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I see what you're saying. However, there should be a lot of people who can do the grindstone work. Since the job market is competitive, just like any other market, this should drive the amount of money they earn down. It's being artificially forced to not work this way, and, in my opinion, this was one of the main reasons for the dot com bust. The earnings should factor in not only the amount of work done, but the difficulty of the work and hence the availability of workers. The McDonalds cashiers keep the company running, but you're not paying them 85k a year for a reason. Sure, it's a bit of an extreme comparison, but I think it makes my point. Anyway, this thread has too many posts by me in too short a time

I did not say all. But there are large groups who write very simple frontends for databases, for instance. In this case all the work has been done by a small group of competent programmers. Plonking down some controls in Visual Basic and flooding message boards with questions about incorrectly assigned properties that are described in the documentation is not worth 85k a year. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

My question was addressed to tunaplanet, but I'm glad you answered it. Your credentials should add more weight to the point we're trying to make. To anyone who says that pilots are biased, let me tell you this. I've been working as a programmer for the last 4 years and I will be the first to tell you that most programmers are grossly overpaid, including me on many occasions. It's not true that all professionals are biased towards their professions. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

You're the best, quade. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

I have a very simple question. If he ignores it, then we will all understand his place in this argument. Have you ever flown an airplane? (edited for grammar) -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

First, let your instructors know that you're nervous. When in the plane look at the horizon and smile. If you feel worse, close your eyes and take three deep breaths (this really works, I use it all the time). Something that personally helped me is learning some silly jokes about skydiving and telling them on the way up. You're not nervous if you're laughing. Most importantly though, tell your instructors. They know you personally and will be present on your jump. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

The numbers are so huge that it's impossible to even imagine. Unfortunately, construction in those parts will not improve, even after this. Noone is going to rebuild all of those ancient buildings. It's only a matter of time before this happens again. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Me today getting ready to do a jump with the person who took the pictures. The jumpsuit has earned me the nickname "flamer" at this dz I don't photograph well. I also don't care, so here you go. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

There's an algebraic geometry prof at my uni that is obsessed with Dr Seuss. He warned us about such things as the Too Many Daves problem. He's cool. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Merry Christmas, hag sameah, and a happy new year everyone. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Ah, the obligatory military example. People who save other people should be rewarded. It is also commendable not to save people for a reward. There are a lot of underpaid professions, I agree. Still, a profession that takes years and tens, if not hundreds, of thousands of dollars to train and carries a lot of responsibility should be paid for accordingly. Just because some such professions are underpaid does not mean that other such professions are overpaid. It's just that some people get what they deserve, and some don't unfortunately. Though $300,000 a year may be a bit much, true. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

I agree about teachers needing good money. To become an airline pilot, one needs to be very very dedicated. One needs to invest enormous amounts of your own money and years of your life into training. You are responsible for hundreds of people on every flight, hundreds of thousands of lives over your total career. You are required to perform with perfect precision under the worst pressure imaginable. How much would you pay a surgeon? Now, how much would you pay a surgeon that uses machines as tools? If airliners are so easy to fly, why aren't you flying one? -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

What he really means is that he got sca-a-ared skydiving, but he's too big of a man to admit it -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Is that really your bum?! No way! -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Keep in mind also that, more than likely, they need a particular type of terrain. It is more than possible that the terrain they need is simply unavailable in the US. Or, like oil, it's available but reserved. BTW, lots of American movies are shot in downtown Toronto because it looks the same and is cheaper. Why don't you complain about those? -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

I second the billvon motion. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

You know what is new and good? Audioslave. I'm not a big fan of RAtM, but Audioslave is excellent. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

I think I know why it's not working for you -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Ohohoh, me me me! http://www.snopes.com/cokelore/santa.asp -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

It's a toss up. One is the time I went on a sitfly jump with someone before I could sitfly at all, corked, and ended up about 200ft above them and 20ft away from them when they pulled. I was too inexperienced to be able to get into a stable track in a split second, and he was already waving off when I saw him. I could read the "Wings" stitching on his container when he went past me. Taught me a good lesson about going places I'm not ready to go. The other is a freefly coach dive, also for sitflying. I had a spinning problem, and I was fighting the spin. Too much wrong input, the spin gets hard. I ball up, but I'm on my side. Side spin! I finally went flat when the world started compressing into a small point of light on the horizon. Spent the entire dive from 13k in an arch waiting for my head to stop spinning. It was still spinning when I landed. My coach was... a little worried. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Join the dark side! -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

So everyone else can send it to everyone else EXCEPT hookitt! So we all lose by exactly one point! Aaarrggghhh! Aren't pyramid schemes grand? -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Ok, since so many people seem to still have trouble with this fallacy, I'll try putting the explanation in different words. You have correctly calculated (24999/25000) ^ 25000 to be the probability that I will have a dmal in my next 25000 jumps. (The binomial distribution is irrelevant because you can only have one dmal before the sampling ends.) Now I go and make a jump. Assume I survive. The probability of me having a dmal in my next 25000 jumps remains as you calculated. The probability of me having a dmal by jump number 25000 is now (24999/25000) ^ 24999. If I go and make another jump, the power becomes 24998, et cetera. Now, the probability of me surviving my next jump is 24999/25000. When I make this jump, the probability of me surviving a second jump remains 24999/25000. However, the probability of someone else being me is now (24999/25000) ^ 2. So the probability of someone with 24999 jumps to survive the next is still 24999/25000, but the probability of picking a random skydiver and having them survive to the same jump numbers is (24999/25000) ^ 25000. I hope it's clearer now. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

It's my belief that you, as the person with more experience, have a responsibility to not get pissed off at stupid questions and speeches, but to correct. Someone tells you hook turns are dangerous? Agree with him and explain how you have tonnes of experience and can do them within a reasonable safety margin, something they can't do yet. Someone calls you crazy for doing CRW? Try to tell them some of your experiences at least, if it's worth it. That's my .02 anyway. I do the same with whuffos that say "skydiving is crazy!" Often they get interested enough to at least come and have a look. There's also a personal anecdote I have that I feel would be interesting in this thread. When I bought my 160 Tri, I went through a downsizing process before jumping it, just like I learned on this board. I was jumping a 215 F111 canopy when an experienced jumper I respect told me that I would be fine jumping my 160, it would behave similarly because it's ZP. Now, the Tri is a CRW canopy, and it really doesn't have that much flare, at least that's what I feel after comparing it to the Safire2 and talking to people at the DZs around here. It's definitely not like the F111 canopies that you simply stab all the way down and they stop dead in their tracks. Suffice to say I crashed and got real dirty on that first jump with it, and many subsequent jumps. Now I've flown a 149 Safire2. The people who watched me all said that my control of it was great, even people who constantly criticize me about my flight on the Triathlon. I'm still short of funds for it, so, since I still haven't bought it, people still give me advice. All too often I hear that I should go with a 139. Now, I weigh much more than I look, so this advice is often based on their perceived weight, not my actual weight. If I did not have this webpage, I would not know that I need to inform them of my real weight. I would have just listened and bought a 139. My wingloading on it would be almost 1.45. I do not feel ready for this, and I'm kind of attached to the bones in my legs, if you know what I mean. Through this webpage I learned how to filter good advice from bad advice. The experienced people here are quick to pounce on the bad advice, so newbies learn to recognize it. And, as with everything, expertise shines through. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.

Either something is wrong with the coin, or you're very very special. -- Toggle Whippin' Yahoo Skydiving is easy. All you have to do is relax while plummetting at 120 mph from 10,000' with nothing but some nylon and webbing to save you.