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Everything posted by Hooknswoop
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I meant that 99% of rigs have pillow handles for the cutaway handle and it doesn't seem to be a problem. There isn't a movement to replace pillow cutaway handles with a hard handle. No one seems to mind. I have listened to people (at the DZ) talk about how they can't get a good grip on a pillow, they want to be able to hook their thumb in the hande, etc. when I point to the pillow on their cutaway handle and ask them how they plan on pulling that pillow, they say, "Oh, that's different, I can pull that one." I don't follow their logic. If someone doesn't feel comfortable w/ a pillow for a reserve handle, cool, you shoul be comfortable w/ your gear, but I don't see a hard handle as better than a soft pillow (for me) or that a hard handle is a bad gear choice for that matter. As w/ most things in skydiving, it is a trade off and the best course of action is to arm yourself with knowledge and make an informed decision that is best for you. Hook
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>The cutaway handle can be far harder to pull than the reserve handle. So the "I > want to get a solid grip on my reserve handle" theory doesn't hold water. "Well, no. If a cutaway handle is hard to pull, the solution is to make it easier to pull - not to make the reserve handle just as hard to pull. That's going backwards, not forwards. One good solution is the one used on Strong tandem rigs. There's a pocket behind the cutaway handle to allow you to get your fingers inside the handle before pulling it. It greatly increases your ability to grip it." My point was if a pillow handle works for a cutaway handle, why do you need a better grip on the reserve handle which is easier to pull? I don't think grip on a pillow has been a factor in hard pulls. I don't think I have ever heard a story where someone experienced a hard pull and couldn't get a good enough grip on a pillow handle. >"I want two different handles so I don't pull them in the wrong order". I hope a > skydiver can know their left from their right. "Well, you can hope, but experience has shown that even pilots of twin-engine planes have problems with left and right - and they get more training than skydivers do. One such error (among other things) killed several skydivers at Perris ten years ago. I think it's important to have a tactile difference between the handles. Even aircraft controls are designed this way (flap handle looks like a flap, gear handle looks like a wheel etc so you can tell them apart by touch.) As an example - if you have a spinning mal, and your harness rides up so high you can't even see your handles, and finally you grab a soft pad - which one is it? Will the cutaway handle always be on the left in a spinning mal?" With aircraft, the enginge controls (on twins/multi) are nect to each other. On rigs, the handles should stay on their respective sides. Right hand to cutaway and left to reserve handle. It is easier than aircraft controls, where you are matching up instruments to the correct engine to the correct control lever. I have heard the story of the harness getting shifted around on Rick Horn and he couldn't reach one of his handles. He did still know which handle he had and which one he didn't. I think pre-mature deploymens outnumber severly shifted harnesses. "It is quite possible to have two handles that feel different but are both pad-style. It's not hard. Have one be larger, or smaller, or more padded." I agree. >The "If I am injured I want to be able to hook the reserve handle w/ my thumb". >Ok, but how are you going to hook your thumb in your cutaway handle? "A friend of mine once saved her life because she managed to do just that after a freefall collision knocked her out. She didn't need to cut away because there was no main out. In most cases freefall collisions happen in freefall, so having an easy to pull reserve is a plus even without an easy to pull cutaway." That has got to be very rare, concious enough to decide to pull reserve instead of main and pull a hard handle but not concious enough to pull a pillow. >If a pillow is good enough for the cutaway handle (which is probably going to > harder to pull than the reserve handle), why is it a bad idea for the reserve >handle? I haven't heard a sensible argument against pillow reserve handles yet. "I don't think it makes sense to want to make either handle "harder to pull" than the other. Consider the results of an accidental pull of either handle at 100 feet under a canopy, or a hard pull of either handle in freefall at 1000 feet. Looking at those two cases, you would actually _want_ the cutaway handle to be hard to pull and the reserve to be easy. My point was if the cutaway handle is harder to pull then the reserve handle and a pillow works for the cutaway handle, then a pillow will defiantely work for a reserve handle because it is easier to pull. "Of course, It goes without saying that both should be secure." Of course :-) Hook
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"Why you would want a soft ripcord handle is a concept that I have not grasped in 25 years of skydiving." Snag resistance and stays attached to the harness better that a metal D-ring. Hook
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OK, So I was driving out to the DZ thinking about PC, stows, and openings. What if tighter stows slow the jumper down, giving softer openings? The pilot chute pulls on one side of the bag, and your weight pulls on the other, so the tighter the stows, the more the force of the pilot chute slows down the jumper. So with really tight stows and a big pilot chute, the openings should be really soft. With a small pilot chute and not as tight stows, not much force is apllied to the jumper to slow them down for deployment. Of course the pilot chute is pulling on the risers throught the d-bag, stows and lines, standing the jumper up. Would the jumpers speed increase? OK I am confused. Too many variables I do think snatch force is based on fall rate and canopy/slider size more than anything else. The initial opening force on my VX-60 w/ a very small slider and canopy, is noticably less than on my Safire 189 w/ a big canopy and a huge slider. This is a cool thread. It has really got me thinking. Hook
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"I think that in the case im injured (arms), i would be able to pull my reserve handle with either my left and right arm if i have a handle. A soft reserve handle would be much harder to pull with your right arm. So if right arm is out of action, I probably wont be able to pull my main, and then i dont need the cutaway pillow anyway. If left arm is out, i can access all 3 handles easily in whatever order I want depending on equipment. Both arms out....well...its either use your teeth or AAD then..." Each of has to decide, what is more likely?, a pre-mature reserve deployment from snagging a reserve handle or injuring your left arm/hand in free fall and being unable to pull a reserve pillow handle with your right hand. As with most things in skydiving, it is a trade-off and no perfect answer. How many reserve handles have I seen/heard snagged versus how many people I've seen/heard going in because they injured their left arm/hand and couldn't pull a reserve pillow. For me it is clear winner (several snags:zero fatalitys from left hand/arm injuries unable to pull reserve pillow), and I can pull my reserve pillow with my right hand. If pillows are so bad why are they on 99% of the rigs out there? Hook
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"I think someone will land a wingsuit and walk away uninjured in less than 6 years." "Wanna put any money on that?" Oh ye of little faith. :-) Hook
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So then why don't people constantly go in w/ main-reserve entanglements after firing their reserves into their mains because their cutaway handle was folded under? Again, if the pillow is such a bad idea, why use them as a handle for the cutaway system? Hook
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Bear- that is how the FX/VX/Velocity are built, except they have two non-load bearing ribs per cell, not one like the Onyx. I still dis-agree that canopy cells are counted by the number of top-skin seams, irregardless of the bottom skin seams or the number of non-load bearing ribs per cell. One non-load bearing rib per cell=standard design and one cell, two non-load bearing ribs per cell=tri-cell like in the FX/VX/Velocity. I looked at the Onyx and I call it a cross-braced standard designed cells. Hook
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How fast do motorcycle racers crash at and walk away? A better suit, a motorcycle helmet and leathers.....................I think someone will land a wingsuit and walk away uninjured in less than 6 years. How many people would have believed a wing suit and a canopy could dock 6 years ago? Hook
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Bear- That is the biggest point that people that are against pillows for reserve handles give me blanks looks over when I bring it up. It is commonly accepted to have a pillow for a cutaway handle. The cutaway handle can be far harder to pull than the reserve handle. So the "I want to get a solid grip on my reserve handle" theory doesn't hold water. "I want two different handles so I don't pull them in the wrong order". I hope a skydiver can know their left from their right. Also, again the cutaway handle has to potential to be harder to pull than the reserve handle. The "If I am injured I want to be able to hook the reserve handle w/ my thumb". Ok, but how are you going to hook your thumb in your cutaway handle? If a pillow is good enough for the cutaway handle (which is probably going to harder to pull than the reserve handle), why is it a bad idea for the reserve handle? I haven't heard a sensible argument against pillow reserve handles yet. Hook
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2000+ jumps on tube stows, no line dump, no bag locks, no problems. I have to replace a broken tube stow about once every 100 jumps. Saves a lot of time packing. If line dump was such a big problem, it would happen to reserves all the time. It doesn't. People say that tube tows cause bag locks (don't break and hold the line too tight) and they say that tube stows cause line dump (don't hold the lines at all, too loose.) Which is it? They can't be both. As long as the locking stows hold (which doesn't take all that much) you won't have line dump, regardless of what the rest of the lines do. If the locking stows are 4 1/2 inches apart, and you make 1 1/2 inch locking stows, you have 6 inches of line outside the stows and 4 1/2 inches of line between the locking stows. With more line outside the stows, the lines wouldn't fall out of the stows, regardless of how loose they are. I don't recommend loose stows, but I also don't believe that line dump happens nearly as often as is claimed. Hook
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A first jump student under a Stilletto loaded at 1.3:1 is a recipe for disaster. I disagree that an elliptical is more likely to spin w/ Spectra then HMA. I recently chopped a Stilletto 97 that was spinning, and the links were even. So line type wouldn't have mattered a bit. Spectra is slippery and you can harness shift w/ line twists and the lines will slide across each other to stop a spin. Safire's and Sabre2's, even Omega's and Spectres would make good student canopies (I have used Sabres as student canopies), if the student is trained correctly (a few tandems w/ intensive canopy control instruction under the tandems). The canopy needs to be able to sink after a high flare and not injure the student, Stilettos are not a good choice for this. Also, after an un-even flare, the canopy shouldn't drop them on their face. As for backing up in high winds, don't take student up in high winds. a first jump student under an elliptical loaded at 1.3:1 in high winds? Definately not a good idea. Hook
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Try front risering your Stiletto w/o holding onto the toggles. Of course try this w/ enough altitude to get your toggles back (2000+) & w/ no traffic around. Then try a front riser turn w/ the toggles in your hands. If the riser pressure is higher w/ the toggles in your hands, then your steering lines are too short. Most canopies I see people doing front riser tunrs under have too short of steering lines. After lengething them, they comment on how much lighter the front risers are, how much longer the recovery arc is and how much faster the canopy is. Hook
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For wingloading, just stand on a scale all geared up. The weight of the main is included in the wing loading calculation, it has to support it's own weight too. Same thing for aircraft, the weight of the aircraft includes the wings. Hook
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I suspected the risers specs weren't up to RW's specs. I will check them and post the results. The soft housings have plenty of slack in them, don't make any hard turns and are fairly short. Previous cutaways on this set-up were from non-spinning, non-malfunctioning canopies. Hook
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Normal dive after cutting away, deployed the main, a Safire 189. No video. Hook
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I was just playing. Figured I would go up and stall the snot out of the stiletto and maybe some stall turns, just to see what happens. The Stiletto was in the chest mount and was deployed first. Also, after cutting away I payed careful attention to how long it took me to get stable to pull the main. It took about 200-300 feet before I was belly-to-earth. Hook
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I exited at 7,000 ft for an intentional cutaway. I had a Stiletto 97 as the cutaway canopy (at about a 2:1 wing loading). I deployed immediately out the door (for video) and watched the bag spin around twice before the canopy began to deploy. It deployed into two line twists and we were off to the races. It was spinning fast w/ me on my back. I went to even the links to stop the spin and they were even (I am going to check and make sure the steering lines are the same length). I thrashed about a bit as my legs starting going numb, trying anything I could do, just to see if I could get out of the mess. Well nothing worked and looking down to check altitude wasn't working all that well because the ground was pretty blury. So it was time to leave. The cutaway system is a loop of cable just above the chest strap. There is about 10 inches of soft housing, floating free, going to each three-ring. Cutaway forces have been very low on previous cutaways on this system. The excess cable was allowed to float free, it was not in the back of the riser (which does have inserts). Well I pull on the loop, nothing. I grab the loop w/ both hands and pull hard. It came out slow enough I could watch the ends of the yellow cables on their way to the white loops on the three rings. Most (90%+) of the tension had to be from the white loops on the cables. I am going to look at the risers hard and see how close to RW's specs they are. Hook
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What Was Your Canopy Downsizing Progression?
Hooknswoop replied to rapper4mpi's topic in The Bonfire
If someone really wants to downsize, they very often will ask for advice until someone says "yes". Sometimes people take "no" as a personal insult to their canopy piloting abilities. "What do you mean, I am not good enough to handle a________". I think handing out canopy advice is similar to talking down students on the radio, if everything goes right, you had a good student, if anything goes wrong, you had a poor instructor. (Put 1-99 standing up in the pea-pit and you're a hero, put # 100 on the hangar and you're a zero) If you manage to convince someone that really wants to downsize that they shouldn't (because they really shouldn't) you will never truly know if you saved them from injury/death and receive zero credit for a good deed. If someone you advised not to downsize, downsizes anyway and isn't injured/killed, well then you were wrong (or at least perceived that way). If you advise against the downsize and they get hurt/killed, nobody will walk up to you and tell you were right, and if you stand up and say "I told you so>" as they carry them off in the meatwagon, you're a heartless jerk. Experienced jumpers/instructors, and high speed canopy pilots that take a stand and tell someone "no" are un-sung heroes. I can understand why one of these people that take a stand and try to help can get upset at how they treated for trying to help and don't take jokes about how they try to help others very well. I am very selective as to who I will give canopy advice to. First criteria I look for is that they are open minded and are actually going to listen. Hook -
One instructor correcting another instructor in front of a student is un-professional. If an instructor observes another instructor teaching a new skill to a student and is teaching it in-correctly, correcting the instructor in front of the student, even if the instructor was teaching incorrectly, will undermine the students confidence in their instructor. Students, wether they realize it or not, rely upon the instructors confidence to help keep their stress level under control. If the student watches their instructor get corrected, they will wonder what else they have been taught that is wrong and if their instructor is capable of teaching. One instructor dis-agreeing with another instructor in front of a student will leave the student wondering “they dis-agree. Only one of them can be correct. Therefore one of them is wrong. Which one? Maybe both.” I would never correct an instructor in front of their student. I am curious if this is the trend in skydiving instructors. Thoughts and opinions, and note if you are an instructor, if you would. Hook
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Under tension, cutting through risers should be very easy w/ a razor-blade type hook knife. From altitude I think I coould cut 4 reserve risers and deploy my main by no lower than 8,000 ft. Hook
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"i should have mentioned that the reserve would be on a RSL system, so there is no messing with clearing 2 handles." This one of the downsides of RSL's. Some people's attitudes and/or training regarding their function and use is wrong. I believe this resoning is the cause or at lest a factor in people going in w/ a PC in tow and only pulling the cutaway handle. Education is the answer. Hook
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Right, no one is perfect and when you do make a mistake, the difference between "call 911" and "that wasn't very smart" is how much of a safety margin you have. Big safety margin and a small mistake, and you're laughing about it over a beer at the end of the day, small safety margin and small mistake and your friends are raising a toast to your quick recovery at the end of the day. Hook
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Interesting question. I immediately tried to rate myself and that led to questions. Could I be safer than I am? Yes. So I guess that means I can't give myself a 10. Am I unsafe? No. So I am not a 1. What could I do to get a safety rating of 10? I could jump a large canopy. I could jump only on clear days, with little wind. I could wear an AAD and only do solos. I could wear a visual and audible altimeter. I could wear a helmet on every jump. I could only do hop and pops from 5,000 ft. I could do these things, but then I would be sacraficing the enjoyment I get out of skydiving for safety. So I guess I accept more risk for more enjoyment. I don't consider myself un-safe. If I was un-safe, the odds are I would have been injured by now. Without sacraficing the enjoyment I get out of skydiving, I don't see any way to increase my level of safety. I have learned as much as I can along the way and continue to do so. Does that make me a 10? Probably not. I suppose I have to give myself a 9, because there has to something I can do to increase my level of safety without taking any of the fun out of skydiving. Hook
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Determine if it is my main or reserve over the tail. If it is my main, cutaway, skydive, track, and pull my reserve. If it my reserve over the tail, take out my hook knife, cut the risers, skydive, track, pull my main. Hook