Widgeon

You are completely missing the point of a competition circuit restricted to 9 cell canopies only. Some people just don't want to fly crossbraced canopies or aren't ready for them yet and would like to compete against others in a similar situation. To say that "oh well, you just gotta cowboy up and get your ass kicked while you learn" is a bunch of shit. Just because you had to, doesn't mean thats the way its got to be from now on. Swooping is constantly evolving. Records are being broken regularly. Hook turns weren't even allowed at most dropzones not that long ago. There are plenty of good pilots flying noncrossbraced designs that would be up for this who will be the one's to watch and learn from. If learning is what this is all about, than there it is. If safety is the concern, and that competitive swooping isn't for ametuers is the problem you have with this sort of division, then keep the present restrictions on jump numbers in place and have some kind of qualifying round as a preseason or exhibition meet. Why should canopy manufacturers need to provide demos for this sort of event????? Why would you want to compete with an unfamiliar wing? If time and resources aren't available to every canopy pilot out there to train and practice for the 9 cell events, than don't enter: simple. This class won't be for everyone and neither is the current CPC. Every other sport I can think of has a series of divisions for more even and fair competition. Auto racing, something you should be familiar with, has more classes for drag racing than I can think of. Pure street, Prostock, Pro Modified, Nitro/Funny Car, Top Fuel, etc. You don't see Richard Petty coming to Daytona International Speedway with his wife's Tahoe to drive against the $500,000 Dupont Chevrolet driven by Jeff Gordon. The piont to something like this will be to promote a more evenly competitive field where the piloting skills will be the difference. That doesn't mean I think I can beat you or Jim Slaton or Hans or Jay if I get my crossfire and you guys have to fly Spectres, it means we get to see how good the best swoopers on a 9 cell canopy are. There is obviously some interest in this and I just would really like to see it happen. Others have made mention that there will be these types of divisions in their regions next year, I would just not like to see it shot down here in Florida. I'm competing next year regardless. I don't plan on any space on the podium for me any time soon. I wouldn't feel like I 'beat' anyone if I placed and the only reason I won is because there were alot of verticals that day. When I get there, I'll be winning by the numbers, not because the best fucked up.

I meant that only to imply how much fun it would be to get to compete with the best. No pipe dreams of winning here, just the chance to learn from the experience and see the results. I'd be really fascinated to see how much is possible with this type of equipment piloted by the likes of Jay or any of the factory team pilots.

So who would organize it in the Florida region???

This is the kind of competition regs I have been wishing for. I can learn only so much just from running the course on a routine basis out here by myself, but an actual competition with these types of regs would be an awesome opportunity for lesser experienced pilots flying less radical wings to get in and mix it up with the best in their area. Just imagine if some pros took the time to attend even one of these events... It'd be awesome, and when I say awesome, I mean totally SWEET to go a couple rounds against Jay on a sabre2 @ 1.7

Yeah, me too....

I've gotten no PM, let him post...

There's alot more going on beneath the surface on the competition velocity that factory pilots and other somewhat 'sponsored' athletes have access to, that is a given. I would venture to guess the same holds true for other manufacturers as well but no matter. Does it give them an unfair advantage? I would say no... Apparently there's alot out there you can do when you feel your canopy or current rig is lacking in one aspect or another. I've been experimenting with different riser lengths and it made an immense difference in my situation. Chances are that someone else has had the same problem you've had and not everyone had the same solution fix their problem. Different linesets, equipment choices, wingloadings, are all variables that can drastically effect your performance under canopy. Even different turning techniques can produce the results you're after. Not to knock any canopy design, but there is just not one canopy that is the best out there for everyone. It is and always will be the pilot and not the canopy. Just stick with what you've got if you like it and talk to an experienced coach about your problem and I think you'll find your problem will be fixable. But hey, I've only got 400 jumps, what the fuck do I know?

Quotedo you know what the power band feels like? -yes do you know what happens if you go to far into it? -no not far enough? -weak swoop? and to far to the extreme of catostophic? -I guess you'd be testing the limits of your lineset and other components of your canopy and rig. but it is all constant adjustments and trimming, there is no "set" time for anything. -Every swoop is different. Wind speed, direction, etc. Makes sense. you find what works and try to recreate it. that is the hard part. -No shit.

What is the biggest noticeble difference you see trimming with rears using longer risers? I would imagine the effect would take more time to develope being that the recovery arc is now longer.(????) I mean you would have to start getting on rears higher to get the same plane out, right?? Wouldn't looser leg straps do the same thing as maybe an inch or two longer risers?

How do you reach one inch higher???

I know this to be true but how much of a difference are we talking about? I mean significant enough to justify buying new risers or not?

I have heard you say several times that you don't turn with your risers at all........all harness. Why would you go back? Is it the riser pressure difference on the velocity vs the VX or what? Not fucking with you, just curious.

You should contact Beezy Shaw at HiPer. He has spent alot of time in the past with both of these canopies and could probably give you a very good comparison of the two. His contact info is on the HiPer website.

That's why I said it would probably change the set up alot. You don't have to be anywhere near the ground to try this out, and in fact you shouldn't until you have a grip on any new technique. I also agree that there is no substitute for coaching, if you can get it...

I own a safire1 129(made in Spain) and a safire1 134(made by Presicion). They are almost the same exact size. 5 square feet isn't much but the answer I was given by tech support at Icarus was that each of these two canopies was measured using different methods than they are used to measure the current safire2(which is the widely accepted method that PIA uses for almost everyone else's shit) ANYWAY---------- The reason your stiletto packs up smaller than the safire is the planforms are completely different and the profile of your stiletto is probably shorter than that of the safire.......=less bulk. Profile is not used to calculate square footage of a canopy but it can significantly effect pack volume. My container is made for stiletto120(Micron V306) and my safire1 129 fit fine. It's not the same calibre canopy as a stiletto so to compare flight characteristics and equating them to size is not really a fair comparison. Personally, I learned alot on my safire and I never had any of the problems that were associated with them. It's a great wingsuit canopy and I still like to swoop it every now and then. It'll be in my seconed rig for a long time until I go crossbraced if I even go crossbraced at all and then my crossfire will take a backseat. To answer the original posted question, I think it will be hard to find two identically sized safire1 and safire2 canopies, but if you did, I think the recovery arc felt a bit longer on the safire1 129 than either the safire2 119 or 129s I jumped. Just what I think, if you don't like it, sell it. If you like a safire2 when you jump it, buy it. Have fun and don't worry about it.

Tried turning it out of a little brakes? A lot of brakes? Any canopy gets easier to hold the fronts down if you unload them some first. It might change the way you have to set up a lot, but it does make the canopy easier to dive steeper, conversly with a slow slow carve with just a little riser and alot of harness, the speed will build up so much that getting the risers down an extra INCH is almost impossible.....but isn't that what we're after anyway? my .02, you can get anything to dive. Be safe.

OK, so what do I get?????????? 1)I need two cameras due to the requirements at my DZ for video. The other videographers use the second one as another source to fade/pan back and forth from while mixing down the final product. I have a PC109 I will shoot with and will pick up a PC5/9/120/TRV or something for my B source. 2) TV 3)DVD writer and VCR 4)Couple of CD players or an MP3 player for music 5)Editing Deck and titler.....I don't know what to get here or where to find one. I see alot of Panasonic editing consoles and would prefer anything else, I have issues with the manufacturer and would rather not own ANYTHING made by them if at all possible. 6)About another two hours in the tunnel. Am I missing anything and where do I get an editing console?

Don't worry, I packed your parachute!!!! See you tomorrow and have fun!

BEER........

You can have Good Stuff back and if I can't find the PD video, I'll buy you the new one.

Brandi and I might make it up there.

So that as many people can participate as possible, lets try to start a thread as early as we can for those who are about to travel to Rantoul and might not be around their computer to find out about it. This Saturday, August 6, get on your DZ's sunset load and lets have a worldwide tracking dive to celebrate the lives of our friends. Get on the phone, send your emails out, PMs, whatever and get in the sky. Lets start the roll call!!!! Widgeon

To help organize a memorial jump, check the thread started in 'events and places to jump'.....I hope everyone will have the chance to be on it.

So who is going to organize a tracking dive or some sort of memorial jump for them? The sooner the better. I'll take care of it here in Titusville. I'd like to see it Nationwide for that bunch. Thanks for jumps we had, and ones yet to come guys...

DCs