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So you do not want the government to be able to ban substances outright? This is a different argument from the one that is going on in this thread. In fact, I agree with you. This is a good point. I have used a bad example with rigging. The reasons behind decisions in rigging can perhaps be explained in laymans terms with a small loss of precision and little introduction of confusion. Still, it's almost impossible to do that in highly technical, general fields that have taken hundreds of years to develop. Even if a layman reads through a drug study, s/he will not have the requisite knowledge about the other drugs this study uses and will need to go through 4 years of reading to be able to truly understand what's going on. Unless the layman does this, there will be inaccuracies, misunderstandings and confusions that will cloud his/her decision and may lead to injury and death. Personal responsibility is all nice and good, but consuming dangerous substances because the doctors did not give you an explanation you deem adequate is just stupid. In the exact same way that bying a Stiletto 120 at 50 jumps despite what everyone says is stupid. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Ok, so you're putting the qualifications of the people who made this decision into doubt? Or are you putting the reasoning behind their decisions into doubt? -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

I doubt that there isn't a single doctor on this board, but I haven't read any posts where someone states their qualifications and clarifies the results of scientific studies. Because of your qualifications, you know better than I do that a layman cannot really read a drug study and understand it. Yet here we are arguing over the decisions of people who are infinitely many times more qualified than we are. This sounds a lot like the proverbial jump wonders argument. Doctors are not Gods, but the right doctor sure as hell knows more about Ephedra and all of it's effects and interactions than me. And I'm betting that there aren't any people involved in this argument that are such doctors. If a rigger says my rig is unsafe I will not jump it. If a doctor says that Ephedra is unsafe I will not consume it. Same thing. Respecting experience is not the same thing as blindly following authority. That's not true. If I give you a book on non-commutative ring algebra you will not be able to read it without years of prior education. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Government? Or doctors working through the government? I still stand by my statement that noone here is a doctor and is qualified to speak on the subject. Hearsay, anecdotal evidence, and amateur chemistry are really bad reasons to take banned substances. However, I do agree that the ban is a knee jerk reaction and is pretty silly. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Skydiving: 1. At least one of: i) Become a Coach 1 and Instructor A. ii) Go to the tunnel and learn to freefly with the big boys. 2. Fly a wingsuit. 3. Spend all my money School: 1. Get off my ass and try to develop at least one of my ideas in math. 2. Stop slacking and get back on the honors list. 3. Help out with some of the student clubs. 4. Try to become a research assistant in the summer. 5. STOP SLACKING OFF!!!

Alright, what is this argument about? We have the anecdotal evidence of "it worked for me, so it's ok" on one side. On the other we have people who say that all drugs should be freely available. On the third we have people who don't care what the doctors say and are convinced it's all a conspiracy. I thought we were all better than that. Are any of you doctors? Or do you think doctors are not needed? Do you drive cars you assembled yourself? Do you jump rigs you've sown together yourself? Does anyone here have the qualifications to argue anything about this drug? Why don't we all start an argument over whether the integral of e to the minus x squared is equal to the root of pi, it would have just about the same productivity. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Now THAT is irony! -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Which is yet another demonstration of the physicists' favourite saying: "There is no free lunch." Pardon the unintentional pun. At least currently there is no free lunch. Maybe there will be safe working diet pills, who knows? -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Haha, hey Lou, what's up? You mean STI opens in February? There are plenty of dropzones open all year. In fact, I've done 7 jumps this weekend, all from 10,500 PST, Burnaby and Dunnville all jump when there's enough people there. Feel free to drop by the PST any weekend that's not snowed in, I'll probably be there. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

You sound jealous. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

He's in Africa. Maybe there's a Zephyrhills in Africa? Edited to add: What's going on here? -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Many drugs should not be sold over the counter, and for good reasons. If Ephedra has a medical benefit but with a high rate of serious side effects, it should not be an over the counter drug. Banning it completely, however, is a typical knee jerk reaction. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Two words: night jumps! Ok, three words: maybe night jumps -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

You were supposed to bring some! -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Hey, at least I tried Ivan should be here in 3... 2... -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Ivan's line, but your boobies? -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

looks around Who, me? Why, I resemble that accusation! -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Dodgecar? -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

You can code in .NET? Would you marry me? -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Who, you and todd? -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

That's not a sport. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

You todd did? -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Nah. Now freefall bowling, that's extreme -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

It is very dangerous in the sense that there are dozens of ways you could get killed if you make a mistake. I think that something that is dangerous by itself and requires considerable effort to be made safe is still dangerous. For instance, flying a shuttle is dangerous, as we all know. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

The midnight BODY paint team -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.