Ron

No, they are not. They just have a bunch of stupid laws all around them that drive up the price and make you jump through a bunch of hoops to own them. All of the laws were designed to prevent "certain types" of people to be able to own them. However "other types" were allowed to own them all day. In 1934 the National Firearms Act added a 200 dollar tax onto items that cost 3.00 to 100 bucks. It was nothing more than a way to prevent the poor from being able to afford them since it was about the average monthly wage of a Detroit auto worker. In today's dollars it would be about 3,200. The 1968 law made it harder for "certain types" of people to buy firearms. And that they had to have a "sporting purpose" A provision to make hunters happy, but prevent the general populace form having weapons that were best for self defense. The 1986 Huges Amendment banned the importation or manufacture of new machine guns. But the current ones are still perfectly legal. All that did was jack up the prices so only the "rich" again could afford them. The 1989 "Bush Ban" made it so imports were not allowed...Again really doing nothing but raising the prices out of the range of "certain" people. The 1994 AWB was a ban that went against weapons that according to the DOJ were used in less than 4% of crimes. It was "feel good" legislation that served nothing and no one. When it sunset 10 years later....Despite cries of sure death on the streets....Nothing happened. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

DC has more gun crime than any city in TX. Go fish. Really??? How many shootouts have happened at gun shows and gun stores verses places that have gun bans...Like schools? Because criminals steal things. Criminals also steal cars and use them in crimes....Should we outlaw cars then? You of all people should not make that claim. You dodge answering questions anytime someone asks you a question. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Care to discuss the issue and not make childish insults? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Makes me wonder if he read this: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/world-news/article14086308.ece "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

That smacks of extreme arrogance. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Your attempt at being obtuse does not suit you. The definition that is being discussed is less violence now than a few years ago. And the worst part is you KNOW that, but like always you tap dance around the subject. Care to answer the question that has been asked? Or will you tap dance and BS some more? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

That was not part of your original argument....You claimed he could not dare ask you since he had not served...I DID serve, so I asked. What is your excuse NOW? Incorrect, I supported the invasion based on the data that I had at the time...You know, kinda like HRC and most of Congress did as well. I think that you cannot force a people to be democratic at the barrel of a gun and they have a provisional govt in place so we should hand it over to them. But I digress....You made a claim that he could not ask since he had not served...I did, so I asked. Now you back peddle even more? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

And if criminals can still get them after something is banned (think drugs)...Then what possible good is it to prevent a citizen from legally owning something? Mines are indiscriminate killers. A gun takes active participation. Explosives are fine for people to own IMO. *I* don't see much reason to own them, but others do not see the reason to jump out of perfectly good airplanes. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

OK, I severed in the Infantry. So...I'll ask the question: Do you think Iraq is as bad as it was in 2004? A yes or no will do. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

To prove that, you would have to produce data that states that CCW people are more likely to commit violent crimes. That data does not exist; in fact the data says the opposite. I do not see how anti gun folks cannot make the simple connection that legal gun owners are not the problem. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You entire argument seems to support the right of the people to own them then. Your argument shows that an assault weapon is an object, not an evil device. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

All I did was ask a question that highlighted your double standards. You get upset at any limit on the 1st, yet demand more limits on the 2nd. Not my fault you got upset. I think pointing out how upset you are on restrictions on this Amendment, yet your wishing more restrictions on another Amendment is a valid point to be brought up. And...You, not I, started the personal attack BS. I attacked your *position* you made a lame attack on *me*. I fail to see how you can bemoan a limit on one Amendment...Yet almost demand more limits on one you do not care about. I am ON TOPIC...You just don't like how it makes you feel. I said I was against the billboard being taken down...But that I found it funny that people like you are up in arms about this, yet willing to ignore another Amendment. Totally ON TOPIC. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

This comment from you: I then asked if you knew the difference between trying to prevent a crime and being hired to commit one. You then danced around till I got tired watching. Really...You would think you would just be honest instead of the BS song and dance you always give when you are proven wrong. According to the parties involved, one made the claim that there was a crime happening, one saw the data and thought a crime was happening, the police and justice system believe that the participant that acted to prevent the crime acted correctly given the situation. I guess you would have just sat and watched your wife getting raped to make sure she was not lying to you. Man up and answer and stop the BS dodge tactics. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Out of intellect so soon that you have to resort to lame personal attacks? Not my fault you do not like being called out on your double standards. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Actually, I think both are pretty universal. With few exceptions such as yelling fire in a crowded theater, or a felon owning a firearm....I think both should not be infringed. I just do not get how Quade and others can get upset about the trampling on one of the Amendments; yet demand more trampling on another. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Nonsense, your history shows otherwise. Boulder dash, you do not like the question since it spot lights your double standards in reguards to the Amendments. You mean the kind of person who calls you out when you show a double standard? Like what? Who is being argumentative and making assumptions now? All I am doing is showing your double standard. You have no problem thinking the 1st should have no limits, but are fine with limiting the second as you see fit. Don't blame me for your double standard. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

1. You don't pull a weapon you do not intend to use. This shows to me your lack of firearms experience. You might have well as said something crazy like, "He should of shot the truck keys out of his hand". 2. You were there? So you know what the situation was? The police and justice system seems to think he acted in a reasonable manner given the data they have...And I bet they have a bunch more info than any of us. I am all for responsibility, but this guy was told by his wife that she was being raped while he saw a guy on top of her. I guess you would just have sat back and watched? Texas law allows the use of deadly force to prevent a rape. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Got it...YOU brought it up, but when called out on it you refuse to answer. Typical for you. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Try not to show your hypocrisy when you are willing to piss away some rights in the Constitution, but get upset when others are trampled on. You support the 1st, yet wish to piss on the 2nd. If you can't see the topic is the Constitution...Well, I can't help that. Some support ALL of it....It seems you only support parts you like. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

You are STILL avoiding answering the question. Like normal you avoid answering things that proves your point is silly. Do you, or do you not admit that there is a difference between trying to stop a crime and being hired to commit one? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

And we will no matter what laws are passed. One book I read said that the death penalty does not work since it takes so long. You were more likely to die on the street in Chicago than on TX's death row. Of course there is no good solution to speed things up and not increase the chances of wrongful execution. Just look at making drugs illegal and how well that worked, or how prohibition worked. Yet people still think making something illegal will have any real effect? And the things they target. The AWB made illegal weapons that were used in LESS than 4% of crimes. The Huges Amendment made it illegal to make Machine Guns...But legal Machine Guns have been used in TWO crimes in 74 years. It is pretty clear that all of this is based on emotion, not on facts. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

THIS discussion? None. But you have a history you know. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Still avoiding the question huh? Would it kill you to be honest just once and not dodge simple questions? Rape is. He was told she was being raped. Do you not recognize a difference between stopping a crime and being hired to commit one? If so, then your other bit was nothing more than an emotional distraction. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

Actually, I do not think you would stand by and do nothing. As much as you think I hate you...I don't. As much as you think I do not respect you in some areas...You would be wrong there as well. I don't agree with some of your opinions. And I disagree with your tactics like name calling when you disagree with people....But, outside of that, I do think you are honorable in almost every other parameter. That is why I don't understand why you have an issue with this guy. I could see you doing almost the exact same thing if someone said they were being raped in front of you. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

No, but rape is. He was told she was being raped. Again, care to answer the question...Do you not recognize a difference between stopping a crime and being hired to commit one? "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334