mrshutter45

The criminal records I have are CORRECT! What Ckret posted on the thread is NOT CORRECT. I had obtained thing the FBI did NOT know I had - prior to the destruction of said records. I had family record the FBI did NOT even bother to get. I am not a smoke jumper but I have researched the SUBJECT for 18 yrs - have YOU? The assimilation I do NOT have a problem with - I do have a problem with YOU claiming false information about FACTS of the crime - such as what TINA said or didn't say. Have YOU interviewed Tina to see exactly what she was referring to when she said ANKLE SHOES - you can bet your last cent that she was NOT referring to Loafers...She knew exactly what a loafer was. It was not common knowledge among her age group to be familiar with men's shoes. The only other type of shoe that comes to the ankle is the one with the zipper and the lace up ones. This was discussed in lenght in this thread and in book and other article - NO one knows how ankle shoes suddenly became loafers! As for my spending 18 yrs on the research - it is what I had to do as NO ONE else was going to do it. This thread would NOT have existed had it NOT BEEN for my SEARCH you call WASTED! There would NOT have been a simulation - had I not kept this thing going. There would NOT have been proof the FBI screwed up had it not been for my acquiring RECORDS the FBI claimed and discounted. NONE of what this thread has done was done by me - but it provided the means I needed to find individuals who were interested in the crime and wanted to explore it. Well, we have explored it and played with theories and ideas and this continues on and on. There have been those who strive to keep the facts open and in front and to remind those who make false claims that this or that was said - such as the shoes. If the FACTS become so buried then NO one will EVER solve the crime. Remember the internet sometimes creates more problems than it solves. Ckret asked you years ago why your records don't match what is on file. who do I believe, you or the FBI? Orange1: 2008 I can't remember exactly where it was to go back and look - but my reading of the shoes description was loafer-type shoes that extended to the ankles. why would you go thru talking with Tina and never send Duane's picture? I don't have any proof of you speaking with Tina about the shoes, I'm reading loafer/shoes that fit to the ankle. the FBI has not changed it to boots. you say a lot, but prove very little. "There would NOT have been a simulation - had I not kept this thing going." what in the world does that mean? Tina's description: brown ankle length pebble grain shoes. nothing about a zipper or a loafer.... Ckret 2007: Mucklow spent hours with him and described his shoes in detail (something a woman might notice) even down to the grain of the leather. She was certain to state they were slip on's. There is nothing in the investigation that points to Mucklow not being reliable in her statement so I give it weight. Of course that is different than actual fact but I do believe Cooper had slip ons. Slip-ons are typically low, lace-less shoes. The style most commonly seen, known as a loafer or slippers in American culture, has a moccasin construction. First appearing in the mid-1930s from Norway, Aurlandskoen (Aurland Shoe), they began as casual shoes, but have increased in popularity to the point of being worn in America with city lounge suits. They are worn in many situations in a wide variety of colours and designs, often featuring tassels on the front, or metal decorations (the 'Gucci' loafer). doesn't most of the zipper type boots go above the ankle? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Jo, exactly what are your qualifications? you are not an investigator, you don't even know if your records are correct. stop worrying about me and start worrying about the prison records you have! you are not a smoke jumper either, nor a historian, so stop contradicting yourself! why does my "assimulation" bother you so much? it has nothing to do with you. you want to play a game? lets chase a bunch a false leads for 18 years, that's one hell of a game and waste of a large part of your life! you got nothing dear....... some say ankle loafers, if you are talking about the zipper jobs, those are boots, don't recall them changing from loafer/shoes to boots.... orange1...2008...I can't remember exactly where it was to go back and look - but my reading of the shoes description was loafer-type shoes that extended to the ankles. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

I don't need a lesson from you, but thanks anyway. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Quote Duane wasn't a smoke jumper and neither are you! how about, was there ever any smoke jumpers with loafer and a watch???? actually, if I was a smoke jumper, I would of worn my suit and walked up to the counter with a pair of skis and a cap "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Point of Order: I *think* Mucklow only saw him tying lines around the money bag, and another around his waist. I don't recall anything about Mucklow actually seeing him secure the money to his chest. If what I said there is true, then this could mean Cooper was planning on jumping with the money secured somewhat like the picture I have attached. I still wonder if Cooper might have just pulled the ripcord at the end of the stairs. One reason: No reserve chute. However, without a reserve...this could also mean Cooper DID tie the money to his chest. Who knows? The point here is I don't believe Mucklow saw him do that. well, first of all, I was talking about the fact of Cooper tying the money to himself, if this was true, then the lower chest area would be the best way. it's entirely possible he tethered the line. smokejumpers seem to put the pouch just underneath the reserve, it's the only logical place, other than a tether. either way, I don't believe it proves a smokejumpers move... you are probably correct about Tina only seeing him tying something around his waist/chest...I think he had almost 80 feet of line? 79 and change if not mistaken....I think all of the smokejumpers I have seen have a reserve chute. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

You came to the thread LATE on. Do you know how Smokejumpers carried their packages? Check out this photo - a MAGAZINE Duane Weber left in a safe deposit box. A box unknown to me when he died in 1995. I didn't know what it meant at that time - and what a crazy thing to put in a safe deposit box not opened until 1990 - RIGHT after his little trip to Omaha to retrieve his bounty from the safe Deposit box he had there under the name of John C. Collins. WHY it was so necessary he risked obtaining that new license under that name in 1990. When I found out about Jefferson and that Duane was an excon! I have seen many pictures of smokejumpers, I think they are over qualified for this. nothing really matches what a smokejumper would do. he was seen tieing the money around his chest, I believe this is the only logical way to do it. how positive are you that Duane was in Jefferson? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

377 would a trained smoke jumper do this jump wearing only a suit and overcoat? they were pretty tough with the protective gear, why go from full protection to none? I don't know if a smoke jumper would qualify in this?? don't know.....seems once you put the chutes on, front and back, if he did. the only logical place would be to the chest area with the moneybag..... "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

it's relevant it if is the same type of crime. I don't think this has anything to do with recent burglaries in the area.....we don't know this, because we don't have any knowledge of how this was done. the police said this...."Nothing new on the Cossey case and I have been instructed not to discuss an [sic] motive at this time." it takes time to build a case, it's possible they already know what happened. I don't know.... wouldn't you think they would say it's the same guy doing the burglaries in the area? don't you think they would have undercover cops in the area if they believed it was the same guy doing this? murder gives the cops a little more attention and manpower over having 2 or 3 cops trying to catch the local thief for a couple weeks... "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Georger made fun of that idea. LOL no wonder he hasn't figured out Cooper yet. And by the way Shutter...how come you didn't come down on Georger for misdirection, too? Or do you play pick-and-choose on that? Big Black Bold Letters: 'Meyer Louie Says in Part'. Edited anyway. how do you know it's the same MO as Cossey's case, you don't. they would know from looking at the report. how do you know how many people were involved with Cossey's murder? we don't have any clue....... I just looked at Georger's post, it looks to me as if he was replying to me..... "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Guess you missed the part where I said they ALREADY caught him. I suggested he should be questioned. Seemed like a reasonable thought, since he hit a house less than two blocks from Cossey's place. Meyer Louie also says: ***'There's a lot more I want to say about this, but, unlike someone I know, I'm going to practice restraint and reserve comment...' Slightly hypocritical statement. You've suggested previously he could have been murdered, or set up for murder, by his ex-wife. I wouldn't call that 'restraint'. misdirected post #3,796.........you talking to Meyer or Shutter??????????????????????????? Blevins 'tangled web' never leads anywhere ... but to more tangled webs of abstraction. Who is Blevins trying to convince of what!? Does it ever matter? from what I gather, he is trying to prove it was a random burglary gone bad. he doesn't think the police can do this by themselves I guess? even though he said a while back that he wasn't going to update the case, but as you can clearly see this is not the case. I wonder how much longer before Detective Blevins puts the other unsolved Woodinville murders into this case? I think they were in 2001.....I'm kind of disappointed he hasn't updated us on those......they were nice people too... sounds like a community or area with a serious problem. I wonder if they have a private security patrol for that area? A few well placed security cameras would help too. I don't know what it's like in Washington, South Florida has camera's everywhere, private security in lot's of community's, including mine. the track record for that area isn't the best, but the police told the community they have nothing to fear, this tell me something was directed at Cossey, but let's see what they come up with...we have zero clues about the crime, so speculation can spin out of control..if they thought the person/persons was still in the area, the police would have alerted the community of the possibility of another strike, not just a common burglary... "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Guess you missed the part where I said they ALREADY caught him. I suggested he should be questioned. Seemed like a reasonable thought, since he hit a house less than two blocks from Cossey's place. Meyer Louie also says: ***'There's a lot more I want to say about this, but, unlike someone I know, I'm going to practice restraint and reserve comment...' Slightly hypocritical statement. You've suggested previously he could have been murdered, or set up for murder, by his ex-wife. I wouldn't call that 'restraint'. misdirected post #3,796.........you talking to Meyer or Shutter??????????????????????????? Blevins 'tangled web' never leads anywhere ... but to more tangled webs of abstraction. Who is Blevins trying to convince of what!? Does it ever matter? from what I gather, he is trying to prove it was a random burglary gone bad. he doesn't think the police can do this by themselves I guess? even though he said a while back that he wasn't going to update the case, but as you can clearly see this is not the case. I wonder how much longer before Detective Blevins puts the other unsolved Woodinville murders into this case? I think they were in 2001.....I'm kind of disappointed he hasn't updated us on those......they were nice people too... "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Guess you missed the part where I said they ALREADY caught him. I suggested he should be questioned. Seemed like a reasonable thought, since he hit a house less than two blocks from Cossey's place. Meyer Louie also says: ***'There's a lot more I want to say about this, but, unlike someone I know, I'm going to practice restraint and reserve comment...' Slightly hypocritical statement. You've suggested previously he could have been murdered, or set up for murder, by his ex-wife. I wouldn't call that 'restraint'. misdirected post #3,796.........you talking to Meyer or Shutter??????????????????????????? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

I would agree with your statement if the crime was not a typical random crime. if in fact it was targeted towards Cossey, I could see the Police not wanting to update every other day........ South Florida is full of crime, I'll hear about a murder on television and won't hear anything further for months, or even see an update..very common down here.... "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

it all makes sense, the guy was a"Cooper nut" and had been laying low. he stole a motorcycle (probably killed the owner) went back to his favorite spot because he was hungry, luck was once again in his favor, he noticed someone new moving in, went thru his things and munched his food and had a drink, then was seen leaving on a motorcycle. I would check with the local police and see if any motorcycles have been stolen in the area. this is our guy! who else would commit and capitol crime weeks before and return to the area and steal food. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

why don'y you contact Clancy Crossroader who has known Cossey for 30 years, let them know all of your theories.... "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

I'm going to say this and then I'm done with you. when you hang out in Casino's and lots of your friends know you have available cash it can send out bad signals. Casino's are full of scammers. word can get around to bad elements quick! the odds are high of a Burglar killing, even higher for him to return to the same area. you don't have any pattern to look at, how many other burglaries have ended up in murder in this area? is the MO the same as the others? you don't know that either. you are farting in the wind trying to compare Cossey's murder with a common Burglary. yes I know they said it was a burglary, but this hasn't changed anything from day one, because you don't know why Cossey was killed. do you know if they killed him in the house, or the garage, were they waiting on his return, did they force him to his house? did they wait for him to shut off the alarm? where they in the house already? was Cossey drinking at the Casino and someone gave him a ride in his car home and tried to take his winnings? I can keep going until I hit the right one???? we don't know. I'm sure there is a very good reason why they are not talking right now. if it was a burglar and it's his first time killing someone, I doubt he would return. that's how I see it Officer Blevins.....no further comment about this from me....... "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Robert, you fail to see key points in this matter. the police told the people of Woodinville something about no danger. now we have clues into Cossey's background showing he had large sums of money at hand. IMO, this has nothing to do with the current crimes in the area, it's pointing to a personal issue with Cossey. if you lived on that street you would have everyone in a panic. will you ever take your own advice and stop updating?? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Robert, being "blown off course " does not mean miles off course, do you think a plane just fly's straight as an arrow? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

"Another thing they were worried about Tina being in the cabin when he fully extended the door - something wrong with the sequence. Did they tell him what to do over the interphone? Or did he figure it out all by himself? " lots of things happened before they took off, here is another part of the transcript involving Tina, about a half hour prior to take off the time didn't show on my photo.....6:59 was the time "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Clearly something wrong with this: She physically showed him how to open the door - so what did she do? Did She GO BACK to the Cabin? Maybe it has been a few yrs since I reviewed the story as told to Tosaw....one of few interviews ever done with Tina. Another thing they were worried about Tina being in the cabin when he fully extended the door - something wrong with the sequence. Did they tell him what to do over the interphone? Or did he figure it out all by himself? Funny you mention this, I was reading about the stairs again today. does anyone know if the back door to the stairs were open or closed? according to the diagram I seen, the stairs must be opened before the door? could Cooper have had problems with this, or does this procedure only work on the ground? I will find the site and put the link on it here... see photo "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

I believe I showed this the other day, but will repost it. 7:41 Stewardess Muclow allowed to go to cockpit. 7:42 HJ advised (by inter-phone) that he was having difficulty getting the steps down. 7:43, this would be around McChord AFB. according to the transcript, it's about 7 minutes into the flight. this is why people think is was going to jump early, this didn't happen around the time they think he jumped.... "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

Jo, the rear door was opened moments after take off.... watch is jewelry/not jewelry....doesn't matter, nobody seen a watch.... "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

who in the world pays a house cleaner $300 for a day? Cost estimates: In a larger metropolitan area, for a medium-sized apartment or house, plan on paying at least $100 for cleaning twice a month. In less populated cities or towns, for an average-sized house (2500 square feet), around $75 is a typical fee. For a large national chain, monthly cleaning service in a three-bedroom, two-bathroom home, runs around $175 per cleaning. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

: I WAS SAYING, IN YOUR QUOTE ABOVE, THAT THE PLACARD AND MONEY FOUND AT TINA BAR WERE DEFINITELY SIGNIFICANT IN DETERMINING THE FLIGHT PATH OF THE HIJACKED AIRLINER. In case you don't remember, Hominid was saying that they were not significant. I fully understand that you are claiming the money was planted at Tina Bar by Duane. I assume that you are still claiming that the flight path was EAST of Portland and that the placard blew UPWIND to the location where it was found. Robert99 At the point below were they found the Placard there was a directional change in the plane just below that. If the Aft Stair was down or partially down - the winds could have caught it and the placard it would have ended ed up where it was found. It was past that point Cooper jumped...just a little further East and South of that. My map have been TAKEN or I lost them...so I am doing this from memory! I will make a correction later if I find I am wrong. exactly what direction did the plane change at this point? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

I'm looking into the SAGE radar further than I have before.. The Sage radar had some 50,000 vacuum tubes...... Vacuum tubes didn't have a very long life. With all those tubes in the computer (I Don't remember how many), the mean time to failure was a few minutes. Solution: Marginal testing where voltages would be systematically lowered and tubes that were on the verge of failing would be pushed to fail during testing. Diagnostic marginal testing software automated the process and used the computer to pinpoint its own failures. skipping ahead here..... The Last of the SAGE Techs I arrived at McChord AFB in Tacoma, WA, in January of 1983, after finishing tech school at Keesler AFB in Biloxi, MS. At Keesler, the systems we trained on seemed a bit behind the times, including the BUIC (BackUp Interceptor Control), based on the Burroughs D825. I figured though, that once I reached my permanent duty assignment, I'd get to work on some more modern equipment. When I received my assignment, I was quite distressed to discover that I'd be working on the AN/FSQ-7 and its 50,000 vacuum tubes, installed in 1958! McChords' Q7 was nearing the end of its service life, and I found myself in the last group of technicians to be trained and qualified on the Q7. Things weren't as bad as I anticipated, though, and I was eventually selected for one of the four remaining maintenance slots on the new system, the AN/FYQ-93 (ROCC). I spent 8 months working on the Q7, before heading for Tyndall AFB in Panama City, FL for training on the new system. all of this can be found on the link provided, including pics of the McChord Sage radar.... http://www.smecc.org/sage_a_n_fsq-7.htm http://ripsaw.cac.psu.edu/~mloewen/Oldtech/SAGE/ "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI