PLFXpert

By "others" she means me, and what I said was in response to her (incorrect) assumptions. Good Lord---I can't take this anymore. Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

No, but most eventually in their lives go to a friend's house with a pool or lake in the backyard. Lakes, especially drop off sometimes very quickly--one might think they're OK in knee-deep water and suddenly find themselves where they can't touch.. Hell, it happened to my Oma in her condo pool and I had to help her (she, too, never learned to swim).

I suppose I could clarify I was speaking of my own country here folks, noting the conversation did not turn to "third world countries" until later. I have to also add, however, that one doesn't need a pool or recreation to learn to swim. There are tribes in third world countries everywhere that know how to swim and learned w/out the luxury of a pool or a licensed instructor. Though I DO find it much more understandable in those circumstances. Again, noting most of these comment references were before the subject of third world countries came in to play. Perhaps I forgot for a moment we have many different countries represented on dz.com and in the skydiving community. Most often, I think however it is safe to assume when one speaks of laws and requirements and this or that, likely there are referring to their own country. Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

The difference, Rosa, is I made NO assumptions about you, where you have or have not been and what you do or do not know (specifcally about thrid world countries). First of all, one does NOT have to go to a third world country to understand, know about and be very knowledgable about life there. Environmentally speaking, another article I once wrote was my disagreement with large American companies setting up shop in third world countries and polluting their environment freely b/c they did not have the EPA on their backs, nor the safety regulations, so they also put the workers there in danger. Of course, others will argue "at least they provided jobs". I'm getting off track, but the reason I said what I said (and stand by it) is this is not the first time you've made an assumption about me. I believe I have NOT given you the same disrespect. I have a lot of loves and enjoy a lot of things and care about a lot of things, and fortunately have had the opportunity to do a lot of things. I sometimes may come off a lot as "me too" or "yes, I've done that, too" and I try not to be too annoying in that respect. Assumptions---well they just irritate me when they come from people I actually put some level of value in. I don't know you, but we've certainly read enough of each other's posts on dz.com and I certainly know you're a good egg. Ordinarily I don't care too much about assumptions being made. BELIEVE ME, I've learned to deal with that in various industries.

I understand much better where you are coming from now. All I can say is I got nothin' but love for ya, however I stand by what I've said here.

In my hurriedness I forgot to add this is a very wonderful & generous thing your family did.

I'm certain I categorized it as "neglect" I am done here. Dinner time. And I refuse to explain myself to way-off inferrences. Sorry, lisamarie. Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

I'm not sure you understand that the two are not mutually exclusive. You can insist a child do something (for their own good) and STILL make it a very positive experience and use positive reinforcement. I don't recall ever using anything but when I taught. I'm not understanding while you're feeling the need to discount my opinions on the subject, but I'm certainly not surprised. Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

I'm not sure how/why you would make that assumption but this is the internet. I've traveled a LOT and all over South America, if that means something to you or this discussion. I don't find this shocking (or even to be new information to me) at all. I don't think I mentioned a pool having much to do with it. Of course I understand locations/availability but I assure you there are ways. That is all.

I'm glad grandma had a good eye Grandma's usually DO have an additional eye on each side and two more in the back by their age Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

This brings back memories--I did so many things at the same time in college but my steady income was swim instructing. I remember six or seven parents in class and one or two babies crying. One of the crying babies' parent would always hesitate to "scoop" their child under water to them if they were crying. "But his mouth is open. I'm so scared he'll inhale the water." And I kindly and humorously (I ALWAYS add humor in class, it's the best medicine) explain if they fall in the pool, likely too their mouth will be open Instinctively, they WILL close their mouths. It became amusing to the parent after the first few times (B/c I always taught with the 1, 2 3 and then scoop so after a few times, by "3" the crying child would suddenly stop and get ready) . And then there's the parents who did everything I asked them, but with this terrified look on their face and I would have to remind them to smile and be excited---b/c children pick up on their parents reactions and if they see mom or dad deathly afriaid when their child is swimming on their own or when they've scooped them underwater, then the child will pick up on that and relate that activity to being frightful as well. It was SO CUTE to see the obviously terrified mom or dad forcing a smile and a "Good boy" and then wiping their eyes for them. I've always said when I "retire" I'll go back to teaching swimming for free. I just really, really loved it Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

Kudos (from me, for what it's worth) to that ENTIRE post There are LOTS of things the "Terrible Twos" don't like doing that parents NEED to make them do for their own good, whether it's swimming or making sure the child has proper nutrition. I personally just don't understand how people can think it's necessary to make their children do some things for their own good, and yet will NOT make them learn to swim even if they don't want to. It's SOOOOOOO important. I live and grew up in Florida. I can not tell you how many news stories of parents leaving children with nannys who turn their backs for two seconds, or whatever the case might be. Welcome to another PLFXpert soap box Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

In terms of neglect, I'd say not "throwing their kids in the water" falls in that category among many other things. I am VERY strongly opinionated about child issues. While I choose not to have any of my own, trust that I know a lot and have researched a lot on these matters. I've even written articles (in college) that some of my material was used for scholarly journals. Having said that, I can't argue that it's still a matter of opinion. But, you know mine Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

I love ya, but I have to adamantly disagree---tooooo many statistics prove otherwise. I'd recommend one year, but you can start as early as 6 months. When I taught swimming the infant class was my favorite to teach b/c it was the only one that involved the parents too in the water, each holding their child. I can tell ya'll I had more than a hundred infants between 1-2 years old swimming 5 feet from the wall back to the wall, then grabbing it and pulling themselves up and "crabwalking" to the stairs to get out.

At the risk of offending some: I believe it should be a REQUIREMENT to learn how to swim. 75% of the world is WATER. Just b/c you are not on/near it now doesn't mean you won't be in the future. I get SO angry at parents that are too scared to put their kids in the water to learn to swim. It should NOT be optional. Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

Not often, but definitely. Mostly when I just HAD to have something right away and then a month later see it on sale for half the price If only I were a patient person---and if only they didn't put the newer, cooler shit DIRECTLY next to the sale rack Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

I might be a nut job, but I've never been really serious about it Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

Well, I can tell you the chick on the right of "MiniCrue" is a struggling actress. Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

Interesting...when I was little I'd pretend I was "training" in my pool and swim laps with my legs crossed (as if bound together), then with my arms crossed, then both, and also practice swimming as far as I could there and back underwater w/out coming up. I had dive rings, too (but never retrieved them with my teeth). I think Mr. Lanoue has been spying on me! I'm suing for the rights Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

Please refrain from jokes, this is serious I'm wondering what time the west coasters see American Idol??? We watch it live at 8 p.m. EST. So, if they watch it live, it's only 5 p.m.??? NOBODY would be home to see it in time So, do they not get to watch it live? If they watch it later, then how does the voting work as far as you're only supposed to get 2 hours after the show. And also if they watch it later, how do they not get a spoiler as to the outcome before they see it??? This has been plaguing me. And now that I've typed it all out I realize I could have/should have checked idol.com and the answers would probably be there, but I'm very busy. So help me out here, folks Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

Bless you, hunny. Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

Exactly. The problem I have is the women who want equal rights in the sense that they also want to work some jobs, this or that, but they want special qualification requirements b/c they are female. I think that's crap! I believe in equal opportunity. For example in your job, it sounds as if you meet their qualifactions which is great. I can tell you many women, however, probably can NOT lift what you can (or maybe they can, I don't know, since the exact weight was not specified, but the way I understood the men's reaction to your lifting sounded as if it was quite heavy). Men & women are biologically different. It is proven men have more capacity/capability to build muscle than women. They are certain things that men are able to do naturally more efficiently b/c of BIOLOGICAL reaons. I'm getting way off track here........but I think sometimes women confuse women's lib with all that other junk and that bothers me PS. I'm not ingoring the rest of the responses---I've got to run for the rest of the day. Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

Oh my gosh! In Orlando, just off I-4 is The Merita Bread Company and EVERY O-towner knows you roll down your windows when you pass by. IT SMELLS SOOOOOOO GOOOD! Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

Often one will not know which intention the action stems from. My hunny knows I get upset when I hear stories or see a scene in a movie when an animal gets hurt. If he knows it's coming, he will tell me to look away and cover my ears. I don't think he does this out of a need to "protect" me, but rather out of respect that he knows I'll be grateful for the warning. On the other hand, he always checks my oil & tire pressure before I drive the 10-hour round trip to my corporate office. I think he DOES do this out of a feeling that he wants to protect me. I don't think he does it b/c he thinks I'm not capable or thinks I'm less than an equal--he does it b/c I mean something to him and he wants to make sure my vehicle is safe. He also checks my rig before exit on EVERY jump. He knows I checked it and he checks it again. Again, not b/c I'm less than equal---it's out of love. I don't think I could ever fault anyone for feeling a natural need to do such things even if the reason is "protection". But, I completely understand what you mean if you're referring to the extreme of some men needing to "shield" women from things and thinking that women are not capable of taking care of themselves. Thank goodness I have not come across many of those men in my time.