kbordson

I wouldn't trust the judgment of anyone who says its better to drop out than stay in school. In fact I'd consider it a form of child abuse. So don't trust me. Are people who home school child abusers? When my father who had to work on the farm instead of finish his senior year, until the farm was sold and he restarted a year later, did that made my Grandparents child abusers? Think about this - am I now taking a specific situation and saying "but this is ok" to an overall BAD plan.... kinda like taking ONE lil speech and saying "but this one is ok." instead of seeing a big picture view and thinking "this is bad." There are MANY topics where your opinion can vary depending on whether you view it as a specific situation or a general policy. I've viewing this situation as a Government presenting political statement to children in a required venue. THAT is bad.

So you suggest he just recites a nursery rhyme or a bible passage rather than being the leader he was elected to be? You all know what happened when the last presedent sat down and spun a yarn with the kids!! We'll you bloody well ought to anyway! You are kidding with that reply, correct? Otherwise it suggests that the World Trade Centers came down because Former President Bush was reading to children.

You mean state mandated beliefs like kids should stay in school and get a good education? Oh my! That is oppressive isn't it? Home schoolers? Or what about those that have made a success for themselves without a college degree? I might have had quite a few years of post graduate education, but that doesn't mean that I'm better than my Mother or my Husband. Neither of them have a college degree. Is it "better" to stay in school... that's a judgment call. And... I would rather the Government stay out of that judgment.

I have a perfect ability to understand that people have different opinions. I also have not just the ability but am of the mind that a little education and facts go a long way in bringing people TOGETHER on a topic as long as BOTH parties are willing to actually read or listen to what the other person has to say. So far in this thread I've offered up several examples of what Obama is trying to do to support my point of view. Where are yours? As the title dealt with "the Country" and not "Obamas Speech" - I expanded my discussion to include NOT just one speech but government involvement as a whole. My point has less to do with a specific speech. More to do with belief systems in the Government is requiring sponsored "pep talks" to children. As this thread began - I stated it was a trust issue with the government. I didn't pick apart his proposed speech. I have a problem with the Government required infomercial... I just don't think it's right. I've also mentioned discussions that I've had with politicians about other government controls. And countered other side topics that were brought up (like the religion comment or the Presidential Fitness point) and I've stressed that I believe in PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY and not indoctrination to one thought and one mind. That's where my beliefs lie. Where are yours? Your above post seems to say that you think that you've been rational and logical and sound in your responses... but you started your responses with insulting and name calling. Now... I'm not saying that I've been overly respectful of your tone or posts, but I have been willing to say - "ok... you like it, let your children go." However if anyone claims that they would not want to have their children there... they must be "paranoid." So... You've shown where your beliefs lie. People can have "different opinions", as long as, with "a little education", they are willing to change that opinion so that it sounds like yours. So how do you feel about home schoolers? Or private schools? Are they as paranoid? Should they be required to watch this as well? Or should they be exempt? Are we all equal, or are some more equal than others? - well... It's time for me to head to bed. It has been interesting though to read the "tolerant" opinions of some who pride themselves in being "liberal minded."

Going back to the initial title of this thread: "This Country is Coming Apart at Its Seams." Can a Country that was founded on accepting differing beliefs survive? Or should we all be forced to accept the same state mandated beliefs for the sake of the Country? [insert crying women and children to prove a point... doesn't matter what point... just to prove a point]

Do you truly have an inability to understand that others have different beliefs or are you just stirring it up?

Just out of curiosity, are you also suspicious of say, the President's Council of Physical Fitness? Or, is that also some sort of Commie plot to indoctrinate and corrupt American's youth? Just to appease your curiosity - PARENTAL RESPONSIBILITY should play a larger role on a childs growth and development than the government having a "council." Even when it was Arnie. The "say no to drugs" thing in the 80's... nope. Didn't agree with that. My step dad was instrumental in MANY Wisconsin laws that I didn't agree with - Helmet laws on motorcycles; raising the drinking age to 21; supporting government spending on the Miller Stadium.... It's not that the laws were or weren't "good for society." I just don't like Government mandates. It's NOT that it's a "commie plot" - so drop that bullshit. I just believe more in PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY AND RIGHTS. I have had MANY respectful discussions with my step father about these beliefs. He might not have agreed with my opinion, but he was still not so immature to pull such low comments. Do you truly have an inability to understand that others have different beliefs or are you just stirring it up? And here's a question If you had had children, say 6-9 years old and lil mary jane was required to watch a speech by President Bush, what would be your opinion on that? Even if he was "just" going to be talking on "staying in school." edit to add - NOTE: I did NOT select the name mary jane as any insinuation that you may or may not use any illicit substance

Ratings. Sensationalism attracts viewers, so that's where the money goes. It's all about advertising. Advertising? Like a PSA from a Nascar drivers to tell students to watch the President?

Because it's this entire controversy doesn't have a thing to do with what you're talking about. It's a completely artificial piece of bullshit to give people something to bitch about Obama being promoted by people like; Glenn Beck, Bill O'Reilly and Rush Limbaugh. Fucking idiot right wing talking heads would rather have their listeners get fired up about bullshit issues than have an actual discussion about things that actually would help America. Things like kids actually finishing school and getting good educations. I will never in a million years understand how these assholes can do that. I don't listen to Beck or O'Reilly or Limbaugh. I try not to insult those that do believe them. Likewise, I try not to insult those that don't. I am suspicious of government involvement. I have stated that WELL prior to this past election. I am NOT so naive to believe that the government is there to bring bunny rabbits and rainbows. Some chose to be more trusting.... fine. But don't insult those that aren't.

The President's talk is going to be about staying in school and getting good grades. That is the stated purpose of the talk. FAR less controversial than say, "Say no to Drugs." For the love . . . click the above link. What have you been reading or listening to that leads you to believe otherwise? AS I HAVE SAID, I do NOT have any children. So all of this is truly academic discussion on my part. But viewing it from the perspective of a parent that might not trust the government, I can understand their level of distrust with respect to this "talk." I don't know whether the teachers should feel appreciative or insulted by the government telling them what to teach by sending out the teaching guidelines on discussions. I don't know if the parents should be relieved that their children are getting such "quality" government sanctioned education or suspicious. And ... children watching political ads... unless it's bright and animated, you KNOW they generally don't want to be there. If YOU would want to have your children there. FINE. but why do you even give a flying f about what other parents would want with their children? Get over yourself. Other parents don't have to follow your lead. She can or can not breastfeed as she desires. They can or can not raise them as Catholic or Jewish or Islam or Wiccan. They can encourage Republican or Democrat or Independent beliefs. They can home school to avoid ALL this drama. Or they can be selective in the exposures that they subject their children too. WHEN DID WE START CRITICIZING PARENTS FOR WANTING TO RAISE THEIR CHILDREN BEST THEY CAN?! Oh yes... there have ALWAYS been judgmental peoples out there - as evidenced by this entire forum. So lets get more government involvement cuz that will surely fix it. Right?

But, this isn't "Free Speech" - this is the Government requiring children to listen to politics. Children old enough to be studying PoliSci - fine. But younger ones, nope.... With respect to your religious topics - If lil susie wants to pray, fine. But if Pope Benedict XVI wanted to speak with all the children, I'm sure that wouldn't be labeled by anyone as "Free Speech."

Not having children myself, I can only speculate on what parents might feel... But IF someone that I didn't trust wanted committed school time... time that they should be learning math, science, English... to preach their political OR religious values, I would not be happy about that. It's not a matter of being "bothered" but nice of you to try to devalue their opinions.

And there is a name for them; PARANOID. WTF? Since when is that even vaguely appropriate? Not in my lifetime. But... ya know. If you would rather revert to name calling, go for it. It really adds to an understanding of those that might think differently from you.

And there is a name for them; PARANOID. WTF? Since when is that even vaguely appropriate? Not in my lifetime. Ya know... just because you might have complete trust that the government is there to help, but that doesn't mean that every one is. When I was in the military, I expected a level of oversight by the Government. Being a Free Citizen, it's none of their business.

It's a trust issue. Not everyone trusts the government. Not everyone wants political speeches to be directed at their children. Not everyone believes that this will be a "state of the nation" type speech, rather a required infomercial on how to be a good "supporter."

Nicely put post and I like that quote!!

How can you have any pudding if you don't eat yer meat?

OHHH. You deleted it. I was replying to it... and poof..... gone.

You know you owe me.

(think about if she can use the "work related knowledge" some how.... probably not. )

Hey... she's a spinner.

Don't have youtube at work just watched BrianSGermain's Beyond Fear.....feeling more at peace with the world.

Lets make the day start at midnight... since I was up and on call. Since I was up, I did CME (continuing medical education) until 1am. GOT TO SLEEP FOR A COUPLE HOURS!!

It's funny how you mis-spelled "sacred" as "scared". Perhaps they should be! I've seen what they become!! Those sacred lil buggers SHOULD be scared.

I hope that's a typo. 'Cause the only thing MINE are scared of is daylight. they are scared sacred