Ron

You can call it what you like...I think it showed class. I think it was a classy thing to do....He gets my respect for that choice.

I try to reason with people....One of my pet peaves is people who get on the plane not being geared up....BTW yes I have done it, I was stupid, but I am talkinga bout the folks that want to be "cool" and always get on with all their shit loose. I was fortunate to be jumping with some legends of the sport two years ago turkey meet in Zhills. There was a young talented jumper and he was standing in the bording area...Leg straps loose, chest strap not done. I walked up to him and pulled him aside. I asked him to look around. We had two Airspeed Members, Derrick Thomas, and others with thousands of jumps standing out there. I asked him if any of them were cool...He said they were. I asked him how many of them were not geared up...Answer was none. Another guy was getting on the plane...Same story all his shit hanging around. I asked him this simple question. "If at 1,200 feet the pilot tells all of us to get the hell out of the plane NOW....Do you think any of us are going to wait for you to get your gear on before we exit?" He said no. I said, "We are gonna go over, around, or push you out as we race to the door....Do you want to be in freefall with all your shit hanging off?" I have no problem with getting a gear check....My dumb ass has climbed out before with a chest strap undone around jump # 30. Since then I have been anal about checking gear...you may not know it, but if I can see you, I have checked your gear. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You are a local. Locals get treated differently than visitors at most DZ's...It should not happen, but it does. Once at Zhills I saw a (non local) guy getting on the plane with his rig over his shoulders and legstraps not on at all. I asked him to at least put his legs through his legstraps. His response? "What are you my fucking Mom?" My response? "No, but she called and told me to tell you to quit acting like a jackass and put your gear on." "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

http://www.cnn.com/2005/ALLPOLITICS/03/06/bush.clinton.ap/index.html I'll say it...Clinton showed class. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Uh, your quote was: So you want the Repubs to fail as long as people odn't die...But it seems pretty clear you want the Repubs to fail. Short sighted as hell to wish the world hates the US to try and make your party look good. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

For evey scary SL exit, I can sho you a scary situation with AFF. No program is perfect and both can teach you to skydive or kill you. I would send my kids SL. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Used them when I didn't have a belt.... Used them as handcuffs during sex. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I have asked questions and so far NO ONE has answered the "How much is it gonna cost?" question. Or the "Is this a not for profit, or for profit organization?" As for me not being qualified to coach.....Well if thats what you want to think as the motivation...Feel free. This thread http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1314150#1314150 Makes me think thats not the case. But feel free to think what you like "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I don't like the idea. You don't need a license to buy a car, and like Kennedy said there are not a few nut jobs trying to confiscate all the cars in the US. What I would LOVE to see is a gun saftey course taught in Elementary school, JR high and High school....Of course that will not happen. People always seem to be for education not regulation until it is about something they don't like...Such as guns. If guns are such a problem, why not teach about them? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I am 100% FOR requiring training to carry. Right now I think the rules are even a little slack. I am OK with requiring a registration to carry.... I am NOT OK with listing what type or serial number of the weapon I will carry and I WILL NOT give anyone a "list" of the weapons I have. As long as I am not carrying them...Its no ones business what or how many I have. I have no problem being tested, and being certified to carry. But I DON'T want my weapons listed so they can come get them later. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Yes I teach spotting. I take some folks to a Cessna DZ and give them a class and let them take turns spotting. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I like your other version....bounce by a kid and yell "Your fault" "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I understand I have more "juice"....But to be honest it does not matter. I have guys with 50 jumps and 5000 jumps yelling at me. (More 50's than 5000's to be honest.) But the thing is simply this...Its your life. I'd rather get yelled at than land off. The amazing thing about planes is they can do these things called "Go Arounds" You can't. So the next time some dude is yelling at you to go...Let him take your slot and get out. Don't yell, just step aside and let them go. Make sure you are really not gonna make it back, or they will claim you are a moron...But if they do gladley tell them that the extra time they took getting out and going...Made the spot OK. Don't let others write checks with your body. The BEST method to prevent this....? REALLY learn to spot, become good at it. After a while people will know you have a clue and will shut up. If I see a guy looking out and the spot is bad...I tend to tell the folks it is fucked...If its good I tend to nicely tell the guy he will be fine. Planning on pulling high is a sign of a bad spot. Pulling high should be used only to unfuck a bad spot. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Well said. I think we all know people who claim to know/be more than they are....I don't understand those people I had a friend of mine, Ranger, SF, Delta.... I made the comment one day about how he likes violence. His comment? "I don't like violence, but it is my job and I am good at it. I have to be." "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Follow along: The 9/11 comparison is good. The comparison was about people just sitting around doing nothing, or taking action. On only one of the flights on 9/11 did they rise up and fight back. THATS how 9/11 was brought into this. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Do you think the judge who had her family killed feels that way? It is a simple matter of scope. I loose one friend a year....It might be cause I know lots of skydivers. I only know one guy ever to be killed by a car when he was walking. I guess that means that more people die skydiving than hit by car huh? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

How much time do you want? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Its in SC..Its what happens to all threads here "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I like the idea for Hetero, or Homo.... "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

I like it...I am a BID fan of personal responsibility....Of course since its coming from me someone will accuse me of "Gay bashing". Edit...OK, I have a question...How do you prove who is the daddy...Who infected who? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Did I ask you anything along those lines? Nope you stuck your nose in a different conversation about a different topic that was not addressed to you or about you and got upset. If I did ask suck a loaded question please point it out....I'll wait. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Good point. But my stance has always been to have on in cases where I might need it...I don't assume I will need it all the time. In that case I might have been killed visiting my friend the judge, but my parents and my friend are also armed. My Dad is 65 and knows he can not fight a 20 year old, and my buddy is a redneck. While I *might* get into trouble at the judges house...There are some risks I am willing to look at and take. But you are correct I might have been toast at the judges...All this proves is that I am not paranoid and I don't feel the NEED for a weapon....I like the chance of having a fair shake in situations that I feel are dangerous. Sorry you are correct I did miss it. I am sorry. You don't NEED a gun...You don't NEED an AAD. But most skydivers like the idea of an AAD for protection...The same is said for a good number of people who carry a gun...They don't NEED it, but they like the idea of having it... It is better to have it than not need it than need it and not have it. Yes, in BOTH cases there are people who will use the fact they have one (AAD or weapon) to do stupid stuff...Both groups are idiots. Rule one in the military was not to have your finger on the trigger till you are ready to kill. So a finger movement would not mean much of anything...Also I have already said I am not a fan of just anyone Carrying a weapon. Also most GOOD guns require a good trigger pull. My carry piece is DA only and you really have to pull to get it to fire. In the story the intruder saw they had two people with swords....If they did not have the swords they guy may not have been so quick to leave. They are not that different..Both were meant for only one thing...to kill. You may say that a sword is pretty, but Dave would say his Kimber is beautiful. BTW I have both guns and a sword...I took Iato years ago, and Kendo. I don't feel the NEED...but do you jump without an AAD? Its kinda the same thing to me...Both are backups if the shit hits the fan. I have both an AAD and a gun.....I don't plan on using either, but I like the idea that if I screw up and need it...Its there. I don't live in fear of bouncing or getting shot. I live my life and skydive the same if I have a gun or AAD or not. I hope no one does...but if it does happen I hope I picked that day to be armed..Even if I don't shoot and kill the guy...I'd rather have that option than not have it and need it. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Oh, uh....Damn, thats gonna hurt. Maybe I should just buy you a beer? Its both fast AND mentally hard... "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

where? Did "I" say it? For gays or for people with HIV? Big difference. And them attacking when people ask questions or differ in opinion only hurts their cause more. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

No, but they saw the terrorist killing people. Even one flight saw the pilots killed. Read the report? The good parts on another post of mine...They all had a clue, but they didn't do anything. You don't tend to kill the pilots in a nomal hijacking... People on all the flight had a clue..Only the last flight *knew*. Quote "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334