snowmman

Because, according to Ralph (as he has said elsewhere), 48 was the median age estimated by eyewitnesses who claimed to have seen Cooper. The estimates ranged from early 40s to mid-50s, but 48 was the median. Thanks. Are you theorizing, or did you talk to Ralph?

related trivia: Edward Daley's last World Airways flight out of Danang took off with stairs down, the cargo doors open (full of people), grenade damage to flaps, guns fired at cockpit. Over 300 people on board. Dead soldier hanging out of the wheel well, preventing gear retraction. There are many accounts online, some first person, but this tv news report from back then (youtube) is a particularly gripping reminder of the times back then. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoA02PmueH4 (edit) starting at 1:38 you can see Ed Daly standing on the stairs as the plane is taxiing, with a gun in his hand, and people chasing on the runway. At 3:22 they're at 6000 ft, with stairs down, and a guy hanging on the stairs. (edit) I'll note this seems to be the existence proof of what a lot of people told me wasn't possible. Doesn't mean much, but I find it interesting. Don't know if stairs were locked down or not. I guess not.

from the web: ...started reading the Dan Cooper series .... In short, Dan Cooper is a Canadian military pilot, flying usually fighters. He's often acting as a chase or test pilot and making international exchanges with other air forces. I like it especially since it's a Canadian pilot (while most comics and other books have Americans as main heroes). One episode was named Silver Fox, in which he was the squadron leader. During flight, he was sometimes called "Fox leader"... The Silver Fox squadron really exists. It's the 441th TFS (Tactical Fighter Squadron) based in Cold Lake, Alberta. (edit) 441 Squadron: Nickname: Silver Fox Motto: Stalk And Kill patch attached

I was just thinking when we discussed the Dan Cooper comic (french) we immediately started talking about Canada (without even discussing the dominant English vs French characteristics of the different provinces) in any case, in the 1971 era, a more interesting "jump" would be to Laos/Cambodia/Vietnam, where French was THE language to speak if you wanted to get around. (edit) I'm not sure about Korea, say in the '50s, but there is an historical French influence in that area also. I suppose the Cooper Caper is full of all sorts of random interconnections. There was so much going on in that/those time period(s), it's hard to sort out what might be a clue and what might not be.

I was clicking thru some old Air America pics available online, and found some funny ones with guys and girls.. (edit) shows some briefcases of the era!

According to Robert Serling's book about the Boeing Company, three Boeing 727s were acquired by Air America, which was operated by the CIA. Indeed, the head of Air America inquired about how much cargo could be dropped down the rear stairs before Air America purchased its 727s. supposedly documented in this book: Legend & Legacy: The Story of Boeing and Its People I've attached a separate document that purports to have the history of the three 727s bought by Air America. Apparently used by Southern Air Transport. source: http://www.utdallas.edu/library/collections/speccoll/Leeker/jets.pdf (edit) another source lists four 727s thru Air America N695WA 727-173C 19509 (leased from World) N5055 727-92C 19173 (leased to Southern Air Transport) sold (03/10/72) N5092 727-92C 19174 (leased to Southern Air Transport) sold N5093 727-92C 19175 to CAT as B-1018

CIA airdrops should be old news. C-123 used for supplying the Contras in Nicaragua, for example. See the capture of Eugene Hasenfus in 1986 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugene_Hasenfus hey, he parachuted..hmmm.. Interesting he disobeyed orders by wearing a parachute on the mission. Other example: Tibet '58-'61? (35-40 drops?) In 1958, the CIA started using air bases in Bangkok (or Takhli?), Thailand to airdrop guns and ammunition into the ethnic-Tibetan regions of Kham. Eventually four C-130s modified for high-altitude drops were used?

KAFFEE ...Harold, what's a Code Red? DAWSON Sir, a Code Red is a disciplinary engagement. KAFFEE What does that mean, exactly? DAWSON Sir, a marine falls out of line, it's up to the men in his unit to get him back on track. KAFFEE What's a garden variety Code Red? DAWSON Sir? KAFFEE Harold, you say sir and I turn around and look for my father. Danny, Daniel, Kaffee. Garden variety; typical. What's a basic Code Red? DAWSON Sir, a marine has refused to bathe on a regular basis. The men in his squad would give him a G.I. shower. KAFFEE What's that? DAWSON Scrub brushes, brillo pads, steel wool ... SAM Beautiful. KAFFEE Was the attack on Santiago a Code Red? DAWSON Yes sir.

Was this Gale Goyins? Photo attached from Gale Goyins flying a search and rescue mission Aug 14, 1975, around Mt Jefferson. (Or). Curt Degner co-pilot on that mission. (edit) if still alive, Gale Goyins might be 78 now. uncertain. (edit) Google News refers to Lt. Col. Goyins and Maj. William Gottlieb in 1977 ... Walla Walla Union-Bulletin (Newspaper) - May 2, 1977, An Oregon National Guard helicopter, fighting winds and altitude, ... The helicopter, piloted by Lt. Col. Gale Goyins and Maj. William Gottlieb, flew Reddick to a hospital and Bangs started off again ...

Why would the report leave this out? Wouldn't the FBI agents be setting themselves up for non-performance-of-duty accusations? They must have been told to not include it for national security reasons? I'm just guessing out loud. I can't imagine the scenario, although it was 1971 so who knows. When you say "it was stated by Himmelsbach and others", where did that happen? where was it stated?

Okay you're saying that if we knew the timeline for the helicoptor and it's probable flight path, and it's turnaround point, we can reverse engineer where the 727 wasn't at particular times, because they didn't see it. Or, are you saying they were in a certain area, and didn't see the plane, so they assumed that wasn't the DZ, but maybe they messed up, and that threw off the search, and pushed it up towards Ariel. i.e. an example of people making an earnest effort, but contributing bad data, which then skewed the search effort wrongly. I think that might be more what you're suggesting? If so, maybe that makes sense. It was a cloudy night, so relying on any visual non-intercept data would be a bad idea? (edit) they must have been fed radar tracking info from ATC, otherwise they would have worried about in-air crash?

So Jo, are you suggesting that the flight map we have was created from FAA radar tracking, not USAF as we've been led to believe? Or is it just that FAA was also tracking, in addition to USAF? USAF (SAGE) radar should have had no problem with the Pacific since they were designed to look for Russan bombers out there? (edit) OR: are you suggesting this was another thing Cooper might have known, that would have forced the V23 selection as "obvious".

My theory is maybe I unnerved him with the 5 piece set photo. I'm thinking the tie bar is more similar to the one in that 5 piece set then he said. Just a theory.

from the same video, some snaps of the FBI Ingram money. Shows the folder FBI stores them in. Also a little more detail on the fully black ones.

If you've not seen the ckret video, there's just a little bit of extra detail that's interesting. Snaps attached. from video at: http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/340794_cooper23.html these snaps give some detail on the back of the tie clip, and the back of the tie. money find location id'ed with finger. Map is upside down so it looks wrong until you think about it Can see physically what the '71 map looks like. Also shows "the box" (edit) FYI best to save these to your computer (click on them and then right click and save the image)..that way you can use windows viewer to zoom them. I didn't make them bigger cause they then exceed the dz limits)

This is from that same article, Oct 27, 2007. Since we have gotten a lot more information in the last couple of months, the statement from H. about "isn't anything left" was obviously incorrect. For a long time, the FBI kept some elements of the crime secret, saving them to help identify the real hijacker. But not any more, Himmelsbach said. "There isn't anything left that hasn't been made public," he said.

The writer apparently interviewed H. for this article D.B. Cooper expert doubts latest claims. Source: Columbian (Vancouver, WA) Don Hamilton Publication Date: 27-OCT-07 Himmelsbach's life has been intertwined with the hijacking, right from the night it took place. He listened to the radio chatter between the pilot and the tower as they made their plans.

This is in the myth or fact bucket. The earliest newspaper reference to Himmelsbach supposedly trailing 305 in a helicopter, that I can find, is in 1996. More recent article says he followed an airliner over the route the next night in an army helicopter, as part of the search? Maybe that's the truth and got turned into him following during the hijack? It makes more sense, because I don't see how he and Mayfield had a phone conversation if H. was in a helicopter that night? Other myths? from that night are that the trailing C-130 had parachutists in it, and that the two jets were one fighter, one trainer jet. (reported early after the hijack) DB COOPER LEGEND STILL UP IN AIR 25 YEARS AFTER LEAP, HIJACKER... Rocky Mountain News - NewsBank - Nov 24, 1996 There was also an Air National Guard helicopter carrying FBI agent Ralph Himmelsbach, frantically trying to keep up with the 727. ... DB Cooper's fate unknown; legend thrives Hijacker parachuted from... Kansas City Star - NewsBank - Dec 2, 1996 There was also an Air National Guard helicopter, which carried FBI agent Ralph Himmelsbach and tried to keep up with the 727. The chopper was too slow. ... One giant leap into infamy 25 years ago, a hijacker known as DB... Fort Worth Star-Telegram - NewsBank - Nov 28, 1996 There was also an Air National Guard helicopter, carrying FBI agent Ralph Himmelsbach and frantically trying to keep up with the 727. ... DB Cooper expert doubts latest claims. The Columbian - AccessMyLibrary.com - Oct 27, 2007 Oct. 27--Ralph Himmelsbach has heard every DB Cooper story there is to be ... and the next night followed an airliner over the route in an army helicopter. ...

Someone mentioned SafecrackingPLF if he was here, he'd be spinning the Lookalike meter. So I tried to stand in for him. I was surprised how many people said Gossett was a good match for the composite sketch. It's easy to find photos from the appropriate time period, that are better matches than Gossett. Attached is result of Lookalike meter.

yeah, you're right. I'm thinking free pass at an earlier level, so it doesn't involve so many people. Basically I"m wrestling with the "never got caught" reality.

Every time I find an H. quote vehemently stating who Cooper wasn't, I say to myself..."Okay that's who Cooper was" (edit) NOW WHY THE HECK DID H. SAY 48 HERE? I mean that's an exact age. It's like he's telling us birth year = 1923? (edit) updated url to Seattle Times primary source article here with some H. quotes The Seattle Times, Nov. 17, 1996 http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=19961117&slug=2360262 Himmelsbach says Cooper may have been ex-military, but more likely was an ex-con, a loner who burned friends and family and was desperate enough to ignore the long odds. "When a guy like that drops out of sight the people around him are glad and they don't think much about it, maybe figuring he's in jail again," Himmelsbach says. "You certainly don't get a 48-year-old man who has lived a normal life suddenly doing what this guy did." He was, Himmelsbach says, "a dirty, rotten crook."

somewhat weirdly connected, I tracked down the source of The Bald Man Theory...evidently on 4/29/72 newspapers reported the FBI had a theory Cooper was bald with a wig? Maybe this was a result of McCoy hijack, which was 4/7/72..captured 4/9/72 I mention this as part of the mythology about just what the "excellent description" really was or wasn't. Apr 29, 1972 - The FBI has concluded that "DB Cooper," the ransom hijacker of an airliner last November, is bald headed, according to the Bremerton Sun. From CLUE TO DB COOPER---'BALD,' PAPER SAYS - Los Angeles Times Apr 29, 1972 - .. search for Cooper, who escaped last Thanksgiving eve from a low flying Northwest Airlines 727 along with two parachutes and 'according to the Bremerton Sun. The newspaper said it learned from a reliable source the FBI is looking for a bald headed "DB but it ... From San Mateo Times (Newspaper) - April 29, 1972, Apr 29, 1972 - FBI agents have been showing residents here a photograph taken in front of a local wig shop and indications are that the suspect could be bald and be wearing a black wig. These are the most recent conclusions of the' FBI in its search for Cooper, who escaped last Thanksgiving eve from a low ... From San Mateo Times (Newspaper) - April 29, 1972,

This is another "out there" theory. Ok, say you're Cooper. You do the caper, and then you're found out pretty quickly. But you tell the FBI "Hey, I'm a white hat, I was doing a penetration test, so you can see the holes in the way you handle these things" Later on, with the McCoy hijacking, radio transmitters were hidden in the chutes for easy location...although McCoy tossed them and used his own, the planes were able to locate the chutes on the ground. You can see how the FBI really wasn't ready for Cooper, but were more ready during '72. The Cooper Vane was eventually installed on all 727s. I was thinking that Cooper might have been able to convince authorities of this "white hat" defense. I'm using terminology that people familar with hackers should relate to, in today's times.

I remember way back when I first landed here at DZ.com, I was reading about guru312's "I am not db cooper" story, and he's also got this there: http://www.aicommand.com/index.html I thought it was so weird sounding. What the heck was that about, guru312?

I was thinking about decomposition of the briefcase and it's predicted contents. We've been told it was a "cheap" briefcase. If I remember right, plastic briefcases were starting to be introduced in the early '70s (I'm thinking about what my dad used over the years). I'm sure there were other manufacture methods (compressed cardboard?), but plastic probably provides the upper limit for decomposition in the exposed NW environment. Here's a case report from 1968 mentioning a plastic briefcase. I wonder if a cheap briefcase would have exploded/shattered on ground impact? New York Miscellaneous Reports - PEOPLE v. SULLIVAN, 57 Misc.2d 208... Loislaw - May 23, 1968 It is undisputed that in the process of making this "inventory", the officer found a closed black plastic briefcase located on the floor of the car and, ... some other mentions of plastic briefcases from that era..hey they're funny, I guess they're Lost&Found Ads.....imagine if Cooper put a "LOST" ad for his briefcase in the newspaper afterwards! These are real from Google News. Daily Review, The (Newspaper) - January 30, 1969, Hayward, California LOST: BLUE plastic briefcase, vicinity Fairway Park. Containing dark glasses and business papers. Call 471-5404. Reward. Independent (Newspaper) - January 20, 1971, Long Beach, California 1813 Newport Blvd., Costa Mesa (714) 642-0450 Licensed tan plastic briefcase. Vic 371 Livingston. Healthy Reward, no Questions. 438-5461.