maadmax

---Atheists don't have to worry about suffering the embarassment of getting Raptured straight off the toilet. I wish you guys would address the more relevant questions instead of rehashing the same old arguments]. That would be nice, but I can't see how a discussion about Biblical teaching would be possible with people who don't know God. But, go ahead, give it a shot. --Also. The Bible says God "rested" on the 7th day of creation. So how exactly did he rest? Is there some giant couch or LazyBoy floating around somewhere? What exactly does God do on his day off? Does he go bowling with planets, or what? I have always looked at that as a object lesson to illustrate the point that at least once per week ( if not more often) we should reflect on the merit of our actions. ...

For the overwhelming majority of the worlds believers, geography and the beliefs of their parents dictates what flavor of religion they will believe in. Remember, we are all born Atheist innocent. True for religion, not true for those who develop a spiritual relationship with God. I have no use for religion. It has to be one of the worst things our species has produced.

Which God? ALL of the several thousand that have been worshiped through the ages and then forgotten, or do you have a particular one in mind? When you understand why you dismiss all of the thousands of other Gods, then you will know why I dismiss yours. ( author unknown) I don't dismiss anything, I listen to the one that meets the needs of my soul.

o your argument is since lots of people believe and pass it on to their children. It must be true. So by that logic all religions are right. So believing in the Hindu gods is just as valid as believing in Christianity. Nope, not my argument, and we both know your statement has no validity. God only reveals Himself by way of humility and faith. Once contact has been made the fulfillment God gives to the individual's concept of reality justifies the faith. ...

That's a very, very good analogy for atheism. Sure you can speculate an omnipotent being that not only created everything we can see, touch or otherwise detect but created it in a way that leaves no trace of its own existence, but functionally, is there a chance that happened? Jeeez no. Lol. The fact that God meets the needs of those who know Him, generation after generation, is proof enough for the necessity and existence of God. How He presents Himself other than through His Word is unimportant. Knowing how He creates & maintains the universe does not negate His presence.

The freedom of choice is hardly a good thing. Choose me or burn in hell? - It's like an abusive husband saying "Do exactly what I tell you and I won't beat you... but if you try leave me or disobey me, I'll hurt you". And I ain't even mad. This is just the way God appears when one isn't deluded into thinking he is some special, caring, loving God. Good description of life with out God. Why would He need to beat us? We seem to do an excellent job on our own with out His help. God's way is a life of liberty, "Know the Truth, and the Truth will set you free." Man's way is religion and is terribly oppressive. ...

Greatest of ease and joy? What would be the meaning behind "Footprints in the sand", then? God is always at hand, the footprints are the times He is there walking along with the person suffering, waiting for them to wake up and cast their burdens on to Him and observe how He can solve problems. It is our choice to suffer or to experience the joy God has in store for us.

My, what a morbid view point. You could muddle through life struggling like you described, or you could live in and through the power of God and sail through life with the greatest of ease and joy. "All things work together for good to those who love God, and are called according to His purpose." ...

Ron, Jesus' most important revelation is that we need no "savior". We need no priests. We don't need Jesus. We are free to have a direct and personal relationship with god who is us and our fellows wholly and individually. Sounds like you need to retake religion 101. You seem to have Buddhism confused with Christianity. Christ removed the sin barrier between us and God. ...

Says who? There are lots of theories, consistent with the Big Bang, that postulate the existance of matter and energy prior to the Big Bang. Says you, if you are a scientist. Entropy ensures a beginning and an end. ...

Again, any double-blind attempt at verification of your claims reveals them to be complete bullshit, coming and going. Got you covered. I am proof of what I say, as are many other believers. I was doubly blind. But through the Grace of God now I can see and live life more abundantly. If you knew anything you would know that spiritual phenomenon is validated by the fruit it produces not by some experiment. ...

That's "gnash." For someone to berate me regarding my ignorance of Tooth Fairy protocol or of the Laws of the Leprechauns does not really carry a lot of weight. I doubt your invisible friend needs you to rise to his defense, since he is either possessed of Great Magick Magic or completely imaginary. I do not claim knowledge; I am calling bullshit - big difference. You are claiming knowledge - with the caveat that anything I dispute has to be taken on "faith" because it fails verification by any objective, double-blind measure. I, however, place no stock in make-believe. I place stock in results. God gave us Wisdom to shape our personal realities around His love. The results are truly transforming and liberating. The alternative is to reject Gods Wisdom and create a reality based on our lusts with woeful consequences. ...

This set of concepts is truly neolithic. A more compelling argument for the case that religion is symptomatic of emotional illness would be hard to make. You know nothing. What you think you know about God is vacuously inadequate. If you had the slightest inkling of how ignorant you have become you would hide you face and nash your teeth. Just another example of how arrogant and spiritually blind we can become. TRULY PATHETIC! ...

Correct, and some do understand when the Bible is literal and when it is not. When the information it presents on a subject is intentionally vague and when it is not.

But, what if He did die on the cross and rose again with a message of hope and deliverance? What if by mere faith we could share the love of God and be transformed by it? What if our sins could be washed away and we could become one with God, free of guilt and remorse? What if we could know a peace that passes understanding? What if all of the events in our lives had meaning and worked together for our utmost good?

Why do you consider the Truth that we are god as stated in the Bible and taught by the Master Jesus the Christ to be "self deification"? Why would that necessarily lead to destruction? Are you alluding to destruction of your own impossible to defend belief system? Our only claim to equality with God is only through faith in Christ and the indwelling of His Word in our minds. If we claim it apart from Christ we are quilty of the same self deification Lucifer originated. If you are saying we are gods through Christ then I would agree you have a point. If you are saying we are gods like Christ then you may find yourself sharing Lucifer future spacial dimensions. ...

Yes, but since we were created in God's image So how come we can't create a universe in 6 days? How come we're imperfect? Of course, we can create God in our own image You could be correct but that is so dead end, there is nothing to explore and the riches of the spiritual life are left unclaimed. God created us in His image , spiritually(volition, self awareness, emotion, eternal existence, etc). Thankfully He only gave us a limited amount of power to manipulate our surroundings. In our weakness we find our greatest strengths. ...

Yes, but since we were created in God's image that included free will. We used our free will to separate ourselves form God and become gods As a drop of sea water seperated from the sea will always retain the properties of the sea and easily can be reincorporated, We as gods being seperated from the godhead still retain those God properties . We used our free will to incarnate in to human form as did the Master Jesus the Christ. Neither He or We acted in an affront to God ,nor could we, as we are God Himself. Peace, Jim B I like your lofty thoughts, but I am afraid your way leads to self deification and destruction. Many have preceded you on that path. PS - go SCUBA diving sometime, you will see that there are layers of sea water that remain separate and don't mix, due to differences in salinity and temperature. ...

So then you believe as I that we are all gods' children and as brothers and sisters of Jesus the Christ are also every bit as much God as Him? Peace, Jim B. Yes, but since we were created in God's image that included free will. We used our free will to separate ourselves form God and become gods, deciding good and evil, apart from Him. Our sin is a barrier between us and God. We can personally remove that barrier by opening our consciousness to Christ through faith, humbly accepting His healing and regeneration. ...

So.., about all those hundreds of thousands of humans that King David killed who may not have been totally spiritualy clean according to Judeo standards and whom he deprived of a chance to "*turn their lives around*, what has become of their souls? Does your God hold them in less esteem than the aggressor of those bloody massacres? Peace, Jim B I am sure they will receive mercy like all of the rest of Gods children. ...

Oh!!! You didn't answer my question about King David. You know the guy who wrote the psalms you were quoting earlier. Was he a nice guy like you and I, or did he have a dark side? How many of his fellow humans did he kill? You make a good observation. David was an evil despicable man with a desperately wicked mind. Which, by the way, so are we all. Even the white washed atheists who do so many good works. The message of the Bible is that God can transform our minds with His Word and make us like Himself. David underwent such a transformation and became " a man after God's own heart". David was chosen by God after his spiritual regeneration to convey spiritual wisdom to many generations. Unless of course you are already god and require no such wisdom. ...

[email] Lol, nope your wrong again. I have no "pain" toward religion. I simply no longer believe in fairy tales and Bronze age mythology. Why is this so hard for you to understand? Typical Christian thinks there is some deep resentment causing me to lash out against religion blah blah blah. Like I am angry at god or something. God doesnt exist so how can I be angry with him. I am as angry at god as I am angry at Santa Clause, Frosty the Snowman and Leprechans. They all have equal status with god as far as i am concerned. All fictional characters. It's really just this simple: I DO NOT BELIEVE IN BULLSHIT FAIRY TALES. THE BIBLE IS FICTION. Why is that so hard for christians to comprehend that someone can truely and simply NOT BELIEVE? I will never be "one with god" because there is no god to be one with. Get it? _______________________________________ I was also speaking in the past tense about your religious experiences. You have obviously found peace with that phase of your life. Since your anger does not lie with God, what is the object of your anger? People who happen to believe in something that you use to believe in. ...

I don't live in fear anymore. I no longer have to fear eternal suffering in hell or eternal boredom in heaven. My life now has more meaning because this life is ALL I HAVE. Make the most of it! The thought of living on for all eternity kind of makes this life pretty pointless. The Church profits from fear. It's their cash cow. The more people that help spread that fear the more people that get infected and become slaves to it and the church profits even more. Suffering for all eternity in hell was an absolute genius marketing ploy I have to admit. Fill them full of fear then sell them hope. CHA-CHING$$$$$$ I love knowing there is no "plan" for me. My destiny is mine to make. I decide my fate. That is so empowering I can't describe. I am no longer a slave to fear since I unbrainwashed myself from religion. I am FREE! The truth = There is no god. The Bible is fiction. I can now say... Fuck God! Fuck Jesus, Fuck the bible! Fuck all religions! .. I can say that without fear. It's kind of fun. You should try it. :p I can prove God doesn't exist: GOD, if you exist please strike me dead this instant! I DARE YOU! I DOUBLE DOG DARE YOU! I can see you have experienced a lot of pain and disillusionment in regards to religion. I can understand and compliment you for standing on your own and forming your own opinions. Hopefully you will pass through this cloud and be able to understand your spiritual nature as it was meant to be, one with God. In the mean time, I agree, honesty to yourself and your feelings is your best bet. ...

Thats easy to answer. .... blah...blah...blah.. What's sad is when you die you will never know that you wasted so much of your time and effort while alive for nothing. I feel sorry for you. I really do mean that. Such a waste. I wish I could help you see the light. Free your mind. Take the blindfold off, but I can't. Religion has done it's job and has fully deluded you to the point of no return. I just hope you don't infect to many other people before you go. I have my popcorn and my recliner so cut loose. What am I missing, What experiences have you had that I haven't, What is Truth, What new things does a free mind see, and since our destiny is oblivion and a source of protein for several generations of maggots, what does it matter what infectious thoughts one may entertain when its all over?

The entertainment value of applied fallacy by the self proclaimed intellectually challenged is endless. "A man sees in others what he knows of himself." Socrates You imagine others as being univerasally subject to your limitations. This is most certainly not the case. Ha funny, No imagination necessary after reading these threads. Yes I agree, the entertainment value of some posters is rich, keep up the good work.