Ron

Save your money... Pay off your debt. The WFFC is not going anywhere, but you CAN get deeper into debt. Pay off that debt as fast as you can. Finish the program, get a B for next year and have a GREAT time knowing that you can jump there, AND that you are debt free. Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

How are we not agreeing here? We are saying the same thing. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Yep, but the size and even the shape of the slider needs to be taken into account. If you just make it bigger you create other problems. By Doming it you can have the same size and shape, but more AREA....And it is the area that holds the slider at the top of the canopy. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

So maybe you should change this to MIRAGE can suck your left RIGHT nut? Edit to make Rem happy Happy Rem? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Ya think the TWO years might have had a factor here? How about if they had video on all the AFF jumps, and coaching jumps? You are telling me that ONE more tandem made that big of a difference...That I don't buy. The quality of the instructors (and Roger has good instructors)...Has TONS to do with it. Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You just said that a conical with the same DRAG has less SURFACE.... So I would think that if you had the same base size say 12"X 12" and one was flat, and the other was conical....That the conical would have more drag. How is this not correct? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Zen...Is it my fault you finally think correctly about a subject? Do you have any statistics on the number of people that don't roll their eyes when you bring it up Vs the number that do roll their eyes? What is the acceptable number of eye rolls? Without this info I don't think we can make such broad accusations. HE,HE Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Why is it I feel that if I had said this...I would be "Gay Bashing"....? I don't know about that statement (nor do I really care since I am not gay). But while I have heard this before...It sounds very slanted. A question for you...What do you think of the Gay high school? ...You can PM me if ya like. Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

A dome slider HAS more surface area than a regular slider. It has extra material that creates a pocket. A pocket slider has pockets that increase the surface area, and catch more air. Canopies do not "Scale" well....The slider may actually be larger on your 55 scale wise as to your other canopy. But at any rate wings do not scale 1 to 1. I learned this back when I built R/C airplanes. You can't take a full sized airplane and scale it down (well you can, and several people did) It most of the time does not fly at all the same. So, it is very possible that your 55 slider is larger based on the scale. You fiqure that they would also have to scale the "extra" material to make the dome slider as well as just the L & W. Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Now...I see a difference between the two...Princeton agrees. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Anal??? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You every have a sinus squeeze? I have had one...They suck ass. I had a teammate at the Nationals come down CRYING and he stopped jumping. While in AFF, I would not do anything that was not "right". Way to much going on for him to think about anything else, and he (no offense) does not have enough experience to be able to handle wierd shit like this in freefall yet. You at 200 jumps would probley be fine, but he may not be. Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

The thing is whats gonna happen here? Nothing! USPA will not do anything, and the FAA does not care. (You don't have to be a member of the USPA, or follow BSR's in the US). And I know plenty of jumpers that went through the AFF course and didn't really have a clue...They just checked the right blocks. Does that really make them safer? I know a guy that had a rating from another country, but not the USPA....Is he unsafe? While I don't think its a good idea....We already know it happens. USPA knows and once again does nothing about it. The FAA does not care about it. So if you are unhappy vote with your feet. But they are not doing ANYTHING ILLEGAL. They are just not following the rules of a volluntary orginization. That has show that it has no balls...Whoop de fucking do! I don't follow the rules of the NRA....I'm not a member. If you don't like it, don't go there...But there is nothing wrong with it. Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I did.. You really should not bother....You are young in the sport. You think its the best thing in the world, and you want to share it with others.... Others don't care, they think you are nuts, and they wish you would stop pestering them about it. Trust me. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Sneak up on them and yell BOO!!!! Why???? I tried to get my best friend to jump when I had a few jumps....He never did...In fact I found it easier to get new best friends. It is NOT SAFE! It never will be. And the plane ride is safer. How about not forcing the issue? If they want to jump, great help them...But it seems they don't want to and probley never will want to. I realize that you are all happy with the sport...but not everyone is...And frankly I don't want everyone to do it. Some people should never jump. Don't try to force the issue. And never forget that IT IS NOT SAFE!!!!!! Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Was it Ground? Or Express? Eric wrote a very good explination of the FedEx services (He works as a Ramp Agent for them). But if it was Express....Did you send it 1,2,or 3 day? With the scan of "Not Due For Delivery"....It sounds like you sent it cheap. Did you really expect to get it next day if you paid for 3 day? That would be like me going to the Chevy dealer and paying for a Chevette, and expecting a Corvette. PM me the Tracking# and I will look into it. Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I coach both solo RW and 4way. In freefall and in the tunnel. If a jumper walks up to me and asks for a coaching jump. I would expect my slot covered. I don't expect additional money. If they want to offer it...I'll gladly accept it, or if they want to give me a beer later thats cool also. But I can't afford to do my 4 way training, and jump with everyone also. If a group wants me to go to the tunnel and coach them...I expect to be paid for my time. I have to drive to and from the tunnel, and put miles and gas in my car. If a group wants me to coach them 4way for the day...then I charge. For that they get me all day...Just them. I don't do Tandems,train, fun jump or anything else. If I am standing on the DZ and someone needs help..Its free, hell I have spent half a day helping for free before. But when I wanted to leave and go see a movie I could. Realize that I have paid A LOT of money to get where I am. I still pay coaches. My team just flew with Joey Jones in the tunnel and we paid him for his time....Why would I not charge for my time? If you fiqure that freefall time is about 1,000 per hr. I have spend 40,000 on jumps alone. I try to give back as much as I can. If I am fun jumping I'll jump with anyone. But if someone wants coaching I ask my slot be covered. Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

9 years in the sport. 3000 jumps 333 per year. However I only did 500 over 3 years thanks to Uncle Sam, and that kinda blows my average some. Out of those jumps, only 200 or so are "work" jumps. Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

No we agree like you said... You plan to avoid. I plan just in case I can't...Cause I was not able to twice. Place your arms in front of your face. With your elbows together, and your wrists together. Put your chin into your chest and your wrists on your forehead. To be at the right angle of approach with your canopy you might need to reach above your toggles, or even grab the lines and wrap them around your hand. Feet and legs together and plan to PLF until you stop. If you get caught in the tree, and are STOPPED try to grab on to the trunk, or a large branch. Don't be a hero and climb down...just chill. If you can get the canopy to come straight down you will be fine. With trees it is mostly forward movement that gets ya. Or worse hitting a tree, and having the canopy collapse and being dropped out of the tree....With a vertical descent it is not that bad...Lines and fabric almost always catch something, if not just PLF at the bottom. Tree landings thanks to the 82nd Airborne. Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I think we have reach the big difference between you and I anyway. And the point I was trying to get across....And you should agree since you have had a 500 foot reserve pull... Is that there are times you don't have the option other than the one right below you...And you don't have the time to really think it out. You make some good points about the roof and the trees... And I have the same kind of thoughts....Many people would be alive if they had just taken the tree landing insted of the turn. I am not trying to change your mind....Hell I don't really care. But for the others reading this thread...When you say that you have to make good choices...I agree...But I also have to point out that sometimes you get stuck with no options. Having a few ideas in your head such as I'll land in the trees...or the roof...Are good. However, and I am sure you know this...that landing a 72 in a tree is in no way going to be pretty....The 106 will hurt, but you most likley will live. Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

What jumps? If these students are done with the 7 levels...Then a coach, or even a good RW guy with the S&TA's blessing can jump with them... Until they have a license they are all "Students". "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Well you said I missed your point...which I didn't...You said that a 12 X 12 was not likley...and I agreed. I have pulled my reserve as low as 600 feet...Now why I did this is another story, but I had less than 15 seconds till I landed ,And I had to kick out of line twists from my "gunslinger" reserve pull.....I pretty much landed right above where I was...which BTW was a tight little area with trees all around. It was not larger than 30 X 20. I had to fly between two of the trees (end cells almost hitting them) to be able to get in there. Now if I had been 100 feet higher I would jave made a nice large field...But I didn't have the 100 feet. I have great video of the whole thing.....From the camera guy above me. Bigger is better...just ask any girl. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Again proof its easy to be hard....but smart comes later. Thats good progress. Again I have to ask WHY???? Will you not learn to stay jumping and be safe? If you like, you could have Beth bring both herself and the canopy over...I could jump them both for ya if ya like I mean jump the canopy, and jump WITH her. ZHills is fine....Tell Beth we miss her, and hope to see more of her soon (take that both ways). And I guess you could come along if you must Be safe...I'll keep an eye out for you now. Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Hey Bobby!!! Hows the gimp thing comming along? For those who don't know...Maynard here is a tri-athelete. He really screwed himself up riding a bike....I thought the idea of exercise was to get in BETTER shape? So, tell your girlfriend I asked "Hows my baby doll?" For those that don't know Beth....Well you are missing out. I still don't know how Maynard here got her...Makes me think there is hope for a guy like me. Ron "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I could see two if the student screwed up (Like forgot to pull the stingy thingy, or just could not get the grasp of canopy flight). But 2 is not that bad. I have seen programs that have 3 and 4 Tandems...It just seems like a waste. Again, I like the way Roger did things. I am sure he had his reasons for two. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334