Zennie

I'm a programmer by experience, but at my new job I've pretty much been a sysad up to this point. It's cool 'cause I've learned a lot about serious Linux & Windoze administration. I've also learned to appreciate the plight of the sysad. Getting all kinds of server software to play nice on one machine is a royal pain in the a$$. For example, we had this one machine that would start thrashing like mad, bringing it to a crawl. But task manager didn't report anything unusual as far as CPU, memory or virtual memory usage. It tooks days to figure out that our Velocis database and ARCServe were stomping all over each other. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

Yepper! VMWare is set up to basically fake Windoze into thinking it is on its own machine, with its own network connection. So my Linux box has its own static IP and Windoze gets an IP address via DHCP. I can basically do anything I can do if it were sitting stand alone... run Outlook, hit network shared drives, print to our network printers... everything. VMWare is probably the coolest software for the cheapest price (about $250) I've ever seen. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

Hehehe. I just had to sneak that one in. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

A while back I posted a screenshot of my Linux desktop. I've amped it up a bit since then. It's my GNOME desktop (under RedHat 7.2) running Windows 2000 Server under VMWare which is in turn connected to another Linux box via VNC. I could take it a level deeper by Timbuktu-ing into another Windoze box and running VNC from there, but that would be overkill. Oh, and the screen is wide because I'm running dual flat-panel screens. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

I'll be out prolly Friday afternoon & Sunday. I'm pretty easy to spot. I have Yin Yangs all over my FF suit. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

I'll bring the photos next time and show them to you. My guess is that there is an inital drag when the hangers first kick under, but when your upper body matches fallrate with your lower body the base evens out again. I'd like to at least give the non-chest strap methods a try. Can't go any worse than my last hybrid jump did. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

Been busy at work so I'm playing catch-up. Customer service is a thankless and stressful job. You do an excellent job of managing everything. Just remember when things get a little crazy that we all still think you're great! "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

I think it's generally easier to pull than push. Plus if the formation did funnel, I sure wouldn't want to be on my head above it . Most head downers are usually off to the side and holding on with one hand. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

I think this thread is getting close to "Epic" status. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

This issue is being kicked around in the freefly forum, but Jumperpaula suggested we bring it over here for discussion as well. It would be good to get some input from the belly flier's perspective, especially those that have done hybrids before. The issue is basically this... where is the best place for the hanger to take grips? The three places that have been discussed are the shoulder harness where it meets the chest strap, the chest strap, and the leg harness where it meets the main lift web. I dug through all my back issues of Skydiving and Parachutist to study as many hybrid shots as I could. All of the chest strap grips were where the dive had two belly fliers and one hanger. I didn't see any chest grips on dives involving more than one hanger. On the bigger belly bases, it seemed to be evenly split between grips on the shoulder harness where it meets the chest strap and on the leg harness where it meets the main lift web. The bases on which leg harnesses are taken look from the stills to be stable... they don't appear to be being excessively dragged down by the legs. I still like the leg harness approach for a few reasons... 1. It's easier for the hanger to get hold of because there's less reaching involved. 2. There's no worries of a belly flier's chest strap being pulled out. 3. Burble issues are reduced. 4. If a hanger corks, since he/she is further back, he won't slam into the belly base as easily. If he/she doesn't funnel the base, a graceful recovery will be easier. 5. The belly flier's cutaway/reserve handles are too far away to be accidentally grabbed. The more I think about the chest strap approach, especially in light of my own experience, the more I dislike it. Too many bad things can happen. For example, as I fell away I reached up to try and grab the chest strap that I had missed. What if I had accidentally grabbed the reserve handle? It happened incredibly fast and my reaction was more or less instictive. The leg harness approach just seems to make a lot more sense from a logistical and safety approach. My second choice would be the shoulder harness, but that's a distant second. Thoughts? "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

I dug through all my back issues of Skydiving and Parachutist to study as many hybrid shots as I could. All of the chest strap grips were where the dive had two belly fliers and one hanger. I didn't see any chest grips on dives involving more than one hanger. On the bigger belly bases, it seemed to be evenly split between grips on the shoulder harness where it meets the chest strap and on the leg harness where it meets the main lift web. The bases on which leg harnesses are taken look from the stills to be stable... they don't appear to be being excessively dragged down by the legs. I still like the leg harness approach for a few reasons... 1. It's easier for the hanger to get hold of because there's less reaching involved. 2. There's no worries of a belly flier's chest strap being pulled out. 3. Burble issues are reduced. 4. If a hanger corks, since he/she is further back, he won't slam into the belly base as easily. If he/she doesn't funnel the base, a graceful recovery will be easier. 5. The belly flier's cutaway/reserve handles are too far away to be accidentally grabbed. The more I think about the chest strap approach, especially in light of my own experience, the more I dislike it. Too many bad things can happen. For example, as I fell away I reached up to try and grab the chest strap that I had missed. What if I had accidentally grabbed the reserve handle? It happened incredibly fast and my reaction was more or less instictive. The leg harness approach just seems to make a lot more sense from a logistical and safety approach. I'll post this in the RW forum as well. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

Black Knight. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

Sweet pics! Like everyone else said. Great to have you here! Love your Jedei! I look forward to more posts from you in the future. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

I was reading a different article in a differernt context last night and Max referred to mud flaps on the main lift web, so I'm guessing I read it wrong. When we were discussing leg straps vs chest straps, it was pointed out that the belly fliers would get dragged down if you grabbed leg straps. Chest straps are more in line with where the belly fliers are taking grips. The mud flaps on the MLW would still be more forward on the belly fliers but easier to take grips on, so maybe next time we'll try that. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

Hehehe. I haven't been on a zoo load in a while. But yeah, the horse throws ya, you get back on. I just need practice taking the grips. Once we get it, it'll be badass. If we can get a stable, reliable base going, we can start adding stingers & other cool stuff. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

There's a gay or straight quiz on the site as well. I got 9/11 on that one. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

11/16 A couple of those were chicks I pegged as guys. Oh well. My wife did worse than me. She got 9/11. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

Would doing a lot of tracking dives be good training for moving on to wingsuits later? "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

I believe he's talking about the mud flaps on the leg straps. I've examined a bunch of still shots of hybrids and see quite a few leg harness grips. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

Shit. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

Ugh. Don't remind me. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

But that assumes we freaks are organized in the first place. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

The reason I asked question #1 was that I thought I had read that the leg straps were the preferable approach. I dug through my old issues of Skydiving and found an article by Max Cohn in the January 2002 issue. Here's an excerpt on the subject... "Initially, we had the hangers grab the chest strap of each base flier on his or her left and right. After some experimentation, the mud flaps seem to be more beneficial for both the hangers and the base. It is easier to grab and keep the arms closer together for the hangers, and it provides a handful of harness to securely hold on to. For the base, it puts them out of the hangers' direct burble and it alleviates any worry of a chest strap loosening." I'd still like to discuss the pros and cons of the chest strap vs. leg strap approach. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

My first attempt at being one of the hangers in a hybrid dive was pretty much a disaster. A 4-way belly base was built and the plan was for two of us to come in, take chest straps and then key a sit. I got in OK and managed to get hold of one chest strap, but when I let go of the guy on my right to reach in for his chest strap, I went unstable and dropped underneath the formation. Pretty much turned into a zoo load from there. I had initially proposed going for the mud flaps on the leg straps. My position being that they would be easier to get grips on. That was nixed in favor of the chest strap approach. So a couple of questions... 1. Which is generally preferable for taking grips? Chest straps or leg straps? 2. If chest straps are preferable, what's the best approach for getting hold of them (i.e. where should I dock, what's the best way to change out the initial dock to the strap grip)? "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."

Crossposted from the CRW forum... That's right folks! We haven't really had much CRW activity, but that's starting to change. Our own Jumperpaula was part of the first 4-stack built over Skydive Spaceland yesterday. My rig was also part of the stack. Unfortunately I wasn't in it at the time. "Zero Tolerance: the politically correct term for zero thought, zero common sense."