steveorino
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Everything posted by steveorino
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I never said I want to shut up anyone. I said I want to counter what they say; challenge their ideas; and twart their growth as a group. your putting words in my mouth. I'd thank you not to. Pardon me, I misunderstood when you said, "I beleive they should not be allowed to try and peddle their views in a forceful way on others." Not allowing them to "peddle their views" doesn't equal shutting them up? I guess I misunderstood what that means. steveOrino
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You might call me a "red-letter" Christian. I'll defend what JC taught but I will not defend the immoral acts of people in the OT. But since you brought it up, please show me where the Bible or God calls Lot moral or righteous? JC taught about protecting children in general and not doing harm. It is my opinion that would include pedophylia. Perhaps you think pedophylia doesn't harm children, I do. steveOrino
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yep, there are lots of bikers in the church I pastor. Are they gay? Why do you want to know? steveOrino
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How many non religious people you know who're against gay marriage? nearly every biker I meet. steveOrino
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my response here is a bit tougher to verbalize. However, I would argue that you are aware of topics that tend to align with religious vs. non-religous viewpoints. One of these would be gay-marriage and I would argue that you would agree that the religous vote carries much weight on this topic. yes? I think many christians and non christians have strong feelings about gay marriage. You only want to shut up those who speak because of religous convictions. That is a pity IMHO. steveOrino
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That is why I am not talking about "our country", but "our society". Is there any country, which treats fetus as a person? If you would like to argue abortion that is fine, but I was trying to stick to the issue of people in the USA have the right to lobby for what they believe in. steveOrino
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this issue transcends religion as well. What issue doesn't transcend religion? steveOrino
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You said you're Christian. Yes, I follow JC's teachings steveOrino
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It wasn't that long ago people in our country didn't think negroes were whole persons either. Moral people worked to right that wrong. steveOrino
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I don't think anybody at theROCKchurch has made a comment on what goes on in anybodies' bedroom. Do you know something I don't know? steveOrino
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I know tons of non christians who do not like gays of any sort (remember I ride a Harley and frequent places Harley guys go) and I know plenty of Christians who support gay rights. You just can seem to accept we, as Americans in the USA, have the right of free speech. Pity steveOrino
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Yes, and herin lies the rub. We have been too tolerant of the religious and their propaganda for too long. Instead of being vocal, the majority live and let live. But the religious groups are becoming more vocal and active and thus the non religious need to become more vocal and active. this is my position. No problem with me. I don't suscribe to much of what the religous right proposes, but I support their right to have their voice heard, and to lobby for any position they deem worthy of their efforts. I believe Neo-Nazis are disgusting and I vehemently disagree with their ideaology, but I think they have the right to lobby their position. steveOrino
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this stand on its own, outside religion, as a undersirable behavior for society in general. you think only religious people want this to not exist? Do you think only religous people want to abolish abortion? steveOrino
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Again.. this is why it is important to oppose the propagation of religion. When their numbers get too large they start getting power they shouldn't have; such as the ability to effect policy for those not in their religion. Take Kansas.. look at the turmoil there with the school boards and evolution. They want to just drop it from the public schools and replace it with creationism. I mean, am I missing something here? Hostilities are brewing and I see the trend to be increasing. You have every right to speak your voice against religion and the agenda of ANY political group, religous or not. steveOrino
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And here is a problem. Your faith, and "moral standard" are based on beliefs, not on facts - so far I failed to see any evidence from you. So when you try to lobby against anything based on your religion, you are actually forcing anyone, who do not belong to your religion, act according to your faith. And this is completely unacceptable, that's what freedom of religion was for. If you believe something is immoral - don't do it, nobody is forcing you to do so. But don't force others to live according to your beliefs - it is not your business what we do with our bodies. Remember that a lot of people do not care about Heaven or Hell. That is probably the main reason a lot of people do not tolerate Christianity. You feel the same way about pedophilia?? steveOrino
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It "jives" with typical Jewish beliefs at the time and is consistent with other teachings of JC steveOrino
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Are you sure? Could you provide the exact quote? Because I can provide you quotes from the Bible where people were sleeping with their daughters. For example, Lot had sex with two his daughters (GE 19:30 - 19:38), but Peter (2Peter 2:7 - 2:9) still says that Lot was "that righteous man". Bill quoted OT and I was referring to Paul's letter in the NT -- 1 Cor 6th chapter I hardly doubt the case where Lot's daughters thought they would never marry and decided to get their father drunk so they could sleep with him in order to bare children is an avocation for pedophylia. You're really reaching for that point, eh? One thing that sets the bible apart from many "religous" writings is that is shows the characters as they are, warts and all. steveOrino
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Again I say, people act out of conscience whether that is to feed the poor, bring civil rights to the oppressed, or change laws. Christians have every right to lobby against what they deem as an immoral act. You have every right to lobby for what you believe in as well. steveOrino
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WITNESSED A POSSIBLE SHOOTING (Fayetteville, NC| near ft bragg)
steveorino replied to leroydb's topic in The Bonfire
Back in the day it was called Fayette Nam steveOrino -
The bible does condemen male prostitution which at the time involved young boys. steveOrino
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I have some of the same issues. Isa 14 is a prophecy against the Babylonian King; Ez 28 is a prophecy against the King of Tyre. Many theologians are not happy with Satan not having a well laid out origin, so they take these prophecies against earthly kings and enemies of Judah and apply it to him. They also take the writings of Milton and Dante and create a whole sphere of hell not addressed in the Bible. steveOrino
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Apart from the bible I don't think God has too many of his ideas written down any where. However, it is my belief ALL truth is God's truth, regardless who wrote it down. So since I'm not well versed on all ancient "scriptures" and other "message from God" I'll have to stick to what I know. If you want to see what Paul wrote about it you can find it in the 6th chapter of 1 Corinthians, I believe. steveOrino
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steveOrino
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You said "In fact from my memory(please correct me if am wrong) the bible condemms home sexual sex acts but not sex acts for minors, implying that god prefers paedophilia to homsexuality." And I said: "The bible (Paul) speaks against both " You can argue the bible is not inpired by God if you want but that only muddles your point. As far as pedophyllia, it is refrenced in the 1st letter to the church in Corinth where Paul speaks against homosexuality and male prostitution. Most male prostitutes at that time in Corinth were boys used by Greek men. steveOrino
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He did teach that. His parable about the Good Samaritan showed us that we are all neighbors. The lines we use to divide us are not divine (from a Christian point of view) regardless of what some Christians teach or believe Personally, I don't think a good teacher claims divinity and the ability to forgive sins. Was he just messing with the paralytic when he said he forgave his sins? That is precisley why Jews don't worhsip JC. If they are right and Christians are wrong, we're screwed. I'm hedging my bet on what Christ said. Everyone, including you and me, live with the choices we make. steveOrino