Zipp0

If he is drinking too, I think they are equally responsible. It's so completely different from a guy who 'slips her a mickey.' There was another news story in my local paper recently where a guy used Ambien as a date rape drug. He told the girl "Take this - it will make your teeth glow." And she took it, no shit. She was 17 or something, but damn, that is pretty dumb. The guy went to jail, thankfully. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

Of course No means No. The issue here seems to be that some women say Yes and the next day think "If I was sober I would have said No to that dude. He was not that hot and my vag deserves some higher quality dick." Sorry, but that is not rape. And she probably didn't complain while raping the poor dudes wallet for free drinks at the bar...... -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

Fixed it for you. I find it interesting that no one is talking about the muzzle being placed on the accuser. If she was so drunk, how does she know that he knew? She was too drunk to consent to sex but sober enough to know that he should have know she was too drunk? Sounds like reasonable doubt isn't an issue here. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

I saw this in the local news: http://www.pennlive.com/newsflash/national/index.ssf?/base/national-88/1184335785231540.xml&storylist=national He says the sex was consensual, she says she was too drunk, and then the other stuff about word bans in the trial. This is a huge double standard, isn't it? What happens if the guy and girl are BOTH wasted, or only the guy is drunk? I know I have woke up in the morning regretting the extra thick beer goggles that I put on the night before, but I sure as shit didn't go crying "rape!!!!" I accepted that drinking too much lead me to do some things(or women) I probably would not normally do. Should you ask your potential partner for a breathalizer before you go for it? Otherwise, how can you really be sure you are not about to become a rapist and then a registered sex offender for life? Can I go back and bring charges against those fatties that took advantage of me and my drinking back in college? -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

I really don't know what to make of it. DPRK uses about 30-35% of its GDP on its military, I wonder if there are new cracks forming in the foundation of the north. (?) It would probably be a good idea to hear them out, whatever it is they have to say. They are usually so confrontational that it's hard to imagine that it would be easy for them to mislead on something like this. My guess is Bush will miss the opportunity, if he even knows the offer was made. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

Are YOU serious? Absolutely I am serious. Are children innocent? Yes, mostly. Are the people living in the village where Bin Laden is hiding who know he is there innocent - not so much. Are American hating future terrorists innocent? Nope. I am not defending Iraq - I want us the hell out of there, and we should not have gone in at all. Our fight was with Bin Laden and his people, and we seem to have forgotten that. As to how many innocents I would sacrifice, I'm not sure. I'd tell everyone within 100 miles of Bin Laden to clear out or die a horrible death, and then I would kill him. Anyone still in the area would have only themselves to blame. And I refuse to believe that we don't know where he is. If that is true, then we are pathetic in the intelligence arena. We simply have not committed the resources to killing him. Instead we wasted half a trillion dollar in Iraq, taking out our former pal Saddam. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

Define innocent. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

Really? You don't think that would be destined to go down in history as the most spectacularly idiotic decision ever made? Or the most brilliant...... who the hell knows. I suppose you have a crystal ball. It was conjecture anyway. What I am saying is that we let him go, and that is totally fucked. And he's not in China anyways. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

If you think for one minute that Bin Laden is not a rally point for this movement, you are mistaken. He planned and executed the most spectacular terrorst act in history against the most powerful nation in history, and got away with it. Besides, I could give 2 shits about what he is doing now. I'd invade China if they were harboring him, to bring him to justice and make him pay for what he did. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

Really? And how long have you been at CIA? -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

That's what YOU think. You should read the PNAC manifesto to see what it's really about. I have read it, believe me. I said SUPPOSED to be about! -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

I know he is not supporting them, but he is also not doing nearly enough. And if he is such a weak leader that he cannot capture terrorists in his own country, then he is not worth spit. The fact is, Bush promised to hunt down Bin Laden, and that is the one thing I support him doing right now. I'd support sending troops into Pakistan. I'd support doing WHATEVER IT TAKES to get Bin Laden. That is what this was all supposed to be about in the first place. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

Yes, and when they get him we will have armed one of our newest and most dangerous enemies. This is the reason for the law against arming leaders who come to power in a coup. Bush pledged to get Bin Laden, and if Musharraf is such a good friend, why would he oppose the USA sending in some forces to get him? Why would he not hand Bin Laden over to us as a gesture of friendship? After all, we are the only thing keeping him in office. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

Oops. On the way to the war on terror we took a left at Iraq and we are still lost. We SHOULD be threatening border incursions into Pakistan if they don't hand over Bin Laden, just like we told the Taliban. Our "good friend" Musharraf is harboring terrorists and pumping them out from the Pakistani madrassas as fast as ever. But no, Musharraf is weak, despite the US propping him up, Pakistan is a nuclear country, and the entire world is not lost on the fact that we support a dictator who came to power in a coup (CIA anyone?). On top of that, we sell Pakistan arms despite a ban on selling any US military items to leaders who came to power in a coup - there is a special exemption for Pakistan. How convenient. Until we deal with Pakistan and their sheltering of Bin Laden, the war on terror is forever lost. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

There are some truly sick fucks out there. I guess I'm wierd, but if a gun toting gangster told me to blow my son(or do something to my daughter), he would just have to go ahead and shoot me, because it isn't going to happen. Also, it's surprising that at least one of the rapists used a condom. That dosen't seem like the SOP for those cases, but I don't know that statistics. Anyway, this is one of the worst stories I have read in quite some time. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

And what if you 'were' to kiss my ass?! I am maybe subconsciously wishing she was in the past......... -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

The Hunt for Red China? -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

I think she's sort of manly, actually. But I'd probably bang her in the rear, and be sure to make it hurt - a lot. Lord knows pencil dicks Limbaugh and Hannity haven't been able to stretch that thing out! -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

Well, be that as it may, these kids now know that "Officer friendly" Is a hoax, and will be much more wary of the police in the future, and probably much smarter in dealing with them. When they see the cops they will do what we did as kids - all run in different directions! -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

Pretty funny saying that after agreeing that nobody knows what happened.... My point is, the 14 year old may have played a lesser role than the older kids, and his name got put right out there before any findings of fact. If he did it he'll go to prison and find out how it feels to be raped. But I wonder- Can a 14 year old really understand how terrible this sort of thing is? I just have no perspective. I was riding dirt bikes and building treehouse forts at 14. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

I saw the video. Children don't need to be treated that way for skateboarding. That dipshit cop used excessive force considering the nature of the infraction. Had they been spraypainting city hall or breaking storefront windows, that would be different. Like I said, if they were my kids, I'd use some excessive force of my own, with extreme prejudice. Or maybe I'd slash the tires on his POS camaro. Whatever. He shouldn't be the cop patrolling the skateboarder beat. Let him try those tactics on some drug dealers - I'd be just fine with that. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

The fact is, you have no clue WHAT happened, nor does anyone else, until a trial. Kids do fucked up stuff under questioning - there are studies that show that many admit to things they did not do for various reasons. And of course it would be different, but the law has the responsibility of sober, impassionate investigation and prosecution. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

If that dude choked one of my kids for skateboarding I'd shoot him right in the fucking head. Scumbag. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

Until you find out in court that the 14 year old, whose DNA you have, was forced at gunpoint to do things he desperately didn't want to do by one of the 18 year old perps, who's name has not been released. There is no way a minor's name should be released for something like this, especially considering the frequency in which cops totally fuck the pooch on these kind of investigations. If it turns out the 14 year old was a victim of rape, how will you feel about it then? How will he feel? I would give him 6 months until he takes his own life. I know I would. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.

First off, I'm not sure that at the time there was any way he coud be certain that outing Plame was not a crime. His job as a prosecutor was to find out all of the details surrounding the case and determine if laws were broken. In that process, Libby perjured himself, thereby obstructing justice and preventing the whole truth from coming to light. He was tried, convicted, and then the president axed the sentence. -------------------------- Chuck Norris doesn't do push-ups, he pushes the Earth down.