from deployed main and fail to immediately deploy your reserve or cutaway from a deployed main and fail to deploy your reserve at all. In either case, the common denominator is failing to deploy your reserve in time. There is one other instance where an RSL is a good thing, and that is if you rely on the RSL to activate the reserve for you after a cutaway and it does. In that case, having the RSL to rely on in the first place created the problem. Sort of like driving fast because you have an airbag and then being saved by it. You wouldn’t have driven fast without the airbag and avoided the need for it altogether. Sort of like a self-fulfilling prophecy. The RSL doesn’t know if your riser broke. The RSL doesn’t know that you have plenty of altitude and don’t need an immediate reserve deployment. The RSL doesn’t know that you are in a canopy wrap and do not want an immediate reserve deployment. It activates the reserve regardless of the situation and the jumper’s need’s/want’s. The Skyhook addresses most of these issues. Because the reserve is out of the free bag in the length of the reserve lines, an unstable reserve deployment isn’t an issue. It will release the other riser in the event the riser it is connected to breaks. Derek

I miss jumping out of airplanes and teaching every now and then, but I don't miss going to DZ's. I still rig. So, ya, I'm happy and I'm working on the teaching thing. A lot of people quit every year, seems like these days for every new jumper, someone walks away. Derek

A lot of issues to work out. Maintenance on the road. Parts on the road. Hotel room every night. Ferry fees. Weather issues. Some Cessna DZ's don't want a larger plane coming in because they make less money than they would just flying their own aircraft. Cessna DZ's aren't going to have enough jumpers for a big plane during the week. So do you sit around doing nothing paying for a hotel room and rrental car making no money or do you fly home, spending money on fuel and maintenance? Competetition; There are other aircraft owners that will provide aircraft ot DZ's that have been doing it for along time. That's just off the top of my head. It would be tough. Derek